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Most Helpful Customer Reviews
19 of 22 people found the following review helpful:
3.0 out of 5 stars
Churchquake,
By A Customer
This review is from: Churchquake: How the New Apostolic Reformation Is Shaking Up the Church As We Know It (Hardcover)
Peter Wagner is perhaps today's leading proponent of the restoration to the church of the NT office of the apostle. Churchquake can be a valuable book to introduce the reader to several examples of large local churches that are seeking to be a part of this restoration movement. However, the book fails to deliver on its promise to examine this NT model, since it contains very little biblical exposition or interpretation. Wagner's background in the church growth movement of past decades is akin to that of a sociologist, who examines human behavior -- he is not a biblical scholar and is quite loose in his use of biblical material. Often he describes a current apostolic movement or church and then declares that this model represents a biblical principle - but without any discussion of the NT itself! If read alongside other books which do attempt to examine the NT model of apostolic ministry, Churchquake could be an interesting starting point for initial study.
21 of 25 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars
The Church as an Autocracy or dispenser of Christian Love?,
By A Customer
This review is from: Churchquake: How the New Apostolic Reformation Is Shaking Up the Church As We Know It (Hardcover)
In summarising chapter one it is clear that Wagner requires the reader to accept a number of his assertions as givens without critical analysis. If the underlying premise is not accepted then the reader will have difficulty accepting the rest of the book. However there are significant points he raises which allow the reader to ask some difficult and painful questions of the church in the 21sr century.
In chapter 2 he spends some time explaining how he came to the use of the term as opposed to 60 possible names and essentially pads his book out a bit with some of the rejected definitions. Three important nuances of the term apostolic" are discussed. These include the reformation use of the term to affirm the doctrine of sola scriptura, early Pentecostal use to define the restoration of apostolic faith after 18 centuries of apostasy. The second nuance relates to the evangelical priority of these congregations. The third relates to the gift and office of apostle. The use of the word "nuance" is interesting in that its definition is that of association only. It is not a strong term but subtle. One needs to ask if Wagner is drawing a long bow here to further develop his argument that the new apostolic churches are based on the doctrine of sola scriptura, restoration of apostolic faith and the office of apostle? In chapter 3 Wagner presents factual information which is interesting and informative with the expectation that the reader will accept what he is saying as a fait accomplit. There is another view and very rarely does he allude to this such as Tony Campolo's view that denominationalism has a future. In chapter 4 he aims to have the reader accept the idea that the pastor is like a managing director or CEO with spiritual authority delegated by the Holy Spirit to the extent that Wagner's own pastor has sole discretion for the expenditure of 65% of the church budget of $5 million Read together chapter five and six suggest to me that New Apostolic Churches have the potential to become as corrupt as the Roman Catholic Church prior to the Reformation. Rather than one pope the NAC philosophy suggests having lots of "apostles" leading networks with decision making centralised with the individual apostle. In chapter seven Dr Wagner assumes that liturgical worship is inferior to spontaneous worship. In chapter 8 Wagner expounds his theory that outreach in NAC networks is focussed on four central tasks - expanding the local church, planting new churches, mercy ministries and cross cultural mission. Whilst Wagner makes some good points in chapter 8 he unfortunately is somewhat lacking in taking cultural, political and social factors into account when supporting his argument Wagner for a Church historian makes an astounding claim that `apostolic theology of lay ministry' is a fairly recent discovery of the last 25-30 years in chapter 9.He then goes on to develop this argument using sub headings such as "Every Church Member a Minister", `Reconsidering Clergy versus Laity' and "the Pastor as Coach." Chapter Ten - Money? NO PROBLEMS This of all chapters in the book probably utilises scripture the most. This may be because ultimately he can find no sociological references to support the views presented in this chapter which is what he has generally done for the first nine chapters of the book. Unfortunately his use of scripture is selective and biased and one does not have to be a theological student to see that he has clearly forgotten Jesus' references to giving being something done in secret between the giver and God. Unfortunately he presents the use of money and the way it is given in New Apostolic Churches in a way that would make most Australian Christians uncomfortable and suspicious of the motives of pastoral oversight of the offering and knowledge of how much people are giving and who is giving what. Not content to present this scenario he then goes on to suggest that it is legitimate for the big givers to get rewarded in ways that those who do not give as much may not be rewarded! He even cites a church that has a week in a resort for those who give over one million dollars. This chapter if read alone convinces me that what Wagner is presenting as an apologist for the NAC network is nothing more than an autocratic bureaucracy, which redefines the relationships of Christians in the church and uses slick marketing and commercial business principles to govern the church and presents what are blatantly unbiblical methods for raising money. One might be forgiven for wondering if Wagner's ego has overtaken his commitment to serve the church with the story on page 241 about the honorariums he was given by two churches where he spoke for a weekend. If he was to measure his worth in dollar terms then he should have openly indicated what he expected as payment at the first church rather than using the discrepancy in the amount proffered by both churches to build his case. SUMMARY Wagner identifies himself in the book as having been a member of the Congregational church for most of his life. It is not clear what theological emphasis this denomination had on his life, however it appears that he has experienced a late life crisis (conversion) where he has been either renewed or born again. If the NAC network is responsible for this new found fervour then it is not surprising that he has written a book that lacks credibility and is highly critical of "traditional" churches. I can identify with this following my own conversion from Catholicism. Following my conversion I was highly critical of the Catholic Church and could easily have written a book such as Wagner has written pointing out all the faults of the Catholic Church. His description of the New Apostolic Church Network is blinkered and uncritical whilst his view of traditional churches is fairly scathing, not recognising the positive things achieved by the church in the last 2000 years. He continually uses the Southern Baptists as exceptions to most arguments where he states that the church is in decline. Given that this denomination is the exception to his rule it is worth asking what is it that makes them different. I would suggest that the answer is self evident as everything he argues for on behalf of the NAC network can be cited as true of Southern Baptists: Baptists are still young as a denomination compared with more traditional churches; They are driven by vision and values - ie the Great Commission; The pastor leads the church (at least in USA) where when a new pastor is inducted the whole leadership resigns and allows the pastor a free hand to establish the church under his leadership; Contemporary worship is not a monopoly of the NACs.; Southern Baptists would probably have the largest number of missionaries of any denomination in the world; Outreach is still a priority and SBCs are large churches.
13 of 15 people found the following review helpful:
3.0 out of 5 stars
Amway Apostles,
By Str8outa (Ohio) - See all my reviews
This review is from: Church Quake!: The Explosive Power of the New Apostolic Reformation (Paperback)
Because this book is essentially an apologetic for self-styled mega-church leaders it is worth reading. It assumes a "reformation" posture: declare that the church is in unprecedented crisis, decide that the solution is to return to the "New Testament model", and then presume to describe what this model is.
After reading this book I learned how similar the first century church was to our 21st century MLM corporations. It really is uncanny. In light of this discovery, perhaps pastors should study real business gurus such as Peter F. Drucker or Geoffrey A. Moore. The sum of "Churchquake" can be found towards the end of the last chapter on raising money. After demonstating that larger donors should get preferencial attention from the pastor, Peter Wagner asks aloud; how does the pastor know the income level of the church members? The answer is simple. "A good pastor knows his sheep!" (pg.261) Apparently Wagners' research of church history uncovered the fact that early church elders recieved printouts every Monday listing the top donors in order to reward them with a week at a luxury resort on the Mediterrenean. This is the heart of these new "Apostles". No longer are they spiritual leaders with a mission to feed the sheep---they have become organizational leaders with a machine that fleeces sheep. (John 21;15-16). The crucial question is...do they realize it? MC
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