Customer Reviews


12 Reviews
5 star:
 (2)
4 star:
 (3)
3 star:
 (1)
2 star:
 (1)
1 star:
 (5)
 
 
 
 
 
Average Customer Review
Share your thoughts with other customers
Create your own review
 
 
Only search this product's reviews

The most helpful favorable review
The most helpful critical review


16 of 20 people found the following review helpful:
4.0 out of 5 stars fair play and the interpretation of a legend
Warner's book has more archival material and historical background detail than any other single work in this price-range or level of reader-access. Yes, Warner also presents opinions, as scholar/critics tend to do.

If, however, you turn to Regine Pernoud for an "unbiased" version of Joan's life -- whatever that might be -- you are on much more dangerous...

Published on April 10, 2000 by Julia M. Walker

versus
42 of 49 people found the following review helpful:
1.0 out of 5 stars Only A Vague Resemblance to Joan's History
As a researcher who has done work on this subject, I tend to be baffled by the popularity of books such as this one. On the plus side, and to be fair, the author at least bothered to read some of the more reliable documents (such as the Rehabilitation transcript, Joan's surviving letters, etc) rather than merely the Condemnation transcript; but unfortunately the author...
Published on October 31, 2000


‹ Previous | 1 2 | Next ›
Most Helpful First | Newest First

42 of 49 people found the following review helpful:
1.0 out of 5 stars Only A Vague Resemblance to Joan's History, October 31, 2000
By A Customer
This review is from: Joan of Arc: The Image of Female Heroism (Paperback)
As a researcher who has done work on this subject, I tend to be baffled by the popularity of books such as this one. On the plus side, and to be fair, the author at least bothered to read some of the more reliable documents (such as the Rehabilitation transcript, Joan's surviving letters, etc) rather than merely the Condemnation transcript; but unfortunately the author didn't seem to pay much attention to the more reliable documents. Yet again, we have here a modern author who credulously accepts many of the accusations made by Joan's enemies while passing over the larger amount of evidence which soundly debunks those accusations, while mixing in a hefty dose of radical politics and speculation, plus page after page in which the text wanders through ancient legends and other such topics to the point that Joan herself is often obscured entirely. A good example of this is the "Ideal Androgyne" chapter, which ignores the extensive testimony from the Rehabilitation transcript: i.e., two of the men who escorted her to Chinon said that they were the ones who first brought up the subject of dressing her in soldiers' clothing (as was standard procedure when bringing a woman through dangerous territory), and several of the clergy who took part in her trial testified that she clung to this clothing and kept her pants and tunic "firmly laced and tied" (i.e., the pants were kept fastened to the tunic so they couldn't be forcibly pulled off) because she had been subjected to attempted rape at the hands of her guards and therefore was afraid of "being violated in the night", to quote one witness. To a scholar of the medieval period none of this comes as a surprise: it was common for women to adopt such clothing for their own defense, and medieval theologians - including St. Thomas Aquinas himself - had ruled that such conduct was permissible if it was being done out of necessity (the Church only condemned the practice if it was done for other reasons, a distinction which Joan's accusers deliberately ignored, as do many modern authors). Despite the author's claims to the contrary, this subject was in fact dealt with at the Rehabilitation, and in fact the Inquisitor devoted an entire section - Chapter 6 of his "Recollectio" - to that subject, and exonerated her of any wrongdoing on that front. He also ruled that her voices were not suspect (despite the author's claims to the contrary), and in fact declared her a martyr ("...for in very truth she always had good reason to trust in her apparitions, for they delivered her, just as they promised, from the prison of the body through martyrdom and a great victory of patience.") Warner's book replaces much of this evidence with speculation, endless political rhetoric, and modern philosophies which have nothing whatsoever to do with 15th century history.

On the point about Régine Pernoud: the charge that Pernoud was a hopeless fan of Charles VII who omitted to mention the letter about the siege of Paris is patently false: the entire text of that letter is included (both in the original language and in translation) in Pernoud's book "Joan of Arc: Her Story" [called simply "Jeanne d'Arc" in the French version], and many of her books contain scathing criticisms of Charles VII. Scholars consider Pernoud to have been one of the best authors on this subject because she was accurate, thorough, and honest in her presentation of the evidence, which is not something that can be said about the book currently under review. And there lies the crux of the issue: historical writing is supposed to be based upon documented evidence, properly analyzed in light of the circumstances of the time period, rather than a mishmash of modern-day politics superimposed upon historical figures and events. This book falls into the latter category, unfortunately.

Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


16 of 20 people found the following review helpful:
1.0 out of 5 stars Warner's "Joan of Arc...", August 7, 2002
By A Customer
This review is from: Joan of Arc: The Image of Female Heroism (Paperback)
It's curious to see that the author noted Regine Pernoud in the Acknowledgments, given that Pernoud opposed the fraudulent claims about Joan that this book promotes. Here's a summary of merely a few such errors.
- While the author at least admits that Joan was put on trial by the English and Burgundians, she nevertheless glosses over the implications of this and does little more than repeat the 'spin' which Joan's enemies placed on the theological matters under debate. A main theme is the notion that since Joan saw visions "apprehensible to the human senses" she would automatically be guilty of a grave offense in the pre-Renaissance era, which is truly ironic: in the Bible itself, there are many cases of angels not only manifesting themselves in corporeal form (e.g., the appearance of Gabriel to Mary), but in fact some such appearances were sufficiently physical as to be seen by many people (such as the angel(s) who appeared at Christ's empty tomb). To accept this book's argument you'd have to claim that the medieval Church viewed the Bible itself as heretical. Similarly, it is claimed that Joan was guilty for never telling the clergy about her visions - despite the patent fact that she had gained approval from the clergy at Poitiers, from the Archbishop of Embrun, from Jean Gerson, and so on, some of which Warner herself admits.
Warner uses much the same distortion with regards to La Pierronne, who was killed by a similar pro-English group from the University of Paris after she had dared to say that Joan was a good Catholic. No "witchcraft" charges were filed against her: the only thing they could come up with was the absurd notion that she was guilty of blasphemy for saying that she saw God clothed in a white robe and red tunic (as opposed to what, one wonders?) Warner never seems to consider that the charges in such partisan trials might be nothing but bunk promoted by the opposing faction, devoid of any valid theological basis.
On a final note on this subject: Warner at least admits that Joan had threatened to lead a crusading army against a heretical group called the Hussites, but merely sees this as another chance to heap more empty criticism on Joan. This time the charge is "intolerance", strangely ignoring a few obvious points: 1) far from being docile theologians who merely held dissident views, the Hussites were a military faction which had recently gone on a savage rampage across large swaths of the Holy Roman Empire, destroying many hundreds of villages. To label her "intolerant" for being willing to lead an army against such a group is either deliberately unfair sniping, or a clear sign of ignorance about the nature of the Hussites. 2) You would think that the author would at least possess the fairness to admit that if Joan wanted to lead a crusading army against heretics, she could hardly be a heretic herself.
- In the chapter "Ideal Androgyne", Warner again makes copious use of the propaganda spooled out by Joan's enemies while ignoring the eyewitness accounts of those who had actually known her - not only at the Rehabilitation but also in private letters and memoirs written by her soldiers - who described her as "beautiful and shapely", commented on her feminine qualities, etc. Similarly, the author completely ignores the quotes from Joan herself concerning the practical necessity of wearing soldiers' clothing (of a type which had "laces and points" which allowed her to tie the pants and tunic together), partly as a defense against rape while in prison as well as to discourage sexual advances while bedding down with her army in the field. This was the accepted way of doing it in that era, and if it was thus being done out of necessity the Church itself granted permission (see medieval theological works such as St. Thomas Aquinas' "Summa Theologica", St. Hildegard's "Scito Vias Domini", and so on). The accounts say that in the end her guards maneuvered her into a "relapse" by leaving her nothing to wear but her old male clothing, and she had no choice but to put it back on after arguing with them "until noon", according to one eyewitness. Warner replaces this evidence with speculation.
- In the chapter "Amazon", the author ignores Joan's own recorded quotations stating that she did _not_ fight in battle but instead carried her banner, a view which is backed up by the more reliable eyewitness accounts. This evidence is replaced with a sidetrack through ancient mythology, as if such would somehow be relevant. We are then told about Joan's alleged "joy in battle", which is entirely fictional: the eyewitness accounts repeatedly say that she wept over the deaths of enemy soldiers.
- The book's claims about the Rehabilitation are largely false. For instance, the claim is made that the tribunal never declared Joan's holiness and never vindicated her decision to wear soldiers' clothing, which is wrong on both counts: the Inquisitor specifically labeled her a martyr for the faith - practically the highest possible declaration of holiness; and he devoted an entire section to the clothing issue (see Part VI of his 'Recollectio Frater Johannis Brehali'). It would help if authors would at least bother to actually read such documents before giving an 'analysis' of their contents.
It is truly sad to see this book in reprint, as it does a great disservice to the heroine whose life is here being filtered through the dishonest claims of the men who cruelly put her to death. As the Acknowledgments allude to, the books of Regine Pernoud (founder of the Centre Jeanne d'Arc) are recognized as the best of the readily-obtainable books on the subject; two of these are available here at Amazon.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


16 of 20 people found the following review helpful:
4.0 out of 5 stars fair play and the interpretation of a legend, April 10, 2000
By 
This review is from: Joan of Arc: The Image of Female Heroism (Paperback)
Warner's book has more archival material and historical background detail than any other single work in this price-range or level of reader-access. Yes, Warner also presents opinions, as scholar/critics tend to do.

If, however, you turn to Regine Pernoud for an "unbiased" version of Joan's life -- whatever that might be -- you are on much more dangerous ground. Pernoud conveys opinion by omission; if a document is at odds with her reading of Joan's life or actions, she simply ignores it, leaving it unmentioned. An example of this is a crucial letter Joan dictated on the necessity of taking Paris. Yes, Pernoud IS French (or rather, she was), and she writes as though she has on-line access to 15th-century feelings and personal opinions -- a big problem, in my view. But Pernoud's relentlessly pro-Charles interpretation of events is much more distorting and misleading than anything generated by Warner's British feminism, which is fairly presented as the lense through which the material will be viewed.

If you want another good book on Joan, try Charles Wood's study of Joan and Richard II.

No one scholar is going to write a book which satisfies everyone on such a complex figure. But Warner is a good place to start reading and/or thinking about Joan of Arc.

Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


11 of 14 people found the following review helpful:
1.0 out of 5 stars Not recommended., February 28, 2000
By A Customer
This review is from: Joan of Arc: The Image of Female Heroism (Paperback)
This book appears to follow the currently trendy practice of piling up all of the collected dead wood of past opinions while largely ignoring the evidence - evidence which is exhaustive and indisputable in the case of Joan of Arc. We know that she was not a 'rebel against the Church' - that was proven by the Inquisition at the Rehabilitation Trial in the 1450s (the presiding Inquisitor at this trial described her as a martyr for the Catholic faith, for heaven's sake). We know that she wore male clothing only to protect herself against sexual abuse - that was also proven by the testimony at the retrial, and echoed at many points in Joan's own testimony at the Condemnation Trial in 1431. Her political opponents tried to claim otherwise, as does Marina Warner; but they should have known better than that.

Ironically, the prologue tells us that "unlike a fictional character, she does not belong to the mind of a writer... She has objective reality". Quite true. So why not let that objective reality shine forth through the fog of opinion, bias, and propaganda? All I can say is: there are other authors who are far more honest with the facts.

Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


6 of 7 people found the following review helpful:
3.0 out of 5 stars Not a summer beach book, June 16, 2000
By A Customer
This review is from: Joan of Arc: The Image of Female Heroism (Paperback)
Joan of Arc is interesting and informative. It is not, however, an ordinary history book. I enjoyed the first half of the book; Ms. Warner looks at all of the information in creative ways that don't ordinarily appear in most history books. The problem many people will have is that this is not just a history book. It deals with the perception of Joan as an icon, heroine or whatever(It is subtitled The Image of Female Heroism). The problem for me came with the second half of the book. Most readers will not enjoy the examination of semantics, symbolism, Jung, and any of the countless mythical and historical figures. I say all of this despite the fact that I was prepared to criticise the other critics in the review section. I thought perhaps they resented the feminist angle. After reading the whole book I can say that the second half will wear you out; it is a tough read only for those with more interest or intellect than myself.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


16 of 22 people found the following review helpful:
2.0 out of 5 stars Badly Flawed., November 28, 1999
By A Customer
This review is from: Joan of Arc: The Image of Female Heroism (Paperback)
I wanted to like this book; but despite the reasonable amount of research that went into it, the author ignores so much of the evidence and invents so many of her own fantasized views about Joan (some of which are merely repetitions of the slander levelled against her by her enemies) that it qualifies as distortion rather than history. Try one of Regine Pernoud's books (offered here at Amazon) instead.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


9 of 12 people found the following review helpful:
1.0 out of 5 stars Only Marginally Historical, April 29, 2000
By A Customer
This review is from: Joan of Arc: The Image of Female Heroism (Paperback)
It's hard to know where to begin with this book, since it seems that virtually every paragraph contains errors or misconceptions that could be commented upon. The chief problem, as with so many similar books, is the author's reliance upon the claims made by Joan's enemies and their lackeys, rather than the more objective medieval documents. Was it considered heretical to claim direct inspiration from God? Hardly: St. Hildegard von Bingen and St. Catherine of Siena are just two examples of women who claimed such inspiration and found immense favor with the medieval Church. Did the Rehabilitation Trial merely find fault with the procedures of the Condemnation Trial without exonerating Joan herself? No: the presiding Archbishop at this retrial declared her to be "washed clean" of any suspicion of guilt, and the Inquisitor described her as a martyr, adding that "...not only do her replies dispel all suspicion of error or artifice, but every word speaks to the most devout piety". The list can go on.

If you want to buy a book which gives the reader their money's worth of _accurate_ historical material, I would suggest "Joan of Arc: Her Story" by Regine Pernoud (who is almost universally considered to have been the most accurate expert on St. Joan, nitpicky attempts at criticism aside).

Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


6 of 8 people found the following review helpful:
4.0 out of 5 stars Thoughtful and challenging examination of Joan of Arc, February 16, 2000
This review is from: Joan of Arc: The Image of Female Heroism (Paperback)
It's good to see this title back in print again, and I can only hope that this new edition also includes the illustrations of the eighties original. Warner discusses many aspects and offers new interpretations of France's most celebrated warrior-mystic. Whether or not one always agrees with her conclusions, her style is engaging and her depth of research and passion for the subject seem unimpeachable. We can probably never fully comprehend the elusive mystery of Jeanne d'Arc, but this book does an admirable job of looking at and evaluating her life and career and placing them in historical and cultural contexts. Regine Pernoud may offer superior histories, and with less of a feminist agenda (some of which now seems rather awkward and dated), but as a series of extended essays and thought-provoking analyses, this book comes highly recommended.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


5 of 7 people found the following review helpful:
4.0 out of 5 stars Deconstructing Joan, February 16, 2000
This review is from: Joan of Arc: The Image of Female Heroism (Paperback)
Warner writes for the post-modern reader, and the nature of her task is questioning. She questions everything that's ever been knwon or assumed about Joan (except her chasity), which makes for a disorienting but challenging read.She may, in fact, be able to lead us to a better understanding of this incredible historical figure altogether.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


5.0 out of 5 stars An Essential Book For Understanding the "Myths" of Joan, October 2, 2011
This review is from: Joan of Arc: The Image of Female Heroism (Paperback)
As some Joan of Arc fans may know, I composed an entire oratorio, Voices of Light, inspired by Joan's story and by Carl Dreyer's great film, The Passion of Joan of Arc. Marina Warner's book was a major influence on the piece.

I'm writing this to take issue with other reviewers here who have wrongly, in my mind, eviscerated Warner's great work. As I'm not an historian, I can't speak to the alleged inaccuracies. What I can say is that the book is clearly not so much about the historical Joan as it is about the various images and "ideas" of Joan that persisted during her lifetime and afterwards. She first achieved hero status, as Warner states, not in the traditional ways that women did - and often still - do but rather through her achievements as an astonishingly brave warrior. Her experience at the trial transcended even that achievement. Since then, Joan's image has been adopted, co-opted, exploited, modified and transformed by numerous, often mutually antagonistic groups: French nationalists, communists (Joan's icon was found in Vietnamese tunnels); gay American women; right wing extremists; and artists. Warner's book describes and analyses this remarkable after-life and does an utterly brilliant job at it.

I strongly recommend this book.

Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No


‹ Previous | 1 2 | Next ›
Most Helpful First | Newest First

This product

Joan of Arc: The Image of Female Heroism
Joan of Arc: The Image of Female Heroism by Marina Warner (Paperback - November 4, 1999)
$21.95
In Stock
Add to cart Add to wishlist