Customer Reviews

Genesis Box Set 3 (1970-1975)[13 Disc Set]

5 star:		(67)
4 star:		(15)
3 star:		(6)
2 star:		(3)
1 star:		(12)

 

 

So, we finally come to it at last: the third & final Genesis box set in the band's box set trilogy. And this time, we're going all the way back to the band's beginning! "Genesis 1970-1975" is the Peter Gabriel era, the early days of the band when Phil Collins stayed behind the drumkit (or, in the case of "Trespass," wasn't even in the band yet), and Peter Gabriel was the frontman, dressing up in all of his wild, wacky costumes. Five albums included here: "Trespass," "Nursery Cryme," "Foxtrot," "Selling England By The Pound," and "The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway," all remastered and remixed by producer Nick Davis, with lots of fantastic early concert footage, and insightful interviews with the various bandmembers, recorded in 2007 (NOTE: the group's 1969 debut album, "From Genesis To Revelation," is not included in the box set for legal reasons). The box set also comes with an exclusive bonus disc of rare tracks and exclusive footage, and a handsome 42-page booklet. All five Genesis albums featured here are 5-star classics in my book, and the sound quality and remixing on all of them is nothing short of superb (thank you, Nick Davis!). Like the two Genesis box sets before it, Davis has once again brought the vocals more up front, as well as some of the instrumentation, so you can now hear notes & passages played & sung that were previously buried. "The Lamb," in particular, is a whole new album! I heard stuff on this new version of "The Lamb" that I've *never* heard before (there's even a few more seconds added to Mike Rutherford's mystic strumming on "Fly On A Windshield"---I never knew the track had been edited!). The bonus disc of rarities is a real treat---most of these rare cuts have already been issued on the "Genesis Archive 1967-1975" box set, and they're all fabulous (including the phenomenal "Twilight Alehouse"), but the main attraction here is the previously-unreleased 15-minute tape called "Genesis Plays Jackson," a never-finished soundtrack the band recorded for an aborted BBC documentary about the painter Michael Jackson, and the band would later raid some of this material for "Trespass," "Nursery Cryme," and "The Lamb." It is *very* fascinating stuff to hear. And the video content on this box set is sensational, with lots of amazing vintage concert footage of Peter & the boys in action, including the priceless, rare 1973 concert film shot on the "Selling England" tour (it's about an hour long), and equally-priceless TV performances recorded in 1971, '73 and '74. And listen to this: while there is no "proper" footage included from "The Lamb" tour---regretfully, the band never filmed the "Lamb" show in it's entirety---the 5.1 DVD of "The Lamb" offers an outstanding, visual reconstruction of the concert, including the band's original slides from the show, bootleg footage, and photos. It is absolutely breathtaking to watch, and probably the closest we'll ever get to an actual film of Genesis performing "The Lamb" themselves. And the 2007 interviews with all the guys are terrific, very informative and insightful. The *only* debit I can think of about "1970-1975" is the unfortunate omission of "From Genesis To Revelation," but I won't deduct any stars from my rating for it. Besides, "From Genesis To Revelation" IS available if you want it. It's not the greatest album Genesis ever made, but it's very good and you should still get it, AND you can complete your Genesis studio-album collection with it, too. I'm thrilled beyond words---my all-time favorite band have finally been honored in a huge, huge way with these three box sets. Pick up "Genesis 1970-1975" right now, and, as Peter Gabriel sang on "Cinema Show," take a little trip back with Father Tiresias. Thank you, and long live Genesis!

I've been a recording engineer for over 20 years and I'm also a big early Genesis fan. When I first read some of these reviews I was excited to hear good things about the over all sound quality. I then saw some negative reviews citing over compression and bad mastering. I just got the box set a few days ago and these are definitely remixes (not just remasters) and they are MUCH better overall. You will hear different vocal tracks on occasion and the vocals generally louder. The drum sounds, guitar tones, bass tones and keyboard sounds are all much improved. The thing about the original recording of these albums (especially Trespass, Nursery Cryme and Foxtrot) is they were done on a tight budget and really are very poor mixes. I think anyone who listens to the new mixes a few times and then goes back to the original recordings will realize how much better these mixes are. The DVD's are also great with just about all live footage from that era and great interviews with all band members done in 2007.

A Must Have! for any PG era Genesis fans

There is a lot to like about this box set. The videos are great. Overall, the sound is improved but at a cost. Whenever, there is a remix, there usually is a departure from the original soundscape of what the artists intended. For instance, the organ in the "You stand there with your fixed expression" section of The Musical Box is now mixed way down and Gabriel's voice is the only prominent instrument. I feel some of the power in the piece has been lost due to the choice of remix levels. In some cases, instruments once heard in the mix are now almost inaudible. Were members of Genesis involved with the remix? Regardless, it is a treat to hear these masterpieces of prog in somewhat better sound however, I will not give up my recordings with the original mixes.

I am sure most reviewers will say the new mixes are better because there are instruments they never heard before that are now clearer. The reason for that is now the mixes are different and not necessarily from improved sound. Regardless, I will still listen to the new remixes and delight in them like everyone else. I just wish that the mix levels were closer to the original productions.

Edit- I was wrong to say that the sound is improved. After listening and comparing these remixes to my original vinyl pressings and nimbus mastered CDs, I must say that the remixes sound terrible in comparison. They are loud, compressed and thin sounding. The bass is virtually non-existent compared to the original LPs and CDs. I rarely listen to these remixes-they sound worse when played on an SACD player. I will listen and compare much longer in the future before I write reviews.

I've been waiting here for so long. Please understand before you read another word that this is a biased review. On a beautiful summer day in mid-1974 I meandered in to the local record store in Mill Valley, California with around $8.00 in my pocket of hard earned paper route money. I walked out with 2 albums for $1.00 that had never been played. The store owner was selling his "promo" albums for fifty cents each and I scored Mahogany Rush- "Child of the Novelty" and Genesis- "Trespass". I went home, smoked a very skunky reefer, and sat down to listen to my two new scores of which I'd never heard either band. My life has never been the same since. This week in November 2008 (34 years later) I've just obtained the new Genesis box set 3 (1970-1975) and "Child of the Novelty" 2006 remaster by Frank Marino. Once again I've been taken to places I've never been. Though the material is familiar the experience is BRAND NEW. Trust me, "The Lamia" gave me goose bumps on top of goose bumps, "Fly on a Windshield-Broadway Melody" struck sonic chords that were probably only present the day of their conception. God Bless these musicians and engineers and all the fans who pushed for and supported this kind of COSMIC ART that we don't see so much of these days. I've said my say, you can't get a better bang for your buck than Genesis- Box Set 3 and Mahogany Rush- "Child of the Novelty" remasters. Bless Yourself and buy them.

I stand with jaw open as to how people can listen to Genesis in this fashion. I had hoped this box might be treated with a more "audiophile" approach after all of the complaints about the previous two, but clearly such was not to be the case.

I can only presume that some people have been listening to "remastered" CDs for so long now that they have lost complete touch with things like midrange, drums that don't sound like tin cans, and dynamics that haven't been sacrificed. I envy those who do not hear what all of this EQing and compression has done to this set. I truly do. But to me, right from the moment I put on Trespass, Mayhew's cymbals sounded like somebody hitting a can with a spoon right next to my head. Yeah, more "clarity," but at what cost? The hi-hat on Trespass now sounds like pure tin. Drums don't sound like that no matter how loud they get. That's just massive EQ tweaking and compression gone wrong. Even Gabriel's voice is somewhat grating because of all of the EQ. The whole signal just pumps and sounds kind of sterile.

The EQing on these varies, and won't always be as "bright" as what I described above, but the compression remains pretty consistent, and is a sonic disaster for any but the fan who buys music he enjoys again and again and is content with hearing new "detail" as opposed to being concerned with the warmth and "feel" of the entire signal.

If one is so inclined to look at this stuff in a more scientific fashion to see what was done, you'll see that many peaks are just gone. I saw a comparison where the original 80s CD of Selling England was displayed next to this new mastering, and I kid you not, it was noted that on "Cinema Show," the dynamics are about *half* of what they were. This is ridiculous.

It doesn't take a "purist" to find that these sound bizarre. Heck, I used to think people who said this type of sound makes you "feel a bit weird" or "causes ear fatigue" were New Age wackos, but I've come to understand that when music is squashed with compression like this it actually makes you feel a bit dizzy in the head just listening to it. How anyone could get through these entire albums without their ears feeling exhausted is something which simply eludes me.

Some people will look at the waveforms of these with software and think they've seen worse, but this is compression that was obviously done on individual tracks and in the mixing process and you'll really need to compare with early CD versions to see how much has been sacrificed in order to make these sound "pumped up" or "modern" or whatever the goal was here. Sure, when these were mastered, they cranked it up some more, but it's the whole thing being pummeled with compression in the *mixing* process that is obvious and creates this sound.

Now, if one wants the 5.1 mixes, I suppose this set might be interesting, but for stereo, original Charisma vinyl makes this stuff sound laughably bad. It is just unfathomable that anyone could have ever bothered to A/B these mixes with the originals at the same volume and think this could actually be pitched as an "improvement." That is comical. To my ears, these should be called the Genesis "demasters" or "demixes."

I guess Davis apparently learned his lesson from using no-noise to lessen hiss on the "Definitive Editions," so thankfully that is one thing that is not evident. The breath is in the signals here, and I hear plenty of tape hiss, but the EQing and compression is not to be believed.

If you have no ability to play vinyl or generally prefer the CD medium, do some googling for something like "Genesis best CD versions" and you'll find that many Genesis freaks have been hunting down the old Virgin/Charisma CDs for Trespass, Nursery Cryme and Foxtrot. These may not be perfect sounding, but don't let the cheap packaging fool you. Sonically, those babies trounce this nonsense. For Selling England and The Lamb, the early Virgin/Charisma CDs are great but the Atlantic CD of Selling England and the Atco CD of Lamb are also the same mastering and equally superior to this approach. Not the case with the earlier stuff. There, you need the early Virgin/Charisma CDs with those stupid "cropped" covers. The Atlantics (or MCA for Trespass) aren't as good. Of course, even the no-noised and overly EQd "Definitive Editions" from 1994 are better than this, but real fans should do some research as many fans are out there trying to do comparisons and figure the Genesis catalog out on CD. The 80s CDs have compared most favorably but you need the right ones, because some of them were just garbage of a different kind. In recent comparisons, I have found that decent vinyl pressings of these albums crush any CD, but I kid you not, if you A/B some of those decent sounding 80s/early 90s pressings with this garbage and actually level match them so that they are the same volume, you'll see that this is ultimately just grating on the ears.

Ironically, I'd be glad to rebuy this music despite owning it in numerous formats, live versions, etc... but only if the original recordings were treated with *some* type of TLC and restraint. Not just put through a chain of tools and worked over like meat through a grinder. And I don't think it sounds "better" just because I am told or most people believe that "technology has improved so much" and blah blah blah. These mixes were works of art. They were intimate one minute and bombastic the next. Genesis was in your room and then blasting mellotron from the Moon all within a single piece of music. That feeling is gone. It has been disregarded in favor of mixes like "Mama." I thought "Mama" was breathtaking, innovative and brilliant for its time, but I don't need to hear "Can Utility and the Coastliners" mixed to sound like "Mama."

Metaphorically, maybe Banks thought his keyboard rig in the 80s sounded as organic and powerful as his rig in the 70s because he was adopting the technology of the time. But while that technology may have been of its time and accepted by most keyboardists as "improved," in my view, it wasn't improved. In fact, I suspect that many would agree it wasn't nearly as good! Same thing here, folks. I'm sad to report this because this music means so much to me that I wanted this set to be different. Unfortunately, it's along the lines of the previous sets. Read all the glowing reviews you like, but at least try to find those that have some descriptions of tonality and actual comparisons. Those are perfectly valid as this is all subjective, but when reading fascinating insights like "Nursery Cryme sounds better than I *remember* it sounding so buy this now" and similar diatribes, just remember that those aren't actual comparisons. Instead, they are just reviews from people who, for whatever reason, want to believe that they have made a good investment or support anything the band does.

I was first introduced to Genesis in the 80s, and the introduction was not promising. The first Genesis song I heard was 'Misunderstanding', and I didn't like it! I remember changing the radio station when it came on. However, a few years later they came out with Abacab, and I went from being a 'hater' to a fan. As a drummer, I never got tired of the musical bridge in the middle of the song. Then my parents found a real to real movie of Seconds Out at our local library, so they borrowed it. I was amazed at the beauty and complexity of their music and watched the reals over and over until the day we had to return it. After this I was completely hooked! A few years later a friend introduced me to the Gabriel years (music I had previously only heard sung by Phil Collins).

I have come to appreciate every period of Genesis and by the time I graduated college I owned a complete set of Genesis records and CDs. Unfortunately the records were lost in a flood and the CDs were sold in a fit of madness. I have found Genesis CDs to be the hardest to find anywhere, and when the box set of selected remasters showed up on the shelves of the PX in Camp Ceder II, Iraq, it set me on a trip of nostalgia that is finally coming to it's conclusion. Each box set has increased my appreciation for their music, but none as much as this latest instalment.

The interviews with the band are the best yet. It was great to hear Peter and Phil both complimenting and occasionally ribbing each other. It was also great to be able to put to rest many of the roumors I had heard over the years about the splits that occurred in the band. I had also come to enjoy the solo projects of Anthony Phillips and Steve Hacket, and it was good to learn so much more about these uniquely talented and quiet guitar players.

The mixes are a huge improvement. The sound has so much more space to it, and some of the songs described by the band as "too busy" were opened up and greatly improved. The bonus material was a pure delight, a glimps into some creative energy of the band that was lost to many of us. The only dissapointment was the complete neglect of the first album. While I understand that the band does not really consider this to be a "Genesis" album, many of us feel very differently about it, and would love to have heard a remix of this album. The other dissapointment was with the live video selections. There were several different versions of the same songs, especially Supper's Ready and Musical Box. While these are great songs, they were not the only great songs during this era, and I would like to have seen some of the others show up, especially Cinema Show.

Over all, though this is the best of the set, although I wouldn't want to be without any of them. This is a band that has truly lived up to the name "Progressive". Each album showed progress in style, technique and musical ability, without ever losing that unique Genesis "quirkiness" that made us all love them.

All I have to say is that after hearing the album 1,000 times, now hearing The Lamb in Dolby 5.1 surround is like hearing it fresh. Sounds I never noticed before jump out. And the DVD has the stage screens displayed while the album plays. Very cool.

Discovered Genesis with "Selling England" in 1973. I was a Junior in high school. "The Lamb" (along with "Quadrophenia") defined my adolescence and were my 2, all-time dessert island albums. Through the years, I have purchased U.S. LP's, U.K. import LP's, original CD's and remastered CD's of these albums. So, with the exception of "Trespass", this is the firth of fifth time I have bought these works. (Sorry, couldn't resist.)
I've had this set since it came out (almost 2 years ago) and have listened to nothing but the 5.1 DVD's. They are nothing short of fantastic and alone, are fully worth the price of admission. Especially "The Lamb". If we had had surround sound in 1974, it would have been dangerous. Oh yeah, there was the "Brain Salad Surgery" tour.
I saw Genesis twice ("Wind and Wuthering" and "Duke" tours) but never with Gabriel. That would have been the ultimate. I did get to see Steve Hackett in '76 before his departure and got to sit in the orchestra pit at the Saenger Theater in New Orleans for the "Duke" show in 1980. You could feel Phil pound the tambourine in the pit of your stomach. I'll never forget it. Also saw P. Gabriel in 2002. Unforgettable as well.
I guess my point to all these reminiscences is; if you grew up listening to these classic albums, and you have a good surround sound system, you owe it to yourself to pick up this set.
I too wish these were actual DVD Audio discs, which would be higher resolution sound, but most people don't have the capability to play DVD Audio or SACD discs. However, these DTS mixes are pretty darn sweet.
Now it's time to replace all of my King Crimson discs with the surround versions. Have two already, and they are amazing as well. Looking forward to "Lark's Tongues" in 5.1. That will be special!

You can actually hear the vocals on Trespass! The crisp clarity of Supper's Ready is chilling! There will always be haters; I have original pressings, CD issues, and now this, and I don't care what the engineers originally produced, I Like the dynamics on this set.

Bravo!

This was the box I was most waiting for. My love affair with Genesis started with P.G's incarnation , and although I own (and truly treasure) the other two boxes ; this is the one I have been waiting for!!!

Phenomenal reproductions ! The 5.1 mixes are astonishing , and even just the stereo remixes pleasure the listener with sounds never heard before. And these are recordings I have heard at least 100's of times over the last 35 + years !

The DVD extras are nice. they round out the collection well. But in the grand scheme of things , early PG Genesis was about the musical imagery happening in your mind. For that alone , this box set offers and delivers it all!

Here's hoping Rhino puts out one more with all the Genesis Live discs. "Live" , "Seconds Out" , "Three Sides Live" , "The Shorts" , and "The Longs" could all benefit from an upgrade . And what lurks in the vaults from these live releases?????? Maybe time will tell

For now : Brush back your hair ; I want to get to know your flesh !