Customer Reviews

JBL MS-8 MS Series Digital Processor

5 star:		(5)
4 star:		(0)
3 star:		(1)
2 star:		(0)
1 star:		(2)

 

 

I've been in high end audio for a long time (both stage, vehicle and studio config).
the MS-8 replaced my Rockford 3sixty.2, which replaced dual Rockford Symmetry EPXs (28band eq's), which replaced AudioControl DQX (30bandeq).
i've also had for the longest time an indash eq (audiocontrol four.1, which replaced rockford pa3).

I have around $10k of tuning equipment, have been taught how to use it, and have considerable experience using it. (please dont think im talking myself up - just want to say that i have professional experience, and been taught by a number of experience and well respected people in this field. its my passion).

the ms-8 achieves what absolute fine-tuning would take me 2-3 months. generally a very good tune using existing methods would take 4 hours, but to get that best extra bit out of a system is a process of driving and refining for about 2-3 months. when you do this you really need to switch back and forth between presets quickly as the ears quickly fatigue.. and you really want to hear if you made it better or actually worse.

the sound quality is just amazing, and all tuned in only 2-3 minutes. incredible.
i would say that anyone who is as critical as i am will be amazed with the product, but, still find very minor issues with the auto-tune. i also found that retuning at different levels and different distances (forward/backward) made slight differences. but still it is a significant improvement on anything in the market.

that being said, the remote control feels like a toy. pressing the buttons is a bit hit and miss, and a bit slow..
i planned on using the remote to control system volume, but it doesn't respond reliably enough to be a volume control. so i set it to a decent level and use the headunit for level control - im actually happier with this solution.

the interface is good, but its a shame the designers didnt design everything that would want to be changed on a single screen. or for example, a button on the remote that cycled between the user saved favourites, or, even the seat settings.

that being said the unit is incredible and has brought a new level to my system

front: focal utopia 3 way (running single channel per side using focal supplied xovers)
center: none.
sub: focal utopia 13"
rears: stock.
amps: 2x alpine 1507
headunit: pioneer dex-p88r (old school SQ)

i plan to separate the midbass from the mid+high in the fronts, mainly because the mid+high are in the kick panels and mid bass in the doors. it sounds fine with all 3 combined from a single channel, but, i can hear some time alignment issues with the mid-bass/sub, therefore i plan/suggest running a separate channel for each speaker location. just the 1507 amp is a monster (in size) and it feels not right to have it running a single pair of 6.5" midbass speakers.


the overall staging is excellent. i did find a few hiccups when auto-tuning at different volume levels (stage pulled slightly in one direction). i found it best to tune at the level you listen to the most. as the stage is spot on at that level.

for the longest time i've had headunit Loudness control disabled. but found that (especially when having passengers) that the loudness control helped smooth out the levels when down low. (so auto-tuned at mostly loud level, as thats where i like to listen to it, but on those occasions where it needs to be softer the loudness control fixes that up).. note the loudness control flattens out as the headunit raises in volume. excellent.

i tried using the supplied CD (which supposedly contains an audio track used for calibrating oem headunits). i could find no audio track on the disc when testing in 4-5 players, and, also when trying to rip. (and no.. i'm not a noob).
i contacted jbl at this via the website (where they claim to respond in 24hrs).. 3 weeks later, no response.
-it should be noted that this CD is not required when using an aftermarket headunit.

the manual doesnt make a bunch of things clear. such as:
1. when tuning for more than one passenger, should i actually have a second person? i understand tuning for driver is basically a single person scenario, but front tuning? should that require two people so it takes into account both people? or not?


in any case i dont know how i ever lived without this product.

switching between user-saved presets is fairly quick, and, im happy that it can apply the 30band differences very quickly (almost instantaneously). so testing how different EQ settings sound is great. unlike the Rockford 3Sixty.2 which requires about 40 seconds to upload the different settings. what im trying to say here is there is no delay in switching between presets, you can compare presets easily.

one important note is this: it will auto tune and set things up, but once it has done so you can ONLY change a single 30band eq which is applied to all speakers. (ie you cannot adjust a particular frequency for a single speaker, eg, front left).
you also MUST provide the speaker specifications of each speaker (or collection of speakers if you passively crossovered them) before it will autotune. that is, you must give a crossover slope, low pass and high pass setting etc.

the system also doesn't allow you to double up on the frequencies between front and sub. (eg set high pass of fronts to 45hz, and, low pass of sub to 80hz, ie 45~80hz being played by both speakers). which is a bit annoying. (that being said you can change the slope of the crossover point between them, but, there is only ONE, not individual for each). hope that makes sense?
what im trying to say here is it's not easy to have the fronts and sub both playing the same frequency range, its one or the other. :-( but fiddling with the crossover slopes can resolve it.. just takes time.

another point is anytime you want to make a crossover setting change, you have to completely recalibrate the entire system (it takes 3-5 minutes). example, say i want to shift the xover point between sub and fronts from 60hz to 70hz. I actually need to:
1. erase all settings (you dont get a choice)
2. tell the unit individually about _ALL_ your speakers (that's wherever they exist: what their LPF/HPF/Xover/slope are)
3. tell the unit which of the outputs matchup to your actual outputs (eg output 1 = front left)
its a bit annoying.

one other point that is annoying is that you will get NO SOUND from the unit until you have gone through the above steps at least once.
but, you really should have your levels fairly balanced (before using the ms-8). (note: you can go through it once, and the disable processing... set levels and do again.. but still... a bit strange/counter-intuitive)

my feeling on the product is this:

1. its an awesome product

2. feels like all the attention went to the audio processing side of things (which is great) but

3. the user interface side of things is lacking, also there is no way to turn the displays backlight off.

4. the remote is a bit terrible, and without looking at it you cant work out which way is up (all the buttons are symmetrically placed, so you cant determine orientation by "feel").

5. in terms of amplification setup. my take on it is "whether there is a speaker located" amp it separately. if there are a couple of speakers very close (such as mid and tweeter in kick boards, ie 1inch apart) - then these are fine to be passively crossovered and run off 1 of the ms8's outputs (instead of soaking up two)

6. the rear processing is quite good, i still find it puts a little bit too much vocals behind me, and i adjust accordingly... though i keep resetting it back to default here... so it is pretty good out of the box. i did notice that the front stage raised with the addition of the rear speakers (as is with tuning normally), and i was happy to hear this.

7. the ms-8 did a very good job of matching the tonality of my rears vs fronts (ie theyre different speakers). but they have now lost their individual characteristics and sound similar (well in the ranges the cheaper ones can play anyway).

8. its designed as a best-fits device. it does everything, but, it hides the nitty gritty away from those who would like to play with it. so if you actually need to make some modification (eg increase 3khz by 2db for the left speaker only) you cant. (im not saying you would need to, just that you cant..) however, you get balance/fade/sub level/rear level/ side level controls individually.


its an awesome product. i totally recommend it to anyone who is even considering changing their system.
i would put this device as higher priority in the list of what-to-do first, especially given that it has an 8 channel amplifier included (its enough to give most standard speakers what they want).

i tossed and turned about upgrading from the 3Sixty.2 and i am very very glad i did.

more and more i drive now, i fiddle less and just enjoy... to anyone who knows me they would know thats something incredible in itself (for me not to fiddle).
cheers.

i totally recommend reading the first persons comment (and tracking down that forum post) as thats what tipped me over the edge into ordering it.

last point, it took nearly 5-6 weeks for amazon to post it to me. :-( even though it said 10days.

HU: Pioneer 880prs and went active (forget about rear speakers!)
Tweeters: TB 2.5" Ceramic Dome
Mids: TB 3" Bamboo Cone
Lows: ID OEM 6.5" Carbon Fiber Weave Cone

The system in my Element has slowly transformed from a 'simple' system to an MS-8-centric beast, THIS is it!

1.0: It started off with a simple 6.5" ID OEM low and a 1" aluminum dome Tang Band tweeter in the doors (fully sealed and matted doors are crucial!!).

2.0: Then we shifted to a 2.5" ceramic dome Tang Band tweeter in the stock Element tweeter position, was better but definitely NOT the best.

3.0: Then we shifted to a three-way setup with the same lows and tweeters but threw in a set of mids; the tweeters and mids are now sitting in A-pillar mounted pods. Since my head-unit doesn't support active for three-way setups, we had to 'trick' the HU into thinking the tweeters and mids were the same speaker. It sounded amazing but wasn't quite there. Pioneer's latest top-end HU DOES support three-way setups.

4.0: Added the MS-8 and fiddled with calibration about six or seven times; the system simply blows EVERYONE away... This is not an understatement. The imaging is amazing, I'm noticing details in my music that I've never noticed before (mostly with older songs that I've listened to over and over and over again in the past). Imperfections in MP3's are much more apparent and annoying, I'm slowly replacing my collection with high-quality versions (320kbps if possible, may have to move onto loss-less down the road). I'm sure the MS-8 does wonders in a stock system but it also does wonders in a highly modified / custom system like mine.

I'm not sure how audio stores market the product but I hope they do it justice by having an installed system to demo the magical box to potential customers.

I installed MS-8 in my car. In overall unit makes good sound. But not great. Speakers are not to blame, they are top-end Morels. The problem is in calibration. MS-8 seem to calibrate to so-called "house curve", rather that to a flat response. I.e. treble level is lacking and has to be compensated in tone controls/EQ. I understand that JBL wanted out-of-the box experience satisfactory for most people (i.e. those happy with 128KBps MP3) and selected what *most* people like as did cinema theaters when they created "house curve". However, this is a high end product (or at least priced/marketed as such) and hence should have appropriate calibration settings: if I want flat, I should be able to get one.

BTW, if I defeat processing, treble is back, so there is nothing wrong with speakers or connections: it's calibration target that is wrong.

Now, remote display UI is pretty bad. First of all, it is very slow. Adjusting anything is unsafe during driving since you have to watch the screen. Simple buttons like 'next/pre favorite' and +/- on bass and treble would be much better. Now, JBL sells separate wireless bass control. OK, if they have wireless bass control with a normal rotary button, why MS-8 is only controllable via wired screen from remote???

And for Pete's sake, why do one have to go through complete setup process and specify every input connection again when all that I want is to change crossover frequency???

So in overall: unit quality and functionality is good, software and remote screen UI are horrible. Hence 3/5

Update. Due to unfortunate lack of calibration options MS-8 has issues when speakers are not placed at typical locations. For example, it uses bass sweep for subwoofer calibration and regular signal for other speakers. This causes issues when woofers are located under seats, like, for instance, in BMW. In order to have proper calibration under-seat woofers have to be specified as subwoofers so MS-8 uses sweep signal to calibrate them. But there is a catch: MS-8 is only able to handle two subwoofers and it is impossible to add real subwoofer to it (unless crossed separately).

So rating remains the same. MS-8 is a nice device, amps are good quality, nice processing, but it really needs to offer various calibration targets as well as options which signal to use for low end calibration and perhaps allow more than two subs - quite a few cars have woofers under seats and sub in a trunk.

I almost never write a review but this is an exceptional product. I had a great shop in Gainesville, FL professionally install this unit. Two weeks prior, I had a the full stereo upgraded with the exception of my factory head unit (2011 Honda Accord EX'L with Premium Sound). The system consistent of the JL HD 900 amp, Focal 165KR fronts, Focal 165 Access rears, and a JL 13w6 sub. The system sounded powerful but at times "harsh" and lacked ANY imaging. I could impress someone on a demo for a few minutes but for me it was lacking. It was like putting an indy car engine in a civic...with stock suspension, brakes, transmission...you get the point.
Add the MS8, and everything changed. I immediately noticed a decrease in the shrill, harsh sound I had. The installer walked me through how to calibrate the MS8 and said more tuning needed to be done. He was right. I have redone the setup several times, but what works was the factory HU on about 23-24, the MS8 on 30db and the AMP gains at 25%. I then turn up the amp gains to fill in the sound after calibration (~50%). I am very pleased with the result...even my wife noticed a much improved result. I find myself listening to old CDs I never thought I would use again, because of the pleasing sound of the MS8. Basically, you can get great results...have it professionally installed if you don't know what you are doing and spend a few hours reading on diymobile if you are not immediately pleased with the initial EQ. Great product, thumbs up!

What you get for the price is is simply unreal, especially now that these are down in the 450-500 dollar range. It will sum and de-EQ your factory unit, provides 8 channels of completely flexible output in terms of crossover assignment, the onboard amp is capable of a reasonable amount of output, acceptable for most end users (outside of a subwoofer) and the auto-tune is excellent, for an auto tune. I have no doubt that it's possible to do better, but I don't have the time or equipment or skills to approach what the MS8 does.

Well, what can I say?... this thing is truly heaven sent. I'm enamored with its ability to automatically tune the response of my car stereo system to deliver a great pleasing sound, with detail, focus, and attributes that I spent months working towards with a manual tuned DSP.

I wrote a review on this product on a car audio forum.
Here's the link, broken up. You'll have to reconstruct it as I cannot post a direct link. Delete the spaces and replace with periods.

[...]


Thanks

I tried 3 times to hook this thing up. To only call support and them past me on to a supervisor who said there were a bunch of units that went out with bad CD's, so they send me another one, so I tried installing oit AGAIN when I got the CD from them 1.5 weeks later (remember that all the door, Front and rear, as well as center and sides have to be rewired or soldered in my case EVERY time you try to install it!) and it didn't turn out to be the cd, it was a bad output on the high end side so I had to give them a cc card (they charged me $799 to advance ship this thing) to send me a new one and me return the bad one. So, install #3, I finally got the system to accept the level, fade, etc but when selecting speakers it didn't give me a chice for rear speakers which are the same as the fronts (Rockford Power 6.5 components with the passive crossover in between the mid and tweet. It says to treat those as 2 ways, but I tried it every which way but it WOULD NOT allow me to select ANY rear speakers It said "none" every time. So, I choose single sides and used those outputs for the rears but how dumb! They really have a good system, but it is not like "hooking up a light switch" as they say in their ad's. "If you can connect 3 wires, you can install the MS-8" NOT TRUE! and their support stinks! It is like there isn't anyone at the company that know anything about it. I wish the place I bought it was still in business (Ultimate), because they would have it sitting on their shelf again. I think these are going to work fine for the OEM user, but not if you are running aftermarket decks, speakers, and subs. Mine is for sale, it is brand new from JBL and I am going to lose $500 to just get the dang thing out of my car once my other amp show up on Tuesday. GONE! The experience stereo guy was so mad that this piece of junk, he about had a heart attack. It is all over now, lesson learned. just Beware, I am reall glad that others had a positive experience with this product. Oh, yeah. The others were right, the screen and remote stink too! PS- My experience is 4 years electrical engineering, 16 years IT Architect, and whole life installing and fabricating my own systems. so I don't think it was a lack of knowledge. May I am wrong. That is my 2 cents.

Bad MS-8

I purchased an MS8 from someone who decided he wanted to do hands on tuning. I took the unit to my installer and my left channel kept cutting out. He spent an hour and a half trying to diagnose/fix the system only to discover that the left channel rca plug was shot.

I am pretty sure I am TSOL on this one, since I was not the original purchaser, but will I have problems if I pick up another one? Does anyone have some reports about the longevity of their units? At least I know that Amazon will take it back, yes?

And BTW, I don't think the guy I bought it from 8 months ago intentionally sold me a bad unit (at least I hope not). I am figuring that JBL probably uses cheap Chinese manufacturing that does not hold up to much.