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7 of 7 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars Review of "Christ Minimized?"
When I read the title "Christ Minimized?" of Jon Zens response to Rob Bell's book "Love Wins" I immediately was captured again by Jon's desire to see Jesus Christ made supreme and central to the ekkelsia of God, His body. How Christ desires to be Lord, Leader, and Life among His people and not a set of teachings or practices, but real food, real water, real life. How...
Published 1 month ago by John S. Wilson III

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1.0 out of 5 stars Christ Minimized by Jon Zens - Review
With so much high acclamation about this book as well as outstanding reviews by friends and associates of the author you would expect an exemplary book or at least a thorough, though-provoking and convincing book as well as one to be reckoned with. Sadly this could not be further from the truth.

First, the various reviews and the intro by Edward Fudge take up a...
Published 10 hours ago by robert


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7 of 7 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars Review of "Christ Minimized?", January 23, 2012
This review is from: Christ Minimized: A Response to Rob Bell's LOVE WINS (Paperback)
When I read the title "Christ Minimized?" of Jon Zens response to Rob Bell's book "Love Wins" I immediately was captured again by Jon's desire to see Jesus Christ made supreme and central to the ekkelsia of God, His body. How Christ desires to be Lord, Leader, and Life among His people and not a set of teachings or practices, but real food, real water, real life. How Christ desires to live supremely and centrally in His ekklesia, His body!

In "Christ Minimized?" Jon Zens again very astutely brings out the centrality of Christ as he reflects on the thoughts from Rob's controversial book. Jon looks at what Bell writes and searches the Christ of scripture to give a more balanced view that neither those who ascribe to "eternal torment" or "universalism" wants to reconcile. Jon's approach is to see what scripture really says and lay it before the body and let the ekklesia see the reality of what was written to the ekklesias in the first century. Jon comes with a heart, like all believers past and present, that all would know our Lord, but realizing that while God so loved the world that He sent His Son, not everyone would believe in Him. What is the fate of those who do not trust in Jesus Christ? Can we accept "eternal torment" as perpetrated by the institutional church or does scripture say something different, such as "perish." I am more inclined to believe what scripture says.

As Jon points out, much of one's opinions can often be masked by the dangers of reading our current modern and traditional practices into the interpretation of the Bible. Jon has been uniquely gifted of the Lord to help the body search the scripture and allow His Spirit to interpret it for us. His previous books are key benchmarks in the plethora of false teachings that have become the tradition of the institutional church for centuries, traditions that have been accepted without question and kept His people silent and blind to the reality of Christ in them. His response to Rob Bell's book is just one more to add to the body to see what Christ really says. In "A Church Building Every ½ Mile" Jon asks God's people to question the institutional church's traditions and the "tragic shifts" that describe how far it has fallen from its organic roots in Christ. In "What's With Paul and Women?" Jon asks God's people to relook the role of women the institutional church has perpetrated and what Paul really said in his letters to the ekklesia. Just recently in "The Pastor Has No Clothes!" Jon asks God's people to question and even challenge the heresy of the clergy-laity divide, perhaps the one tradition that has so robbed Christ of His full expression in His body.

We can too often focus on only one side of what scripture says to the limitation or silence of the rest of scripture. Perhaps this is the reason we are called to search the scripture together so that Christ in us can give us better sight as to what He really wants us to know, to see a more balanced teaching in the body and the fuller expression of the life of Christ in His people. Rob's book is one more voice in the powder keg of emotion in the religious debates of history regarding eternal torment or universalism, debates that sadly have divided the body and left a trail of tears. Jon comes in though and brings out the voice of balance, the voice of insight, the voice of reality that can only be Christ in him. But Jon is not alone in this discussion as he points out numerous witnesses of those past and present who have expressed their portion of Christ Jesus, speaking the ultimate value of His incarnation, life, resurrection, ascension, and now His life in His ekkelsia. Christ is bigger than Rob Bell or any of us can imagine. In the end Jon humbly assents that "no position is airtight, and there are always a few Scriptures that seem to challenge every view..." In my own study and learning to hear Christ in me, the words Jon Zens shares are my own as well. In fact it is surprising how what I read are the same conclusions I have also come to acknowledge. Only the Spirit can do that. May the Father give us spiritual sight to see more of His Son in His body.
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2 of 2 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars Christ Minimized? -- a compassionate response, January 31, 2012
This review is from: Christ Minimized: A Response to Rob Bell's LOVE WINS (Paperback)
The first thing that struck me when reading Christ Minimized (Jon Zens' response to Rob Bell's "Love Wins") was how different Jon's tone was in his response from other comments I've read on "Love Wins". I've read harsh and hurtful responses to Rob Bell's book, and even attacks on Bell's character. But Jon's response is kind and compassionate, even though he disagrees with Bell's main points in "Love Wins".

Although this is a short book, I feel that Jon effectively addresses those points which continue to bring universalism back up for debate -- a debate that he was obviously reluctant to join and only did so at the urging of others. I also think Jon's calm and equable response will go a long way towards speaking "peace" to the waters that have been stirred up by the clamorous voices of many others.

Jon also brings up the fact that no matter what side we take in this debate, there are going to be scriptures that contradict that position. His response got me thinking about other issues that have long divided Christians -- issues that seem to fall into this same category with scripture that contradicts whatever position is taken. As a friend pointed out, before the birth and life of Jesus, there was no way to reconcile the scripture that said the Messiah would be born in Bethlehem, would be called out of Egypt and would be from Nazareth. We now understand how all of that could come to pass. I came away from Jon's book convinced that one day we will be surprised to see how ALL the scriptures on these different "issues" that have divided us are true and come together in God's perfect plan.

Christ Minimized? is definitely worth reading!
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1.0 out of 5 stars Christ Minimized by Jon Zens - Review, February 23, 2012
This review is from: Christ Minimized: A Response to Rob Bell's LOVE WINS (Paperback)
With so much high acclamation about this book as well as outstanding reviews by friends and associates of the author you would expect an exemplary book or at least a thorough, though-provoking and convincing book as well as one to be reckoned with. Sadly this could not be further from the truth.

First, the various reviews and the intro by Edward Fudge take up a significant amount of space. This 52 page booklet uses extremely big print - I guess because it so very brief. It finishes almost mid sentence and leaves one feeling it is an utterly unsatisfactory work especially when it is being promoted so highly by intelligent men.

The author, Jon Zens, wrote a far more full, convincing, thorough, biblical, satisfying and correct article in 1978 called Do the Flames Ever Stop in Hell and it's free online at[...] Sadly it seems the author (Jon Zens) has got confused, compromised and less Biblical since then! Compare this previous article to this new booklet and decide for yourself.

Although Christ Minimized? is meant as a convincing response to Rob Bell's book Love Wins. I'm afraid for those fully persuaded by Bell's Ultimate Reconciliation teaching they will not be convinced otherwise by this booklet unless they are a typically ungrounded professing Christians who gets swept about by every diverse wind of doctrine. This book will of course get a hearty Amen from those who agree with Zens - after all they need no convincing they already agree.

The real issue of this book is that it is the first public strike by the author at the biblical and evangelical teaching of the eternity of hell. For a man like Zens who has moved from a clear biblical view to an erroneous, sentimental teaching of total annihilationism this is a very poor work. He even confesses that "no position is airtight" even his own and that there are scriptures which challenge his position which he has no answer to. This is not surprising as he promotes in this book a teaching rejected by true evangelicalism in each generation from its beginning.

Less than five of the pages of this booklet deal directly with the teaching of eternal punishment held by the early apostles as well as the reformers, Puritans, the various evangelical denominations and movements of the past 500 years including the Pentecostal Movement and the greatest thinkers, preachers, revivalists, missionaries and prophets of this same time span.

To briefly summarise his strongest arguments i) he says that the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah as well as of those destroyed in the flood was not eternal. It was quick and short. Actually that was a physical judgement in time and was only a slight picture of how terrible the Lord's judgement would be in eternity. ii) He says that the literal Gehenna - the rubbish dumb outside Jerusalem's gates - which Christ used as an example, type and picture of hell consumed victims - did not perpetually burn. Again Christ used this as the best physical and local example. Neither do those fires outside Jerusalem burn today but Christ always attached the word "eternal" to both the fire and the punishment which he spoke of represended by the rubbish dump. iii) Zens believes in soul-sleep - that no-one is presently burning in hell or being punished. Actually Christ in Luke 16 speaks of the rich man suffering in hell and very conscious of it. iv) He also emphasises the word "perish" used by Christ but neglects the word "eternal" and "everlasting" used by Christ. In his mind "perish" means utter annihilationism. But the Bible is clear - eternal means eternal.

Could say much more but this is sufficient for now. Save your money, don't waste time on this book. Read his free online article instead. Men like Zens, Frank Viola and others are trying to promote the old error of annihilationism under the profession of making Christ central. This erroneous teaching is a denial of the biblical teaching of Christ on "eternal punishment." To teach that this is one of many teachings which Evangelicals have an option of deciding on what they want to believe yet remain biblical is a far cry from the teaching of the apostles. The teaching of Christ and the apostles was simple, clear and fearful. No man has a right to broaden or change such teaching.
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Christ Minimized: A Response to Rob Bell's LOVE WINS
Christ Minimized: A Response to Rob Bell's LOVE WINS by Jon H. Zens (Paperback - January 23, 2012)
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