Customer Reviews

Kill Or Get Killed: Riot Control Techniques, Manhandling, and Close Combat for Police and the Military

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"Kill or Get Killed" is not about self-defense. Rex Applegate wrote this book for offensive combat. In his chapter on handguns, Applegate wrote that there was no defending with the handgun-he trained his students to ATTACK first. The chapters on unarmed and improvised weapon fighting were about asymmetrical combat-your enemy might have a knife, and you had a chair. The sections on riot control may seem to have little bearing on personal defense; Applegate wrote "Riot Control Material and Techniques" during the turbulent 1960's.

"Kill or Get Killed" is history. It was cutting-edge stuff in 1943, and will still work today. I refer to "expert systems" and "idiot systems" for personal combat-the former will be very effective, but you need years of training (synthetic experience) under the guidance of a competent instructor and with full school facilities. "Idiot systems" have limited effectiveness, but within 40 hours or so of drilling with another student you will be an effective combatant. "Kill or Get Killed" is what I call an "idiot system" and it follows the KISS principle. If you think you can read a comic book and become a super ninja commando in less than fifteen minutes, reality will soon prove the error of your ways. On the other hand, if you read "Kill or Get Killed," then use it to produce a training program, then actually do the drills involved, within a few weeks of hard work you'll be more dangerous to an attacker than your attacker is to you. There are better methods of close quarter shooting with pistol and long gun-Rex Applegate produced a video on modern point shooting. A word about point shooting versus using the sights-you need to do both to be a competent shooter. For handgun shooting, if you lack the time and other resources to do it right, the "Kill or Get Killed" technique will work. The OSS sometimes had only an hour or two of firearms training for its agents before they were dropped behind enemy lines with a .32 automatic pistol for moral support. Just keep in mind that your effective range will be about ten feet-Applegate claims fifty feet for the handgun, but that is for someone who has first been trained in the traditional "target pistol" course to 50 yards, then put through the entire OSS shooting school. I corresponded with the late Colonel Applegate to clear up a few points about his pistol techniques, and I trained some of the Camp Doha Security Force officers in the point shooting techniques in addition to the standard FM 23-35 pistol course during five years on the Camp Doha security force. These shooters had been trained, but had trouble qualifying-and also were deficient in gun fighting skills. One of the firing tables took place at 7 meters-the officer was to draw his 9mm, rack the slide, and put 5 shots in the silhouette target in under 12 seconds. Most of the officers didn't manage to get their M9 pistol out and fire one shot (they would often accidentally engage the safety while racking the slide). After about 30 minutes of dry fire practice and "presentation drills" these security officers were able to draw from their M12 duty holsters and hit the target in about three seconds, finishing their five shots in under seven-still slow, but better. When starting with pistol in a "low ready" (pioneered by Sykes and Fairbairn and passed on to Applegate) they were able to respond and put two shots into the target almost immediately. The ITT training officer on the range was impressed, to say the least.

The techniques in "Kill or Get Killed" work. Some are not court-proof today. You have to drill to standard, and keep drilling. There are better products out there, but "Kill or Get Killed" will work okay. Point shooting is coming back as part of a competent handgunner's skill set. The hand-to-hand combat techniques work so long as you get in the best possible physical condition and maintain that, and you practice, practice, practice, and you act first when confronted with force. I have used "Kill or Get Killed" as a close combat training manual since 1973, a couple of years before enlisting in the US Marines.

One inadvertent by-product is that when I watch war movies, I can tell the difference between vintage techniques and modern-the modern techniques were used in movies such as "Saving Private Ryan." Be warned-realistic and intensive training may make willing suspension of disbelief difficult!

The review posted here by Alan D. Cranford touched on all the high points that I would mention and with an expertise that is quite beyond mine. I want to zero in on a fine point about the philosophy espoused in this book versus the "martial arts" mentality so prevalent today, particularly as it bears on unarmed defense against a man wielding a knife.

Another reviewer summed up what I call the "martial arts mentality" when he recommends studying Krav Maga to learn unarmed techniques for disarming a knife-wielding attacker. Where it says "Krav Maga," you may substitute the name of any fighting system, traditional or made-up, and there you have a statement that would fit into a discouragingly large number of martial arts books and schools.

I'll be blunt. For at least 99% of us, the phrase "knife disarm" is just crazy talk, and if you try such a thing in real life, you will probably die.

Assuming you are lucky enough to notice that a person is threatening you with a knife before he has stuck the knife in you, and assuming you are not at the moment pointing a weapon at him, your number one priority should be getting away from that knife so that he can't cut or stab you with it. Because if he starts doing that, you will probably die.

And at the risk of belaboring the obvious, if you go reaching for a guy's knife arm, he will almost certainly cut and stab you plenty, even if he's a complete punk out of his mind on booze or drugs. If you go near the knife, the knife will probably go in you. I hope that's clear enough.

What Applegate advises is decidedly not to grapple with the knife guy. Instead, he says to pick up a chair and use it lion-tamer style. That's excellent advice. Pick up anything-- a shovel, a bar stool, even a sturdy broom-- anything that'll brush knife boy back a little while you think about how to get some distance. You can yell for help, throw things, dodge behind furniture or cars, all to one end: keeping that knife out of you.

Applegate advises this kind of thing because he was advising men who might one day face a knife-wielding attacker, and he did not want them to get killed. Applegate's advice comes from the real world, not from a gym or a dojo or a competitive sport. Go to the bookstore, open a book on Krav Maga or any other book containing "knife disarms," look at the pictures, and think about that.

Are you a Navy SEAL or similar? Fine, if so, then feel free to break knife boy into small pieces with your bare hands. You know better than I do. But if the answer is "no, I am not a Navy SEAL," then the chances are good that you ought to take all those martial arts books with pictures of knife disarms in them and burn them. Better yet, give them to people you wouldn't mind seeing dead.

I can envision a scenario where I'm attacked with a knife and have no better choice than to twist the guy's arm. If that happens, then things have really gone to hell, and I am in deep, deep trouble. But I've been taught how to twist arms, and so I'll twist if I absolutely have to. What I will not do, ever, is call that a "knife disarm" or deliberately train myself to grapple with a knife wielder. If I'm ever in a gym or dojo, and another student squares off with me with a rubber knife, I'm picking up the nearest chair or stool and going for his tender parts. Because what you practice is what you'll do, and your mentality will one day be your reality.

That's what Applegate's work means to me, and I find that it's a refreshing antidote to the martial arts mindset for the 99% of us who are not full-time professional fighters.

Kill or Get Killed; In twenty-five years of study in the field of self-defence and combat I have never read a more concise and realistic work. Colonel Applegate is a man who has been there and done that. His unique insights and simple techniques are easy to read, follow, and understand, and they come, not from some Dojo or firearms compitition, but from years of service, both to his own country and others around the world. If you want to KNOW how to defend yourself, come what may, buy this book and memorize every page.

This book tells it the way it is. Long ago, dirty fighting wasn't our way of doing things. Cheap shots were unacceptable, and the good guy always wore the white hat. Our country went to war, and our troops were getting beat down and killed by a brutal enemy who had no rules. This book helped change all that. Written by Col. Rex Applegate, formerly of the OSS, it taught a lot of combat troops how to fight to win- to be as brutal and savage as the enemy. Applegate's classic text shows all the tricks to disable or kill the enemy with a knife, gun and even your bare hands. No fancy moves, no John Wayne nonsense (sorry Duke), and no BS!! This is the real deal!

The pages on close combat is the best part of the book and more than justifies the price. The chapters on small arms is interesting as well, teaching cover, concealment, and point shooting, as opposed to aimed fire. It's obvious thst Col. Applegate was an advocate of realistic firearms training (silhouette targets in a killhouse opposed to bullseyes at the range), and although some of the techniques and weapons depicted are dated, it makes for good reading, and one could learn the fundamentals of combat shooting from these chapters. Police officers could learn a few defensive tactics that may give them the edge they need in a streetfight or while trying to subdue a combative suspect, but I would not recommend the use of some of the techniques for handling prisoners, as they are very outdated and unsafe....Also interesting is Applegate's chapter on battling Communist tactics and stategy, a bit of nostalgia for all you Cold War Commandos, ready to take on the reds!

Read this book and LIVE!!...

Kill or Get Killed, despite the rather ominous sounding title, is probably one of the best texts on self defense and unarmed combat ever written.Many of the techniques shown are still very useful today,despite the fact that the book was written during W.W.2.It's a real classic, yet very practical book that anyone interested in true self defense and hand-to-hand combat will treasure and learn a great deal from.Highly recommended!

This book is an essential for anyone who is interested in the basics of self defense.

When Applegate wrote this, many Americans had the mindset that self protection had to be conducted with a gentlemanly approach. Due to lessons learned in WWII (and that have certainly been magnified in recent years), he corrected that notion for readers of this book.

The section on defensive unarmed combat is excellent and timeless. The methods of 'dirty fighting' are basic to one who is in a life and death struggle. He addresses weaknesses of human anatomy and how to exploit them and has a number of great techniques for self defense.

The section on point shooting is also very good for those who carry a handgun for protection. He does a great job of highlighting the weaknesses of target type shooting for handgun training for self defense/combat situations. He has a solid section on point shooting.

There are large parts of the book that are dedicated to subjects that are not very applicable to readers who are not military or law enforcement types such as mob control, chemical munitions, and raiding techniques.

There are also parts that are quite outdated on subjects like body armor, specific weapons, holsters, etc.

In spite of all that, the sections on close combat are worth the price and could be valuable for anyone who finds himself/herself in an ugly situation with a criminal, etc.

The pictures may seem outdated and old but this book is by far the best source of information you will ever need to escape, attack, and win any dangerous encounter or fight. I recomend reading along with this a book on balance and break falls in ju jitsu to aid your defensive tactics as this book speaks alot about balance and falls but does not explain them. Escaping guns, knives, or bigger and stronger people this book as it all as well as attacking with guns, knives, or hand to hand combat with bigger and stronger oppenents. I recomend this book to anyone who is interested in these techniques, these are very easy to read, understand, and apply. "Wise people talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something" Plato. Rex Applegate is a wise man skip those other combat books with authors trying to make a living and read the one that has value. Amazon has the cheapest book around 37$ but this site http://usbjj.com./10401.html has it for just 10$ on CD ROm its the entire book but you just have to read it from the computer. Very worth it and save yourself the extra 30$ and buy the CD Rom version.

This book was designed as an encyclopedic examination of the best ways to handle yourself on the battlefield, or behind enemy lines, or as a cop in a tough spot.

It is emphatically NOT for a high school kid who is being bullied, unless that kid wants to be bullied at Folsom instead of in high school.

It is the result of a lot of study, including study with Fairbairn (get all of his books if this book speaks to you), and it shows it.

While this is an overview and exposition of techniques of offensive self defense and the use of knives and guns and crowd control (including tear gas and handcuffs), it is an overview that was at the cutting edge when it was written during and after World War II. Obviously, there are developments (new handguns and handcuffs) and new guidelines for use of force. And by the same token, these are techniques that worked and work, although if you use a chin jab or neckbreaker or ear slap during a fistfight in a bar, you will need to hire a good lawyer and you may well go to jail, depending on whether a group of folks believed what you did was justifiable. And rules differ from jurisdiction to jurisdiction.

The techniques in this book are effective and useful in the most severe situations. They are certainly not the only sorts of techniques that work in fights, nor all the fighting techniques that work in fights. They are specifically designed for battlefield use.

The use of "pre-emptive" techniques (hitting first) is strongly recommended in this book, because they work.

Certain well-thought-out choices show up in this book. There is virtually no emphasis on groundfighting of any kind, based on the thought that while you grappled with your opponent, his compatriots would be kicking you in the head. And Applegate believed that the best groundfighting techniques for you involved your boots applied to his prone body.

Do not give this book to children or anybody with an anger control problem. Do not think that this book is for fun. It's not.

Do consider the study of this book if you're going into a war zone. The insight it provides for that sort of environment seems priceless.

But if you try these attack-defense techniques at the local bar, brush up on your letter-writing skills, because the chances are you'll be doing time and writing to your family instead of seeing them. And if you avoid the police, you'll still have to deal with the civil suit.

But this is a professional product for professionals who deal with high levels of violence. And my guess is that if you need these techniques, you really need them a lot.

This is the sort of thing that people are talking about when they talk about World War II combatives.

The title says it all. In war time or in a true life or death self-defense situation that is the only option; kill or get killed. All parties interested in realistic self-defense must accept this concept and act appropriately . This book is not for those "Paper Tiger" black belts or sudo warriors. The princples and concepts are as relevant today as they were 58 years ago, when the data for this book was compiled. Some of the weapons and technical data is outdated, yet the goal is the same; survival... The point shooting techniques are practical and realistic and have proven to be reproducible under the stress of a lethal encounter; unlike those target shooting techniques of the weaver stance. The tactcis and techniques that Col. Applegate learned from Fairbairn and Sykes is one of the most effective and practical systems of training for survival during close quarter combat situations, especially given the time limits to train recruits. Granted if more time were allowed for training (every trainer desires more time to teach recruits) other techniques would be added and more practice could be conducted. Some of the hand to hand techniques are questionable, i.e. knife hand chops, but for the most part a very capable curriculum for training soldiers, police officers and citizens in the survival concepts and tactics. If one is not prepared to take the life of another in a true life or death encounter, than that individual should not even attempt to consider themselves capable of self-defense; especially soldiers.

This book is full of information that you can actually use. The ideas given are simple, to the point, and do not require twenty years of continuous practice to master. You can tell that the material was born of real fighting and not martial arts contests. If you could only get one single book on fighting, this should be the one you buy.