Customer Reviews


10 Reviews
5 star:
 (8)
4 star:    (0)
3 star:
 (1)
2 star:    (0)
1 star:
 (1)
 
 
 
 
 
Average Customer Review
Share your thoughts with other customers
Create your own review
 
 
Only search this product's reviews

The most helpful favorable review
The most helpful critical review


13 of 15 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars A symptom of the problem, not the solution
FORGIVE US OUR SPINS: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left, by Jesse Larner. FIVE STARS*****

No, this is not yet another demolition job by a petty critic of Michael Moore, exposing to horror his errors and contradictions with the aim of toting up his moral worth. Nor is it a hagiography of Moore as working-class hero.
It is...
Published on November 5, 2006 by Ron Weis

versus
3 of 3 people found the following review helpful:
3.0 out of 5 stars A troubling look at a complicated man
I was drawn to this look at Michael Moore because the author, like me, shares many of Moore's liberal/left views, yet, as the title suggests, he also is bothered by both Moore the person and Moore the filmmaker. I wanted to find out why.
Larner is persuasive in delineating some of Moore's deceptive methods. Example: Contrary to the whole implication of "Roger...
Published on March 21, 2007 by Geoff Pietsch


Most Helpful First | Newest First

13 of 15 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars A symptom of the problem, not the solution, November 5, 2006
By 
Ron Weis (New York, NY) - See all my reviews
(REAL NAME)   
This review is from: Forgive Us Our Spins: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left (Hardcover)
FORGIVE US OUR SPINS: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left, by Jesse Larner. FIVE STARS*****

No, this is not yet another demolition job by a petty critic of Michael Moore, exposing to horror his errors and contradictions with the aim of toting up his moral worth. Nor is it a hagiography of Moore as working-class hero.
It is interesting to see Jesse Larner actually defending Moore from various right-wing silliness. Larner agrees with many of Michael Moore's values, perhaps more than Moore himself, because he pays close attention to how well they are served in the changing American climate. But after much research, Larner does not find Moore to be a useful or honest advocate of these values.
Larner is a great story-teller, with a keen eye for telling events and humorously appalling details. Moving along through a hundred compelling and verified incidents, Moore's story unfolds with balance and perspective, and not a single trace of malice. Larner does not rub his hands with glee when he discovers that Moore is an American success story who keeps his place through calculation and a chillingly self-regarding coldness, and that his written and movie work is distinguished not only by playfulness, but by considerable lying and cheating. Up to now, when others have found inaccuracies and willful distortions in his work, Moore has brushed them off as right-wing vilification or says his movies are made to be only entertainment. But Moore makes serious claims for his work; he wants above all to be taken seriously, and Larner grants him his wish more fully than he himself could imagine.
One of the book's charms is that Larner indefatigably informs himself about the subject-matter of each of Moore's movies in turn. He probably knows more about the history of Flint, Michigan than Moore does... and more about how Moore picks and chooses from it. He presents a concise and convincing analysis of the GOP's ruthless theft of the Florida vote; he gives the essence of the Second Amendment and why it does not support indiscriminate gun-toting; and he travels to San Francisco to give us the story of Moore's brief and destructive term as editor of Mother Jones--and to Crawford, Texas (where Moore did not go) to find the Texas citizens who showed "Farenheit 9/11" not far from Bush's ranch, and to explore the environment in which it was received.
Larner argues that, although propaganda and demagoguery pervade the style of the right, and the major TV coverage which the rich and well-connected command, the left simply cannot afford that kind of discourse, either financially or politically. Enjoy Michael Moore's films for the pleasures they bring you, which include a look at events and personages not usually available on TV, but do not assume their absolute factuality, nor look to Moore as a democratic leader. (Moore gave his support, with angry fanfare, to Ralph Nader in 2000.) Liberals must question their leaders and look for those who answer in good faith and candor.
Anyone who has ever wondered why the Democratic Party could not hold the allegiance of a majority of Americans who agree with them on the major issues, not to mention the 9.8 out of 10 who do not share the fortunes of George Bush's major contributors, should read this book with fascination. It is, finally, a history lesson about the workings of American populism, from the point of view of a liberal-leftist who thinks the recuperation of his party is a matter of emergency, possibly of survival. And Larner even-handedly challenges conservatives to question the vicious crackpots who freely roam their side of the debate.
To follow Moore, in Larner's view, is to live in a simple-simon world of unreal simplicities, a religious world, in effect, of the saved and the damned, with a high priest whose ends justify his means. Larner is one of those who addresses himself to the problems of his time with toleration for those who disagree and attention to those who are uncertain. It is that latter group we democratic liberals must convince, not by inviting them to jump on the bandwagon, not by tricking or stampeding them, but by approaching them with respect.
For Larner, the left's connection with Moore only undermines its chances of creating a political climate of freedom, fairness and tolerance. The story he tells is gripping: once he got rolling, I could not put it down. And however I might quibble with a few of his conclusions, he makes it obvious that Moore, whatever else he may be, is a symptom of the problem we face, not its solution.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


6 of 7 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars The Emperor's New Clothes, Again, November 7, 2006
This review is from: Forgive Us Our Spins: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left (Hardcover)
When I saw Michael Moore's Columbine, I was made very uneasy by his manipulative use of certain scenes - for instance, his interview with Charlton Heston followed by the elaborately self-serving placement of the photo of a murdered child. And while I certainly agreed with Moore's anti-gun lobby position, I thought his `explanations' for American violence were simple-minded, to say the least.

So it was with interest and a degree of relief that I read Jesse Larner's biography-cum-political commentary - a critique from the left - on Moore and the American left. I'd bet it will stimulate a lot of thinking and discussion among people hungry for a genuine approach to developing progressive American positions.

Larner writes in a fluent, accessible style - and while documenting some of Moore's less savory approaches to both film-making and politics, he maintains an appreciation for Moore's strengths that's a nice counterpoint to the unsubtle and dishonest behaviour he details.

Finally, the book offers thoughtful (though depressing) insights into the current position of the American left.

Susan Berlin
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


3 of 3 people found the following review helpful:
3.0 out of 5 stars A troubling look at a complicated man, March 21, 2007
By 
Geoff Pietsch (Gainesville, FL) - See all my reviews
This review is from: Forgive Us Our Spins: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left (Hardcover)
I was drawn to this look at Michael Moore because the author, like me, shares many of Moore's liberal/left views, yet, as the title suggests, he also is bothered by both Moore the person and Moore the filmmaker. I wanted to find out why.
Larner is persuasive in delineating some of Moore's deceptive methods. Example: Contrary to the whole implication of "Roger and Me", Moore did indeed interview Roger Smith of GM - and at length. As Larner suggests, this and other misrepresentations (like the obvious distortion of depicting happy Iraqi children in Saddam's Iraq, pre-war) serve to give ammunition to the Right and detract severely from his cause.
But in the end I was disappointed with this book since it fails to give Moore enough credit for the enormous success he has had in shining light on injustice in our country. At the end, my clear impression was that Larner basically supports our war in Iraq and can't forgive Moore for "Fahrenheit 9/11".
So read this book, if you wish, but then do as I did and also read "Citizen Moore" by Roger Rapoport, another liberal. Rapoport also describes Moore's shortcomings, but he does the great service of quoting both people who know Moore, like Ralph Nader, and Moore himself at great length. He editiorializes very little and lets the reader sort out for him/herself the strengths and weaknesses of this very talented and complicated man.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


7 of 9 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars a book about us, February 26, 2007
This review is from: Forgive Us Our Spins: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left (Hardcover)
Jesse Larner's book is a refreshing page-turner and (despite his occasional lapse into outright silliness over blogs) largely right on the money. It is refreshing because here is someone who believes in social justice; believes in unions; is outraged at Caterpillar because it is a union-busting company (don't hear that very often, do you?); offers the most plausible explanation of how the 2000 Election was stolen before a single voter walked into the voting booth I have ever heard--and who is outraged at Michael Moore.

But this book is not really about Michael Moore. It is about us. It is about a political debate that "is couched in terms of blind ideology"; about a culture that prefers the simple, emotionally satisfying story about "good and evil" to an honest analysis (or even an assessment of our own interests). In such a political culture, when the time is right (and after the 2000 Election, 9/11, and the Iraq War the time was very right indeed), a Michael Moore, an Ann Coulter, and many, many others find a receptive audience, can become quite wealthy and can come to "represent their" side in the popular imagination, at home and abroad.

And that, as Larner points out is destructive indeed. It is destructive in the first instance to "their side" but in the long-term it is destructive to the whole point of politics which is supposed to be about reasonable, pragmatic compromise. And so I highly recommend that you read this book. Not so much for what it says about Michael Moore but for what it says about us.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


2 of 2 people found the following review helpful:
1.0 out of 5 stars Over-the-top liberal bias, July 11, 2009
This review is from: Forgive Us Our Spins: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left (Hardcover)
I finished reading this book before the recent revelations that the insurance industry coordinated an attack on Moore. The reason I found the book very monotonous is that the author just repeats the most common liberal lies. Larner does not proceed logically, so the book just becomes one shrill screech after another.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


3 of 4 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars A Great Piece of Americana, November 3, 2006
By 
Paul Willen (Yorktown Heights, NY USA) - See all my reviews
(REAL NAME)   
This review is from: Forgive Us Our Spins: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left (Hardcover)
Jesse Larner has a great knack for describing the ebb and flow of American life, as wonderfully illustrated by his earlier book on Mount Rushmore. And who could be more American that this bigger-than-life promoter-proto-leftist-trickster-con man-sometime genius writ-large, Michael Moore, who has met his match in this highly detailed well-researched biography/polemic by Jesse Larner? Written with verve and passion, it is well worth reading.


Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


5.0 out of 5 stars Critical but fair evaluation, August 26, 2008
By 
J. Davis (San Diego, CA United States) - See all my reviews
(REAL NAME)   
Amazon Verified Purchase(What's this?)
This review is from: Forgive Us Our Spins: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left (Hardcover)
Is it possible to be a liberal and still not like Michael Moore? Yes, and Jesse Larner shows how. Larner shows Moore to be a deceptive, dishonest propagandist. For example, on Farenheit 9-11, Moore absurdly tries to show pre-war Iraq under Saddam to be an oasis of peace and freedom. Larner shows Moore to be the Ann Coulter of the left, someone who makes a lot of money out of shock value, but who has little constructive to offer. I highly recommend this book.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


5.0 out of 5 stars A true page turner, September 9, 2006
This review is from: Forgive Us Our Spins: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left (Hardcover)
An exceptional read. The author uses Michael Moore as a lens through which to identify how political dialogue has been co-opted by strident theatricality on both the right and the left. Also, a fascinating portrait of a man at odds with himself whose personal conflicts mirror those in society as a whole. A unique and important book.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


5 of 8 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars The hard questions, September 22, 2006
By 
N. Thompson (Brooklyn, NY United States) - See all my reviews
(REAL NAME)   
This review is from: Forgive Us Our Spins: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left (Hardcover)
Forgive us our Spins is not just a book about Michael Moore. It is a book about the state of the left in America. Larner uses an examination of Moore's strengths and weaknesses to explore what his popularity means to democracy today. Michael Moore does not come off well as a person in this book. But uncovering Moore's dark side, from his personal paranoia to his political fibbing, is the easy part. The greater challenge in the second half of the book is to explore why so many people (in America but also throughout Europe) rally behind a guy who actually has the potential to damage many of his own causes.
Larner's book is a warning shot to the left and the not so left. He explores elements of history (from the effect of Calvinism on the populist movement in the 1900s to the 2000 election conflict) to help us understand how so many in this country are so angry and desperate that we make an icon out of any one who speaks truth to power. Even when it isn't the entire truth. It is stunning to learn how popular Moore is in Europe. He has become a movement unto himself. And yet any good journalist, and Larner is one, can come up with so much manipulation and inconsistency in Moore's work, that it begs the question-What happens when the left allows itself to be defined by a guy who admits his work cannot be called primarily documentary work? By a guy who is sometimes just plain dishonest?
Larner interviews conservatives who delight in Moore's imperfections. For them, he is proof that the left cannot make a cohesive argument without fudging the facts. Moore is so vulnerable to challenge that the right made a counter-movie to his Fareheit 911. The counter-movie was full of lies, but once Moore cut corners with the truth in Farenheit, he made it hard to tell the difference.
The left being indistinguishable from right wing babble is just what the right wants. Larner's book is a warning about getting sucked into this game. It is also a plea to keep legitimate the claims that progressives consider their own. It is an argument that the causes one associates with the left of center, cannot be tainted at this crucial moment in history.
One of the claims the left would make of itself is that of honest criticism. By writing this book, Larner is supporting that claim. He knows he will take heat for this book. He knows that some will ask why he had to bash Moore. That he is not afraid to write this book is one answer to that question.
A final vindication of this argument comes not from what Larner writes but from what has not been written. Larner clarifies that it is not an easy task to attack the guys who seem to be on your side. He issues a challenge to his intelligent genuine conservative peers. He asks them who will take the Ann Coulters and Rush Limbaughs to task the way he has challenged Moore. The absence of reasonable conservative criticism of such right wing idealogues suggests that there is one thing the progressive left still has over the right. They are not afraid to take a hard look at themselves. They are not afraid of the truth.

Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


9 of 15 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars A brilliant book!, August 9, 2006
By 
This review is from: Forgive Us Our Spins: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left (Hardcover)
There are far too few books like this around - a committed lefty taking one of the movement's icons to task. As the author himself asks, are there any committed conservatives ready to do the same with one of theirs? (Dare we criticize, or even question, Ann Coulter?) Larner is fierce, passionate, and lucid in his anaylsis of Michael Moore and his work - but in the end this is a book about far more than Moore. It should be read by anyone who is concerned about the state of American politics today. An amazing read.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


Most Helpful First | Newest First

This product

Forgive Us Our Spins: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left
Forgive Us Our Spins: Michael Moore and the Future of the Left by Jesse Larner (Hardcover - August 18, 2006)
$24.95
In Stock
Add to cart Add to wishlist