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1,243 of 1,343 people found the following review helpful
on November 17, 2010
Thank you for reading my review and I hope it helps you get off the fence on this great item.

Being an owner of roughly every console since the Atari 2600 (yes I'm in my late 30's) I could not help but give my review of this system and a couple of games we picked up along with the Kinect system. I remember standing at a best buy for hours before buying the WII on launch day. It was a fresh concept with a new direction and revolutionary in what it did and how it did it. We enjoyed it but with the lack of strong first person titles it got old. But because it was revolutionary it endured and was a smash success despite it's lack of many quality games (yes it had great experiences) but not deep gameplay (though Twighlight Princess was a great game and showed the potential of the system) Here we are about 4 years later and with only minor exceptions the WII has found success by catering to children and the casual crowd along with providing some excellant fitness type concepts. I bring all of this up because it leads me to the purpose of this review.

As a gamer that enjoys COD and Halo along with all of the other staple franchise properties out there I found myself on the fence about the MOVE and KINECT systems. I've learned that not every concept works and sometimes a company is just trying to keep up with the Jones' rather than making a product that it plans to support and grow it's participant base. Clearly both Sony and Microsoft have been working on this technology for years but facts are facts... The Move is just not revolutionary in any way. It is a refined (yes very refined) Wii experience. The graphics are better by far and the company will put it's weight behind the product (as Sony always does) and likely it will have success of it's own.

But owning all systems and having put the Wii through its paces why would I buy a better looking Wii? The Controller is silly looking but even getting passed that, what does it do different than the Wii? We can argue graphics all day long and it is a valid arguement but seriously... It's a better version of something we have already seen and experienced. Until it does ANYTHING I haven't experienced before it's a pass for me. I've tried it in stores on demo. I have not bought it. I realize that this makes my arguement less credible as I don't own one. I have played it and tried out several games. It's the Wii on steroids. The games are what you might expect... First generation and meant to show its functionality. But it does nothing of note that my Wii doesn't. Being late to the party even if you refined the product is just not that exciting... yet. I say yet because this could change with a press release or an addition to the functionality of the system.

Which brings me to the Kinect... I have a wife that games with me (plays Halo along with more interactive games(rock band, dj hero, Lips) I have 3 children- ages 10, and twins that are 3 years old. So my gaming is not exclusive to my own tastes. I might buy Call of Duty Black Ops and Kirby in the same checkout. So I evaluate and research this thoroughly before making a jump to buy anything. I was going to pass on both the MOVE and KINECT but I have friends in the gaming industry and they told me that I should NOT pass up on the Kinect and further I should buy it now as it was likely the supply would be in question by xmas. So after several trips to best buy and Eb games I bit the bullet on a reccomendation and bought it.

IT does not look like much. It is a bit pricey at retail 150.00 at EB Games. But you get a game along with it which really makes them equal in price (sort of) For example (and I priced this hardcore)

Move kit is $99 (tricky part to Sony's offering is the following) It comes with one contoller, the eye toy, and a game (no navigation controller). IF you want to play multiplayer you will have to buy another controller at around $60.00 and an additional Navigation Controller) total would be around $230 and you have just one game to play so go spend another $50 on that. Kind of tricky if you ask me. The Move was the lower cost option I heard at one time. But this is clearly a falsehood. I felt the same trickery when I bought the Wii. Classic controllers versus Wii remote? Had to buy another controller for your friends and then there was the possibility the controller would break and you might have to buy another one (or a new TV). My kids tore one of them up in around a month. So there is an upkeep involved in keeping the "car" on the road with both of these systems.

That's why I bit on the Kinect... NO CONTROLLER!!!!!! NO need to buy any more of em. No need to charge them or to replace them. I guess you just have to worry about breaking an arm or a leg because YOU are the controller.

I didn't believe it could work. I had heard of Project Natal and thought that this was the next generation in systems. But Microsoft- for all of the delays and the fact that they were the last system to make it to retail- was simply biding their time. This is revolutionary. At $150 you get the Kinect Sensor and one game (kinect adventures)The game is Ok but is more to show some of the things that the system is capable of. It was easy to take it out of the box and plug it in. It was strangely small and unexciting at first look. You might even think to yourself... Really? $150 for this? But once you get the cords attached and start it up (and it's simple to plug it in and get going) you will be met with a stange feeling. The menus are navigated by voice command and hand gestures.

(AN IMPORTANT NOTE ABOUT SPACE REQUIREMENTS)!!!!!!!!

You need to have space on this. Don't believe the reviews that say you don't. Sure you can make it work with 4 feet of distance from your Tv but You need more like 6-10 feet to get the most out of it. And height plays a factor. I'm short 5'6 and so is my wife but we had a friend over who is 6'4 and he needed about an extra foot for the sensor to fully pick him up. So after spending several hours rearranging the entire room to make it work we were ready to go. But keep this in mind- or you, like me, will be sitting there with an opened kinect but no space to play it. That can be a frustrating and tiring reality so plan for it and set the room up in advance.

Once the space is good you are ready to go. There is an instuctional video that walks you through the motions and voice commands. Good to watch it even if tempted to speed passed it. Soon you are in control and you move menus like in the movie (Minority Report when Tom Cruz is using the computer with his hands. It's not that fast but it works that way.

The interface is top notch and you can see why the Xbox Live interface was updated prior to launch for the experience and it works. You can use voice to load the game and connect back to various menus. It is purely magical for a 30 something to see the evolution and what this new product could do for gaming. It is a breath of fresh air.

The Games-----
We bought Sports, Dance Central, and Harry Potter (which is not a full Kinect game (buyer beware))

Kinect sports is great fun. Track and Field is just too much fun. We tried the bowling and a couple other games. The best part to us was not the games (which were alot of fun to play) but the video after the games (the recaps) Gone is the avatar you watched while you jumped the hurdles or threw the Javelin.. In it's place is live video of you and your friends looking like dorks while participating mixed with avatar highlights. IT WORKS!!!!! SO funny!!!! We all were ROLLING on the floor as grown men made the most stupid faces and actions. It was hyserical!!! I am not exagerating. The Sports game is absolutely worth the price and great intro to the concepts you use in games. I give the sports title a solid 8/10 for the game itself and a 9/10 for the fun factor.

Dance Central was also great fun. It is a one player game (somewhat missleading but I'd done my research on it) but there are times in game where people not playing can jump in and freestyle. The lack of multiplayer was but a small problem though as you can switch off and will want to if you are doing it right. The motion capture works FANTASTICLY on BOTH of the prior mentioned games and is only very, very, slightly laggy. I think the games individually dictate this problem. Some are going to be better then others at using the technology but do your research and stay away from the dogs (ie.. Sonic, fighting etc.) Yes there are bad launch titles much like every other system. Dance Central teaches you dance moves and counts your calories as you dance. IT is a work out and you will feel stupid making the motions but it will make you sweat and laugh and it also has the real video mixed with the avatars actions. Good stuff and a solid 8-9/10. There are around 35 songs and more for download if you want to expand the song library but the opening titles will keep you coming back to perfect the moves. This is the best launch title I have played for the kinect.

I have not tried other games yet but will update as I do. I spent too much time moving chairs and couches to make it fit my man cave. It was worth the effort as it is a magical feeling when you stand in your living room using your very EMPTY hand to make things happen. I don't see me getting tired of it and who else has this technology? Well, considering the MOVE is out and the Wii is overexposed it will likely be some time before the competition launches there own version. They will have to if they want to compete on the cutting edge!

A Great family purchase. Maybe not for the hardcore gamer yet but it likely will. IF not... it's still pretty cool.
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512 of 566 people found the following review helpful
on November 5, 2010
This is mostly a duplicate review from my Xbox360+Kinect Bundle review...

I only found out about Kinect a couple of weeks ago. After reading some of the preliminary reviews, I was intrigued enough that I pre-ordered it almost immediately. Since first finding out about it, I have read as many reviews as I have had time to read. Unfortunately, the more I read the more leery I got about my pre-order. Most of the reviews complained about lag, or the space requirement, or that the games were nothing more than regurgitated Wii games, and how every game title ever developed wasn't re-developed for Kinect on launch day. WTF?

Setting up Kinect was a breeze. Plug and play. A few setup items and you're ready to go.

We moved the coffee table out of the way and moved the couch back a couple of feet to get the 6-8 foot distance recommeded in the documentation. But I don't think you need that much space, honestly. For some of the games, we were as close as 3-4 feet from the Kinect and it worked just fine. I think the space "problem" is a non-issue.

We played Kinect Adventures first, the game that comes in the box. Wii-like? Yes. Fun? Soooooo much more fun than any Wii game I've played. That Kinect can track your every move -- your hands, head, arms, feet, hips, EVERYTHING -- is just amazing. No controller can detect whether you're moving side-to-side, or backwards and forwards, or squatting or jumping while at the same time moving your arms and feet. It's just brilliant how well Kinect works.

One game in particular really shows the potential of this thing. You're in an underwater tank and crazy fish keep poking holes in the glass. You have to plug these holes to keep the water from coming in. In some cases I had to use both hands, both feet, and my head to plug all of the holes...yes, all at the same time. The girlfriend and I had a blast with it. The other games were just as fun.

I think Your Shape best highlighted what Kinect is capable of. You are an infrared replication of yourself on the screen. The shape of my body was precise (unfortunately) and it even picked up the logo on the t-shirt I was wearing. There are numerous exercises you can do and you follow along with an instructor. You have to stay in sync with the intructor to earn points and advance to higher levels and the Kinect does an amazing job of following your every movement and comparing it to the instructor. Not spreading your feet far enough apart? It'll tell you. Not keeping the right rhythm? It'll tell you. It is so much more immersive than anything I've played on the Wii and I can now actually see myself doing Your Shape instead of going to the gym. It's really fantastic.

A lot of the reviews complained about lag, meaning it takes a bit for the Kinect to detect your movements and get them on the screen. Is there lag? Yes, as measured in fractions of a second. Is it noticeable? Only if you're specifically focusing on it. But it's not noticeable during actual game play because you're focusing on the game. And just like with the Wii, you quickly learn to compensate for that fraction of a second difference. It's an absolute non-issue!!!!!

All-in-all, having played three titles (Kinect Adventures, Kinect Sports, and Your Shape) over a span of a couple of hours, the girlfriend and I were exhausted, exhillarated, and amazed at the experience. My girlfriend, being a typical girl, whose life isn't defined by gadgets, even posted on FB that the Kinect really is AMAZING! It more than exceeded our expectations and I couldn't be happier with the purchase. And I am absolutely ecstatic about what Kinect means for the future of gaming. Fully immersive Call of Duty? Yeah, it's coming!

Great job Microsoft! You should be proud of yourselves!
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236 of 269 people found the following review helpful
on November 5, 2010
First off, I have a hard and fast rule - never buy first generation equipment, especially from Microsoft, and especially when it's brand new technology. However, rules are made to be broken, right? :)

My boyfriend's birthday is today, and he really wanted the Kinect for his birthday - it was a sign that it was released the day before his birthday, right? :) So, like a good girlfriend (and fellow gadget addict), I ordered it from Amazon for him and it was waiting for us yesterday when we got home from work. Props to Amazon for flawless release date delivery!

He had it set up before I got home and reported that the setup was very simple. What took the most time was re-configuring the furniture and figuring out the best place to put the sensor. We have the 360S, so the device was plug and play.

We tried the Kinect Sports and Your Shape games, we also have the Adventures game that came with, and I plan on getting the Dance Central game as well.

So far we're very pleased with how the unit works. It definitely takes a little bit of getting used to, but that's the case for any new technology. I know there were reviews about how this isn't good for hardcore gaming - and for us that's fine. He's a gamer (MW2, excited for BlackOps), but if he's going to play those games he's going to use the controller. I am not a big fan of the controller gaming, I am a Rock Band fan - much happier with a mic :)

We bought the Kinect so we could burn some energy and not be such couch potatoes. The shape-up program is really great so far, but I suppose I should take my review for that over to the game.

The acid test for the unit will be tomorrow - birthday party for the boyfriend and we're going to have a bunch of friends over to play games with the Kinect. Kinect Sports has a party setting that should be perfect, but with that many people in the room and players of varying sizes and shapes, I will be very curious to see how it goes.

To sum up -
Pros: Easy setup, recognition is cool, actually burning calories while playing games, chance to get in better shape with a video game (the personal trainer feedback so far is really cool), fun party toy, voice navigation of the Xbox unit

Cons: Had to re-arrange the living room, and in a small apartment it's kind of difficult to do that. Only two players at once. Interface takes some getting used to.

So, all in all, I'm delighted with the purchase and can't wait to see what other cool things this can do. I'm really looking forward to the video chat aspect. I'm also looking forward to the future of video gaming. Using the unit last night I really couldn't help but to think that this is really going to change the video game playing landscape.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

A post-Kinect party update:

The unit worked flawlessly. Space was a little tight, but that's a function of the small house and tall friends. Everyone had a blast either watching or playing the games. Most popular were the games where you could challenge someone else there. The sports game and Dance Central (Yeah! Dance Battle!) were the most popular for that. The unit worked perfectly as far as working great with different people trying the games - 17 of us tried different games at various times and it worked without a hitch. Everyone at the party was jealous of our toy and several people left trying to figure out how they're rearrange their house so they could get one too!

Oh, and we tested out the Xbox Live feature with the ping-pong and boxing parts of Kinect Sports and were pleasantly surprised at just how well it worked. Very little lag and very responsive.

Them I spent an hour or so yesterday on the workout mode of Dance Central and boy I tell you what, I definitely got a good workout. Boyfriend has been doing workouts with the Your Shape game and is also quite pleased.

Love it love it love it love it....
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375 of 446 people found the following review helpful
Short version:
This technology is really cool. If you want to put something awesome under the tree, buy it. Some people will be speechless. Others will not.

I only give the Kinect with Kinect Adventures 3 stars. Some people feel this is harsh. However, I have specific reasons for doing so. The bottom line is:
1) The kinect is very finicky. Its the most finicky accessory I own, and I have a PS3, a wii, and an Xbox 360 with many accessories. The reason its finicky is because of how it works. Your clothing choices can affect its ability to track you. The room lighting can affect whether the face recognition (auto-login) can work. These aren't deal killers, but it's just not perfect. You will still have fun, and most of you will enjoy it even though it's not perfect.
2) The included game - Kinect Adventures - is not as deep as most games are. It has more material than a demo game. But it has less material than a full game. Unlike wii+wii sports (or wii+wii sports resort) you will NOT get weeks and weeks of gameplay from Kinect Adventures. Kinect Adventures IS FUN. But for the price of this product, I expected more.
3) This is not a paradigm shifting technology. For those of you who know videogames, this is a VERY EXCELLENT IMPROVEMENT on what the Playstation 2 "Eye Toy" could do. Considering how finicky the Kinect is, and the fact that Eye Toy technology is so old, I just think the Kinect is just "OK". I am not bowled over by it because, um, I've been around.

I fully expect that the price of the Kinect WILL COME DOWN in the near future and at that price it will be worth at least 4 stars. And the technology will be improved and work better, and it will be worth 4 or 5 stars. For now, I just give it 3.

And yes, I enjoy playing the Kinect and I'm glad I got it.

(end of short version)

Long Version.
There are a lot of videos that have been produced by Microsoft explaining what the Kinect does. I will not be talking about how the technology works, you can watch one of the many advertisements to see that. The Kinect system is really fun and if you are looking for something cool to put under your tree - this is it!

However, there are a few details I am critical about. And, if you have small children I particularly urge you to be very patient with your kinect. The kinect is finicky. The most finicky system out there.

1) The Kinect requires more room to play than any other game experience on the market today. If you can't fit a 9x6 throw rug on the floor, then, you can't play kinect in that room. There are very few children's bedrooms which have enough floor space to play this game. It's a limitation of how it works, and it makes complete sense if you are considering that it is motion control. If you have a small amount of space (say, less than 8 feet) then it is only recommended to play one player at a time. If you have 10 to 12 feet of space in front of your TV, you can play two players at once.

Did you catch that? Who has 10 to 12 feet of dead space in front of their TV? Some people, but not me. My couch is pushed back against the wall now. The coffee table is leaning against the right wall of the room.

2) The Kinect respects a tidy room. It has to establish the "floor" when it starts up. Microsoft has recommended that the floor be clean. The kinect cameras will have a more difficult time if you have clothes, schoolbooks, and papers everywhere. Before you play you may have to clean up a little. This is not a deal breaker, but the point is - its finicky.

3) You must have a well lit area without shadows or gameplay will suffer. Depending on the lights I have on in the room, the kinect may or may not be able to log me in, and often recommends that I set up a new account. When you set up your KinectID, it even recommends that you re-run the tests in different lighting and at different times of day to make sure its accurate. That's finicky. There is no other game system out there which cares enough to make you run tests multiple times a day. If you have a table lamp making a shadow across the game area, it may affect your gameplay (this is per a microsoft kinect video on youtube). The Kinect is slightly more finicky than, well, everything else.

4) During play, its easy to get out of range. Kind of like playing a game with a dance mat, you can work your way too far forward or too far to the side. The Kinect does tell you that this has happened. **This will not be a big deal for kids 12 and over.** But if you have younger kids playing together, they often push each other out of range without meaning to. In the river rapids, one kid will cross over the middle (in excitement) and the other kid just gets pushed out of the play field. You might have to establish the box on the floor or they will get frustrated: we say, if you move off the carpet, the Kinect can't see you - which provides something you can tell with your feet.

5) People who stand up are automatically added into play. People who are not playing should often be to the side, NOT behind the player. When I was watching the Kinetimals ad, I see the Mom and daughter #1 on the couch on the side wall, and daughter #2 playing. The chairs behind the player are empty. When they switch players, the Mom gets up, and the DAUGHTER SITS DOWN ON THE SIDE COUCH. This is an accurate representation of HOW YOU PLAY. But its not the normal way we (or most people I know) orient themselves and play.

Why does this matter? Kids sometimes get tired of sitting and stand up, and the Kinect automatically tries to initialize them as a player whether anyone wants it to. I can even see geriatric people getting up to go to the bathroom in the middle of the game and causing the player to get a lower score. I only mention this because, like the Wii, I feel that the Kinect is an "all ages" system.

As far as partying goes, if you are trying to get a high score, you need to have everyone in the room be a bit more controlled than if you were playing wii or xbox 360 with a controller. Thats right, party, but don't walk around! Don't stand behind the player.

7) It has to be able to map your skeleton. If you are wearing baggy pants, it will not be able to map your legs. Did you ever think your clothing choices would matter? Well, it does now! Children who are 48 inches tall often have problems with the Kinect thinking they are kneeling. This can be compensated somewhat in the setup, but lets be honest: my list of things that can and will go wrong is getting a bit long. The kinect is finicky.

Yes, the Kinect could be that great for you. But no, it won't necessarily be. All of these concerns can be fixed with a little trouble. They aren't deal killers. But the out-of-the-box experience is not always as magical as all of the 5 star reviews claim.

Another reason I am giving this product 3 stars is because the included game does not have as much depth as either the wii sports (which came with the wii) or the Wii Fit game that came with the balance board. I've only been playing on the kinect a few days, and already I feel I need to go out and spend $40 on another game to utilize this new technology for my enjoyment. Don't jump to the wrong conclusion: Kinect Adventures is fun. We enjoyed it. But in my opinion it doesn't have as much lasting power as it should have. I am sure that when the next game arrives in a few days, I will give that GAME a 5 star review.

This slight disappointment with the included game also tends to make me feel that the $150 price tag is a bit much. I'll spend $200 on the Wii, or $200 on the Kinect+1 game, when I've already bought an Xbox 360. Its really easy to see that the Kinect costs a premium. OR you can buy an Xbox with a Kinect for $100 more, without Kinect Adventures. It doesn't take a genius to realize that this means that Kinect Adventures is being sold at a value of (wait for it) $50 and has limited play value. I'm sorry, I'm still shaking my head over it. This bundle is just not worth the money!

I've also been around the block and remember the Playstation Eye toy, and I congratulate the Kinect team on making a motion control sensor that is about 300% better than the Eyetoy, if such an improvement can even be quantified. But. The Eye Toy Play 2 with Camera is still less than $20 and I think the Kinect can come down in price a bit too.

When the price of the kinect comes down, or the included game is improved, or the controls are not so finicky, then I will gladly add a star. Right now, I think the value is "its ok" which is 3 stars.

The BOTTOM LINE:
**Overall I would highly recommend the Kinect.** I think the game is very fun. My wife vastly prefers it to the wii. Anyone who dislikes video games where you have to push certain button combinations will prefer the Kinect. So I do think its worth buying. Its not perfect, but it is different. But I think its far from perfect and THIS BUNDLE does not deserve more than 3 stars.
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111 of 137 people found the following review helpful
Want to check out the new Kinect with your own two eyes? If so, then check out my video review! I show the basic hardware, new dashboard navigation, voice commands, and even some of Kinect Adventures.

Note: I did my best to play and record at the same time, but the camera is a bit shaky in this one.
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52 of 64 people found the following review helpful
on November 6, 2010
Let me start off by saying I am a "hardcore" gamer. I own all the systems and play games quite a bit. I was very skeptical of another wii or move but let me be the first to say it's like nothing you have ever played. My girlfriend was really the one to push me into buying kinect and I am so glad I did. For the last two days we've had so much fun with this thing. My friend coaches soccer and he was floored by how fun soccer is. I've only played around with Kinect Sports, which is a much much much....much better wii sportsFighters Uncaged(amazing, don't listen to the bad reviews) and kinect adventures. All the one star reviews are from people who either didn't get the system on time or couldn't figure out how to calibrate (super simple). Do yourself a favor and buy this thing it's fun and a GREAT workout. At the very least try it somewhere you won't care about jumping around and looking "funny" because it truly is amazing. Unfortunately, smaller spaces are S.O.L. I live in Manhattan so my apt isn't huge so I mounted the sensor with the Xbox 360 Kinect TV Mountand pushed my couch over and I have more than enough room.
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22 of 26 people found the following review helpful
I have an Wii so I figured I didn't need a Kinect. So I didn't buy one. The problem comes when my mother came in from out of town and bought our family one for an early X-mas gift. Oh, great I thought... another Wii in the house. The one I have doesnt get played that much. Well I hooked it up right away (the only polite thing to do when you get a gift), moved the coffee table and now I feel stupid for not buying one on day one. This thing is a blast and dont let anyone tell you different. NEVER, I mean NEVER has my wife ever walked in while I was playing ANY game and said "That looks neat, let me try". With Kinect she was Dancing, laughing and saying "How can it do that!" This is a SOCIAL persons dream. As soon as it gets turned on 3 people are screaming "Im next". If you are on the fence about this and spending $150, don't be. There really is no way you cant enjoy this system. I love it, kids love it, Mom loves it and the best endorsement anyone can give is that my "video game hating" wife loves it.
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10 of 11 people found the following review helpful
on December 28, 2010
My sons and all their buddies were hooked on Halo, serious day and night couch potato shooting machines.........until Kinect. It's a miracle. They're not only off the couch, they've MOVED the couch out of the room! They're active again and can't stop "Kinecting". If you want your kids to take a break from the violence, get their bodies moving, and have fun again...... BUY KINECT NOW !!! It's a brillant concept, perfect for all ages and a parent's dream come true.
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12 of 14 people found the following review helpful
on November 18, 2010
Soooo, after playing with my 8-yo daughter for several hours, I sent her to bed and started playing in "grown-up" mode. That basically means putting extra effort into the jumps and the squats and the windmills and all the other full-body movements. Result? I ended up in my shorts & t-shirt, drenched in sweat, happier than any gamer has a right to be playing "casual/social" games.
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11 of 13 people found the following review helpful
on November 19, 2010
I. Love. My. Kinect.

If you had doubts because of the price or because some fanboys were swaying your opinion to thirs. I'm not someone to judge before purchasing or trying something, but I was sketical with all the negative feedback at first. Then I realized, the negative people NEVER EVEN TRIED IT. An opinion is not a fact kiddos.

Onto the review. The system is amazin. I have it set up in my bedroom, which isn't that big. I have a good amount of floor space. Only need to be like 5-6 back for Dance Central and 6-7 for Kinect Sports and Adventures. [I am 5'9] The sensor is so acurate, It detects all your correct and all your wrong movements.

The moment I unboxed I could not turn it off, even cancelled a dental appointment so I could play it with my friends.

You are getting what you pay for, for the price you put down. Ignore anyone who says otherwise. Don't let the fact that the wii is 50 dollars more phase you, because it is NOT the same thing. I love my Wii so much, but I love the hands on, controller less experience. I could cheat so many ways with my wii controller into thinking I was doing the move but just stood there and moved my arms. I can't cheat with the kinect haha.

IIt so fun watching your avatar mimic your movements in Kinect Sports and when I play with my friends online they always laugh from the awkward ways my avatar places, because they can only imagine how I look doing that. And vice versa.

I'd love to go on and on and on, But I can't say anything that hasn't been said already.
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