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17 of 20 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars This book sheds light on the debate on women in ministry., September 22, 2006
This review is from: Jesus and the Father: Modern Evangelicals Reinvent the Doctrine of the Trinity (Paperback)
For anyone who cares to be orthodox in their thinking about the doctrine of the Trinity, this is a don't miss read. In this book Kevin Giles explains a number of important things: 1) that the distinctive mark of the Christian God is that God is Three in One; 2) that unless we understand that the Father, Son, and Spirit are equal in authority and power, we fail to carry forward the historic doctrine of the Trinity; 3)that much of the contemporary debate in conservative evangelical circles on the doctrine of the Trinity is really not about the Trinity, but rather about the proper role of women in the Church.

Giles rightly explains that it is heretical to think the Father has more authority than the Son. Church fathers such as Athanasius, the Cappodocians, Augustine, John of Damascus battled--on the basis of rigorous Bible study and the principles of logic--that the Father, Son, and Spirit have one authority. Yet Giles fails to make clear that it's one thing to deny Christ's deity (as the Arian heretics did), and another thing to deny the Son's equal authority with the Father (as Wayne Grudem and others are doing).
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9 of 10 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars The Problem of Modern Evangelicalism., April 23, 2008
This review is from: Jesus and the Father: Modern Evangelicals Reinvent the Doctrine of the Trinity (Paperback)
In 2006, Kevin Giles, Anglican scholar and vicar of St. Michael's Church in North Carlton Australia published this book, "Jesus and the Father, Modern Evangelicals Reinvent the Doctrine of the Trinity". In many ways it is a defense and further exposition on his earlier work, "The Trinity and Subordinationism".

The importance of this book both in it's target field (the doctrine of the Trinity) and in the larger scope (the state of Evangelicalism) cannot be understated. Giles convincingly makes his case in the following points: First, that modern Evangelicals have strayed away from the historic, orthodox, Catholic, doctrinal formulation of the Trinity and have come extremely close to various Arian heretical reformulations of it. Several popular Evangelical scholars are taken to task on this point such as George Knight III, Wayne Grudem, Bruce Ware, Norman Geisler, John Frame, Robert Letham and Robert Doyle to name but a few. No denomination or Protestant tradition is safe from the penetrating analysis that Giles applies using the weapons of the historic orthodox voice, the regula fide. Evangelical, Reformed and Anglican scholars are exposed as being severly lacking in the proper understanding of historical theology.

The main point of contention is that modern scholars are defending the eternal subordination of Jesus in authority and function to the Father. If this surprising revelation is not enough, these scholars use this proposition to defend the 'hierarchical' view that a women should be subordinate to her husband, since we are told, this is the example Jesus shows us in His relationship with the Father.

In 300+ pages Giles inspects this modern innovation in painstaking detail exposing it's weakness on many grounds from both the voices of the early fathers, Calvin and modern conservative scholarship. Giles sober handling of the issues and breath of knowledge on the secondary literature is impressive and I must quote him in length on this point, "I have read all the contemporary books on the Trinity on the shelves of the university library I use, as well as other books on this topic I have borrowed elsewhere or bought, including all the conservative evangelical works that endorse the eternal sobordination of the Son" (p.169).

What we as Catholics say is that this one issue (and a major distortion it is) is but one symptom of the larger disease of modern evangelicalism. Modern Christianity has built it's house on sand rather than on the solid unshaking rock of history. And with the smallest of winds, bits and pieces fall over and exposes the emptiness inside. Imagine, what is the central piece, the very cornerstone of our faith, who our God is - is mangled and reinvented in modern garb. It is not difficult to prove then that the remaining tenets of our Catholic-historic faith have been similarly misunderstood and reinvented. To the credit of this great Anglican scholar he admits as much when he speaks very highly of Roman Catholic scholars on this issue, such as Edmund Fortman, Karl Rahner and Yves Conger to name but a few. I close tonight quoting Giles again on page 169 of this great work, "I have not found a Roman Catholic theologian who gives any support to the idea that the Son is eternally subordinated in any way".
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12 of 16 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars Incredibly important book, July 15, 2006
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This review is from: Jesus and the Father: Modern Evangelicals Reinvent the Doctrine of the Trinity (Paperback)
This book discusses how the Godhead is to be conceived in Christianity. As Voltaire wrote "God made man in his image and man returned the favor." The temptation to make God in our image is always with us and results in nothing less than a false "god" and therefore is idolatrous. We see how some evangelicals (like Wayne Grudem) are rewriting history and word definitions in order to promote the Arian idea of the eternal subordination of the Son in order to promote the subordination of women in family and church.
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3 of 4 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars This is the one., March 22, 2007
This review is from: Jesus and the Father: Modern Evangelicals Reinvent the Doctrine of the Trinity (Paperback)
Expanding on his earlier work, The Trinity and Subordinationism (IVP, 2002), Giles provides a thorough response to his critics with greater depth and insight. He makes his point strongly from biblical, theological, and historical grounds. If you read any book on the doctrine of the Trinity as it pertains to current debates, this is the one to read.
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5 of 10 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars NOW I UNDERSTAND!, October 24, 2006
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This review is from: Jesus and the Father: Modern Evangelicals Reinvent the Doctrine of the Trinity (Paperback)
This was a hard book for me in the beginning, much new terminology, but as I kept going I realized that it brought clarity to SO MUCH of what I was witnessing and experiencing in the church.

An excellent companion read would be Paul R. Smith's "Is it okay to call God Mother: Considering the Feminine Face of God." Where Kevin Giles leaves off Paul R. Smith picks up in a book that is a much easier read. We perish for lack of knowledge. Some of us intuitively understand that SOMETHING is not right, but lack the background to discern WHAT is amiss. It used to be "enough" to just love Jesus, but to worship in spirit and TRUTH it is good to have a deeper understanding of truth and where leadership is trying to take us. Both books are worthy reads.
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0 of 2 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars Excellent!, August 11, 2008
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Vashti (California) - See all my reviews
This review is from: Jesus and the Father: Modern Evangelicals Reinvent the Doctrine of the Trinity (Paperback)
This is by far and away the best work I have ever read on the complex Christian doctrine of the Trinity. It is a scholarly and well-documented work which is easily understandable and surprisingly edifying. Should be read in conjunction with another book by the same author, The Trinity And Subordinationism. As the evangelical church sinks ever deeper into the dark mists of semi-Arianism, this book is a refreshing breath of fresh air which helps clear away the cobwebs of confusion and misunderstanding being spun by certain modern-day theologians who seem to have a hidden agenda. Should be included in every church's Bible study programme.
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