Customer Reviews

Charismatic Chaos

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I was faced with a spiritual crisis in my life a decade ago. I was raised Lutheran, but had got involved with Pentecostals/Charismatics in my teens. For years I attended meetings and watched as people danced, shouted, laughed and other forms of activity all taken place by way of the Holy Spirit, or so they said. I despised them for it as I never saw this reality in my own life. In truth, I really did not want to start shouting and dancing around the room. I longed for the quietness and reverance of my old Lutheran Church where I had learned to love God, but I was now told that they were not led by the Holy Spirit. I discarded the notion and continued attending Pentecostal meetings never really enjoying them, but figuring this is the way we were supposed to worship. I walked in confusion as people seemed to get messages from God anywhere and everywhere, even sitting on the toliet. I never experienced this. All I ever came away with was guilt and misery. I came to the point of wondering if God was even there. I picked this book up and found that there were good reasons that I was not enjoying the Pentecostal experience. Reading Charismatic Chaos was liberating for me. I was fianally able to bid farewell to the whole Charismatic thing without guilt and go back to the Church I grew up in where I re-discovered my love for God. I would not condemn Charismatics and neither does MacArthur. I do view the Charismatic movement as being based on extreme emotional experiences, which may or may not be from God. If you are Charismatic and confused this book may help. God Bless.

I am a charismatic, and so naturally I disagree with MacArthur's views about whether the miraculous gifts have ceased. I also agree with those reviewers who point out that what John (for whom I have a great deal of respect; in fact he is one of my favourite Bible teachers) does is to highlight only the abuses he finds.

Unfortunately, there is far too much of this abuse going on in charismatic circles, and if charismatics themselves do not publicly acknowledge the current state of the movement, then it is left to anti-charismatics like John MacArthur to do it for them, and that means an awful lot of unfairness and bias along with it. The sad state of affairs is, though, that even when charismatic leaders do speak out on these things, they almost invariably (in my experience) tone the whole thing down as if it really is just a minor problem, or paint a picture of a charismatic movement of which just the fringe has gone overboard, and try and disassociate themselves, and the circles in which they move, from the problem.

The reality is that it is not just something on the fringes of charismatic movement: I am inclined to agree with John that what we are witnessing is indeed 'Charismatic Chaos'. It is hard to be a charismatic/Pentecostal in a day when being such is increasingly defined by whether you jump on the latest bandwagon, be it the 'endtimes revival' bandwagon, the 'Toronto blessing' bandwagon, or the 'apostles and prophets' bandwagon.

MacArthur does indeed cite abuses, but much of the time he is highlighting preachers and practices that are at the very heart of modern charismaticism. If charismatics continue to dodge the issue, people like John MacArthur will make themselves heard.

Before deciding whether to believe what you have been taught, I strongly urge everyone to research BOTH sides of this issue. Read this book, and also read another book such as 'Healing The Sick' by T.L. Osborn, before making any decision of how you want to believe. It's the best book I've found on the subject and I doubt very much if Mr. MacArthur has read it.

John MacArthur is very correct on many things. I appreciate the work he has done on this subject. However, he is also very much incorrect on several issues in the Charismatic movement. For example, he says there is nothing in Scripture supporting how some people 'fall down' under the power of God. In my own research I have found 21 scriptures so far supporting that.

Some Charismatics are indeed way out there! Mr. MacArthur admits that he does mention mostly about the extremists in the movement. I agree with him about these types.

Mr. MacArthur teaches that miracles were a "temporary sign gift for the authenticating of the Scriptures as the Word of God", but never do I find anything in the Scriptures that support that belief.

I'm also wondering how Mr. MacArthur can teach that such scriptures like Eph 6:11-18, 1Pet 5:7-9, and James 4:7 show US how to deal with the devil, but says that other scriptures that commission us to preach the gospel, heal the sick, and cast out demons like Mark 16:15-20 are not for us, but were only for the disciples. To me this passage in Mark is a perfect example of what WE are supposed to do. And if you preach the gospel, you must also heal the sick and cast out demons because it is all there in one breath in the Great Commission! They all go together! Mr. MacArthur wants to pick and choose which scriptures he thinks are for us today and which are not. (2 Tim. 3:16 "ALL Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction....")

Many Charismatics do indeed test doctrine by experience instead of the reverse, but he may not label all Charismatics as doing such. I am a Christian who believes as Mr. MacArthur does PLUS I believe that miracles are still for us today as the book 'Healing The Sick' by T.L. Osborn will thoroughly prove from Scripture. There are literally hundreds of scriptures that support this that John MacArthur did not quote at all, such as 1 Peter 2:24 and Psalm 103:3 which when checked in the original Greek mean physical healing, to be made whole.

I would like to say a word about a little girl's faith. Mr. MacArthur mocked the fact that God answered the prayers of two little twelve-year-old girls to raise their pet Chicken from the dead! Now who is he to judge the faith of a little child! With God anything is possible, and nothing is too hard for Him. (Mat. 19:26; Jer. 32:17) And I bet he doesn't even know that 'There Is Eternal Life For Animals'! This is the name of a Scripturally based book by Niki Behrikis Shanahan and is one very important book that every Christian should have!

Too many people do not take God's Word seriously. When you do this you can experience, yes experience, God's love like nothing on this earth. So please research BOTH sides before making any decision for yourself.

I was greatly distressed to read that the Vineyard churches have no doctrinal statement in MacArthur's book. Greatly surprised too, as I had a stack of Vineyard Doctrinal Statements (available since 1984) on my desk when I read MacArthur's book! Either he didn't do very much actual research or he deliberately lied. Either way, an apology and a written retraction would be the only truly Christian thing he could do. I bought the book because I was hoping that someone of MacArthur's calibre could perhaps point out some corrections that people in the Vineyard needed to hear. After carefully reading the whole book (several times), I realized that John MacArthut doesn't know much about the Vineyard, although he does offer many distortions and exaggerations. Of course, if he had taken the trouble to actually TALK to John Wimber personally, or allowed him to read an advance copy of "Charismatic Chaos" so that Wimber could clear up any misconceptions or explain himself more thoroughly, this could probably have been averted. But correcting the Vineyard was obviously not on MacArthur's mind - attacking it and spreading disinformation (and selling a lot of books) was. What a waste of a man's intellect and writing ability. P.S. I've been in the Vineyard for years, and I hold a Masters in Theology, as do MANY MANY Vineyard pastors and leaders. The people who labelled charismatics as "anti-intellectual" and "poor thinkers" need to grow up and repent of their conservative arrogance.

To me, it is not only the information that is contained between the covers of a book that make it a good "Christian" book, but it is also the manner in which the information is expressed. One of my former pastors used to have a saying - "if you are not willing to love a person, you have no right to correct that person."

When I read this book several years ago, I remember taking notes, and having found some type of criticism of someone on at least 300 pages of the text. My question was, did the author bring enough oil and bandages to annoint and wrap the wounds that he inflicted with the Sword of the Spirit? Without the Love of God, do we have the right to wield the Sword of God?

While I do not agree with the author on every point, he does do a good job in bringing to our attention the abuses of spiritual gifts that can occur in the church and our need for better discernment. What I think may be needed is not just information on how to judge our brothers, but also infomation on how to understand our brothers. MacArthur can be an excellent writer, but this is not one of his best works.

Although I like John MacArthur, this book had issues. Although I agree many Charasmatics don't check against what the Bible says - MacArthur seems to beleive that there is not evidence of "Charasmatic signs and wonders" after the apostles. Look again:

Signs and Wonders Throughout Church History

Justin Martyr - (Year 100 AD - 165 AD)
In Dialogue with Trypho ( a learned Jew) Justin states "For the prophetical gifts remain with us, even to the present time. And hence you ought to understand [the gifts] formerly of your nation has been transferred to us"

Irenaeus (140 AD-203 AD)
"(they drive out devils, so those that have been cleansed from evil spirits do join themselves to the Church. Others have foreknowledge of things to come: they see visions and utter things to come"...."Yea, as I have said, the dead have even been raised up and remain with us for many years"

Tertullian (160/170 -215/220)
In his work To Scapula he is talking of events during his time and says tell of an exorcisms... then goes on to say
"How many men of rank (to say nothing of the common people) have been delivered from devils and healed of diseases!"

Augustine (354-430)
In City of God he wrote
"It is sometimes claimed that these miracles which Christians claim no longer happen" ....to refute such a claim he then goes on to list numerous miracles he knows of: a blind man receiving his sight, a blind women being healed, people freed of demons, people healed of gout, etc.

Luther (1483-1546)
Even Luther, the father of the reformation discusses prophecy. In Luther's Works he says "If you wish to prophesy, do it in such a way that it does not go beyond faith so that your prophesying can be in harmony with the peculiar quality of your faith"

John Wesley (1703-1791)
In his Journal he writes on Wed Aug 15, 1750:
"By reflecting on an odd book which I had read this Journey, The General Delusion of Christians with Regard to Prophecy, I was fully convinced of what I had once suspected (1) That Montanists, in the second and third centuries, were scriptural Christians, (2) that the reasons that the miraculous gifts were withdrawn was not due to lack of Holiness... but due to the dry orthodox men who criticized them..."

I am an Assemblies of God pastor (Pentecostal). I believe in the baptism in the Holy Spirit as a second work of grace (Luke 3:16; Acts 1:4-5; 2:1-4). I believe in all of the gifts of the Spirit including tongues, interpretation of tongues, miracles, healings, etc. I do not believe in cessationism.

Nevertheless, I found this book to be an excellent read. Being Pentecostal, I found that I did not fully agree with Dr. MacArthur's positions on some teachings but I found myself agreeing that the Pentecostal/Charasmatic movement must return to the clear teachings of Scripture (1 Timothy 4:16; Titus 2:1). As a Pentecostal, I attended a non-Pentecostal Bible college that gave me a deep love for the Bible, a longing for more of Jesus in my life, but a devotion to clear Biblical interpretation and teachings.

This book will force you, if you are a Pentecostal, to wrestle with the Word of God and will challange you to understand, defend, and clearly teach what you believe.

This book is not a complete loss. The chapter debunking the "Health and Wealth" gospel is excellent and a real eye opener. The chapter on true holiness is also very good.

And overall, there is nothing wrong with a vigorous cessationist critique of present-day claims that the gifts of the Spirit continue to operate as in the book of Acts. The problem is that there is a mean-spiritedness and contentiousness that pervades this book and that ultimately leads MacArthur himself into absurdities.

He gleefully quotes John W. Stott to the effect that charismatics seem "keen but clueless." That is unnecessary. How would MacArthur like it if someone called him "clever but constipated"?

MacArthur seems to imagine that the ideal church is a rather tame, buttoned-down affair--a church, in short, of the sort where MacArthur himself would feel at home. Good thing he wasn't around in Chronicles when the congregation of Israel shouted aloud their acclamation of their intent to follow God. I guess we would have had a book called "Israelite Ignominy."

MacArthur is known as a Bible scholar, but he pulls some real howlers here. The one that sticks in my mind is when he reasons that tongues of angels (I Cor. 13:1) must not exist, on the grounds that "Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels" is in the subjunctive, a verb tense that denotes conditions contrary to fact. Never mind that angels use speech, which would mean they would have to have tongues, or that the subjunctive verb in that clause applies equally to "tongues of men," which must mean, by MacArthur's logic, that men don't have tongues either.

MacArthur should have just written two books. One would have been called "I Just Don't Like Charismatics," while the other would have been "Why I Believe that Modern Day Claims of Charismatic Gifts are Unscriptural." The second book might be of value; the first book would just be MacArthur venting. And that is what he does here, much of the time.

MacArthur does a wonderful job presenting issues in this book. He has done his homework as far as bible study, research, and presenting issues from all angles. I personally thank him for presenting the facts as they are. I wish I had this book many years ago when my mother, pastor, and others tried to point me in the right direction. They all tried to warn me of these things years ago when I went into Pentecostalism. However, I believe my learning "first-hand" has made me the person I am now. MacArthur's book bears witness to what I was told and what I have seen over the years in the pentecostal/charismatic movement. In closing, the teaching in this book is doctrinally-sound and a MUST for all those who want the truth from the biblical perspective. If someone is offended by what he says, it only means they need to get on their knees and pray for understanding and get in the Word more as well as do extensive research. I used to memorize verses when reading the Bible; but that is NOT the same as studying. Study involves research using dictionaries, commentaries, history, culture, etc. Again, this is an outstanding book!

Though quite unpopular among most charismatics, it is nevertheless very well researched, well written, and most importantly, well documented with Scripture. Why are so many "scared" to read it? Speaking from experience (as an ex-charismatic), too many people are afraid the book will biblically expose the truth about much of the error in the charismatic movement. If you are open minded (Acts 17:11) to a biblical challenge it will do you much good. The book is well grounded in the Word of God and is, therefore, not a waste of time, whether you agree or disagree with the author's arguments.