Customer Reviews

The Great Stillness: The Water Method of Taoist Meditation Series, Vol. 2

5 star:		(2)
4 star:		(0)
3 star:		(2)
2 star:		(1)
1 star:		(2)

 

 

I really enjoyed his first volume of the Water Meditation Series, fiding it practical, well-written, and entertaining. So I looked forward to reading Vol. 2.

I was disappointed. Whereas Vol. 1 was focused essentially on breathing and mediation, and gave nice descriptions, as well as step-by-step exercises to better master and understand this form of meditation, Vol.2 was scattered. Frantzis, is an eloquent writer, so I was never bored or confused, and his stories/analogies are always amusing, albeit sometimes difficult to completely believe.

However his treatment of Ba Gua Circle Walking is far too basic. Follow these footsteps and breath like in Vol. 1 is essentially what it comes down to. At least Vol. 1 really got into what Frantzis viewed as appropriate steps in the Water Meditation process-- starting from the very basic, and getting to the somewhat advanced. In Vol.2, Frantzis covers a broad range of topics superficially.

I agree that including sexual techniques was a bit misplaced. Chia, at least, has the sense to write separate volumes when distinguishing between martial meditative and sexual qigong approaches. How to improve your sexual sensitivity by fingering tofu--? Come on, Kumar!

Vol.2 also began expounding somewhat on the esoteric, that is difficult to confirm. Reliable friends of mine have attended Kumar's seminars-- he basically asks how many attendees are qigong instructors, then trashes and humiliates them in front of everyone else. Not very classy. According to my friends, he never proves his own abilities, either, merely plays mindgames. My friends agree that Kumar has some skill and knowledge, but his arrogance shows up in his books, and this trait apparently manifests profoundly at least at the two seminars I've heard about.

This book is more in this vein. He claims a lot of things, and tells a lot of stories and makes a lot of anecdotes about wonderful spiritual achievements, but these things are so "advanced" that I cannot confirm them, and wonder if I ever will. I do think I've experienced some of the more esoteric things Frantzis talks about in Vol. 1, so you never know... This may be a book I re-read in a few years and see if I get anything more out of it.

It starts off where Vol 1 ends. So you should not get this book until you complete Vol 1, otherwise the book won't do you any good. That said, there are problems with this book, though he deals with moving qigong it is inadequately illustrated. His inner disolving process seems to be overly complex and seems to have roots in Chan Buddhism and guided imagery not Taoism, you can get the same results with loving kindness meditation as his Inner Disolving. In my mind this inclusion does not warrent the book. The book gives me the impression that Frantzis ran out material and had to toss in a lot of other stuff.

The real bugger is his inclusion of supposedly Taoist sex techniques. Now this is not part of Taoism and is condemned by Orthodox Taoists as it serves no purpose outside of increasing the practitioners ego, it's been refuted since 4th Century AD Taoists. Why is he included this non-sense is beyond me unless he is trying to attract the same audience that Mantak Chia and Yudelove have. No supposed Taoist would teach this garbage. Unless Frantzis was taught by Redhats and that would not be Liu Hung Chieh. It would be someone else.

Overall not bad, but Shinzen Young has covered the same material in his audio tapes. But if you have completed the first book you can skip it and move on to other works whether Tantric, Buddhist or something else.

The origins of these practices are very difficult if not impossible to verify. BK Frantzis must know this, so he does not have the burden of having to prove the validity of his statements. He can make up outrageous stories and quotes and people often just believe him without any proof. There are just too many "from time immemorial" and "since the beginning of time" references, to take this person seriously at all.

Also, don't ask him why he is a lineage master; you'll get more hyperbole than a politician. The certificates that are in his books are acknowledgments from his teachers. There is nothing there that says he is a master of the material or that he is carrying on any tradition.

Each time you read about him he has supposedly spent more and more time in the Far East studying. If you add up all the years he supposedly has spent studying, his age is 102.

Most of the material that is presented in his two books is material that you can learn or extrapolate from any beginning meditation texts. There is also some confusion between his reference to Buddhist material and so-called Taoist material.

Ask a real Taoist priest about these topics if you are sincerely interested.

Some people are what they say, others are not!

It is nice to see more books promoting the benefits of meditation, and it would be nice for one, after reading this book, to decide to sit down, relax and meditate. Having said that, I do find the author having confused himself in many areas, the followings are just two examples:

1. Walking meditation of I-Ching: The author is a practitioner of Chinese internal martial art, and "walking" is an important legitimate training method. However, no master (sifu) will call this training method meditation, because it is NOT. Moreover, the author only described the mechanics of walking a circle without indicating where and how the trainee should focus his attention on (thus making his exercise mere walking rather than mind-body exercise). To better learn genuine walking training method, one can refer to books by Master Lam Kam Chuen (I-style) or Mantak Chia's tai-chi book.

I-Ching, the book of Change, is an old Chinese oracle book. The importance of which is that it presented a profound philosophic way of comprehending life itself when it gives its various advice. It is therefore a great book to understand Chinese culture and mentality (both Taoism and Confucianism consider it their own Classic, interested readers can also refer to Carl Jung's famous "Foreword to the I-Ching" available in his "Psychology and the East"). In short, the author's walking "meditation" of I-Ching has nothing to do with this great book.

2. Microcosmic orbit and sexual meditation: In Taoist meditative practice, microcosmic orbit circulation is only the very first step, and can be easily learned and it is nothing mythical (one can refer to Mantak Chia's book or just browse the web to see various people present their own variations of the microcosmic circulation technique, for free). In classical Taoist meditation (interested readers can refer to the classic "Taoist Yoga" translated by Charles Luk), a meditator does use microcosmic orbit circulation to sublime sexual energy for the purpose of health and deeper meditation (higher level of spiritual practice). "Using Tofu to develop hand sensitivity" can certainly work for some people for sexual purpose, but that definitely has nothing to do with Taoist sexual sublimation practice (and also has nothing to do with Mantak Chia's more esoteric version of using sexual intercourse to generate sexual energy and to sublime (move) it up for high-spiritual practice, classical Taoist yoga practitioners [which actually mean most Taoist yoga practitioners in the EAST] will however likely to frown at Chia, and label him cultish and conducive to generating bad publicity to pure/religious Taoist yoga practice!) .

in a book is worth a thousand criticisms.

The gem that caught my eye is his description of the state-of-mind in the Dissolving Processes.
(I've already loaned out both Vols 1 & 2 so I'm relying on my (feeble) recollection here)

He breaks state-of-mind in to 4 phases:
1. intent,
2. presence,
3. mind in motion, and
4. mindstream.

It is the concept of "mindstream" that caught on with me.

To illustrate with an analogy--air travel from NY to London.
1. you form the intent to go to London.
2. you pack all your luggage and get on the plane.
3. you move with your intent and presence across the Atlantic.
4. the wings of your moving plane are supported by the air--the airstream--your "mindstream."

Hope that you don't encounter "wind shear."

To me, this is fantastic!
(see [...] for a related concept)
This week evanglists knocked on my door and asked, "What is the "Holy Spirit?"
Seems that there are at least 2 answers: a) a spirit and 2) a Person.
After they left I thought: "Why not both (or neither)?"

So I coined my own term, "Godstream."

Experimenting in the "headless" tradition, there actually seems to be a supporting substrata behind intent and mind in motion.
Call it whatever you wish (other terms that might fit: "wu chi stream," "HolySpiritstream," "headless-stream.")

To me this gem itself was worth the price of admssion.

if i would not have been to one of his seminars i really couldn`t give a valuable feedback of this nowhere else found (as far my knowledge of the western literature and teachers goes) material about the main method of taoist meditation (in the water tradition). for sure mr. frantzis tackles on the most difficult subject to write about : meditation. if you have no practical experience in this field at all, dont try to confuse yourself with "hard-to-belief" stories, how some readers mentioned. its a living tradition and thats why this book can only serve you as companion or introduction to the "A, B, C" of these meditation practices. you have to find a real teacher if you are serious about the subject. and thats what mr. frantzis is.

Have Volume 1 of this book and wanted to continue with this next volume. I am learning every day and read avidly. This seems to be a wonderful book.