Customer Reviews

London Symphony Orchestra, Vols. I &II

5 star:		(3)
4 star:		(3)
3 star:		(4)
2 star:		(1)
1 star:		(0)

 

 

I was really excited about these recordings for two reasons: 1). I am a Zappa fan and have long respected and enjoyed his classical compositions (check out "The Yellow Shark", for example), and I wanted to hear his pieces played by a full symphony orchestra, and 2). I am a recording engineer who frequently works with symphony and chamber orchestras and, given FZ's usually high standard of audio recording, I was interested to hear this material.

The good news is that the material really does have merit. While I think the chamber compositions on "Yellow Shark" represent him better on many levels, I enjoyed the compositions on these LSO CD's. The bad news is that the recording quality is so awful I can't listen to it. I won't get too geeky about this, but suffice to say that FZ used 40 or 50 PZM microphones--practically one for every instrument. This technique can work for rock music (though even in rock one would not choose the harsh quality of a PZM type microphone). However in classical music, from the listener's perspective it's like having every flute, every trumpet, every drum, etc. wailing away ten inches in front of your face. It's an assault. It's painful. This is the single most fatiguing recording I have heard in my life. I am a fan of FZ, and if you're reading this review, chances are good that you are too. So buy these recordings if you really want to hear these pieces of music, but for your sake I hope your ears are less easily offended than mine.

the LSO apparently agreed to forgo their vacation after recording the star wars theme music (I think it was ROTJ)... anyway, after that session they had originally planned to go on a 30 days vacation. That was until the mighty FZ approached them and asked if they would take 400,000 in cash to do his material. Well, if it had been anyone else in Rock music, they most likely would have headed out to vacation.

then there were so many bad experiences between FZ and the orchestra. I have read where the musicians didn't understand why FZ took so much time arranging their chairs 'JUST SO'. These folks should have just shut up and let the master of sound and engineering (and rarely anyone rivaled FZ in this arena) do his thing. then the trumpet playing folks during a break in the sessions got loaded on brew at a pub and played flat on some numbers... which FZ obviously had a problem with.

Of all the interviews I have read from the folks in the orchestra, they seemed to forget that FZ paid for these sessions and wanted things done his way. But, FZ had very little influence on these musicians to be what they were reported to be, MUSICIANS. FZ stated in many interviews that 'The LSO can play most classical music with their eyes closed, but were not really all that good at reading music they didn't know 'by heart.' Which kinda, at the time, really suprised me.

After listening to other orchestras play FZ music (try national philharmonic on 'orchestral favorites' and bootleg berkley orchestra doing 'Sinister Footwear') and you will see just how stiff the LSO seems to be. Considering that the LSO has a reputation of being a 'swinging classical orchestra'. Maybe it was the tension between the master and the pupils.... who knows.

Now, that is not to say the LSO butchered every number, because they didn't. They did manage to do one song wonderfully, and that song was 'STRICTLY GENTEEL'. This is by far my favorite version of this material and WAY WORTH THE PRICE OF THIS SET ALONE. The LSO obviously liked this number a lot, cause they nailed it. And it is terrific. I was disappointed in the music until I heard that song.. and then I was okay with the output.

So, balance this information.. I would not buy this unless you have bought a good many other FZ recordings; and for his classical releases here is my list of ones to get before this one:

1. Yellow Shark. released early 90s. Ensemble Modern. wow.

2. Perfect Stranger. VERY GOOD, but keep in mind there are also synclavier pieces included.

3. Orchestral Favorites. EXCELLENT. Matter of fact this is the best of the four.

Have fun.

This is a must have for Frank Zappa fans.His style shows through the complex arrangments that were done on a tight schedule with very little rehersal.It must have been a challenge for the LSO.This recording is different from what most people think of as Zappa's music,a great work from a legend.Music is the best.

Frank's compositions are tackled by the London Symphony Orchestra of 102 musicians. This is a world class orchestra playing world class instruments built in the 18th and 19th centuries. Even though Frank complained about their professionalism. The musicians were (apparently) in the pub during breaks and made errors as they were unprepared for the complexity of the work. The final product was finished using overdubs and it sounds fantastic. There are no spoken word pieces and the 2 discs seem like one long composition when played in sequence

So, nobody reviews this one, hey? Well, that figures! And illustrates how much more versatile Zappa is than most of his listeners and fans. LSO is very Zappa, probably too much for those who thnk and write Zappa's world is the pop music business. LSO is a great viewpoint of Zappa's musical concepts, his influences, and relevance for our century's music.

I recently upgraded this album to CD, and I like it a lot more than I did when I first bought it. Zappa himself had mixed feelings about it, calling it "high class demos of what actually resides in the scores" (from The Real Frank Zappa Book), but I think it's very good, and it's the most underrated of Zappa's orchestral recordings. It was originally released on 2 vinyl albums, one in 1983, and one in 1987 (even though both were recorded in 1983, more on that later). I remember reading a review of Vol. 1 of this album by Stereo Review's Mark Peel. I liked the fact that a rock star was doing orchestra work (Peel's review was mixed and had some factual errors. He called Zappa's orchestral work "funny and scary, but it has absolutely no warmth", which was wrong, and he also said the material from Vol. 1 had appeared elsewhere, in works like 200 Motels. For the record, NONE of the material from the first volume appeared originally from 200 Motels). I like the CD configuration better. It's sequenced differently than the original vinyl releases, compositions like Sad Jane and Bob in Dacron are split into their respective movements (on the vinyl release, they were released as one continuous track) and it's been remixed and sounds a lot better. It's still a little flat, resulting mainly from where they recorded it. Zappa said the orchestral hall they recorded at had "completely dead acoustics", and you can hear it here.

The first composition, Bob in Dacron, is very good and is actually funny (despite no narration or vocals). Sad Jane is one of the more beautiful pieces here, showing some warmth and depth. It's quite gentle at times, and shows Zappa did have some heart, so to speak. Mo and Herb's Vacation is a great epic, scary, funny, strange, and moving all at the same time. Envelopes is haunting and sad, and the LSO version is far superior to the rock version on Ship Arriving... Pedro's Dowry (which first appeared on Orchestral Favorites) is better here. It's longer, and there's a really good violin solo in the middle. Bogus Pomp is twice as long as the original version (the original was on Orchestral Favorites), adding more pomp to it.

The only real bad composition here is Strictly Genteel. It was recorded on the last hour of the last session of the last day, and the LSO does a very sloppy version of it. The trumpet section decided to go on a bit of a drinking binge before the recording, and they arrived 15 minutes late. Since it was the final night, there was no way Zappa could afford to pay the LSO overtime (Zappa funded this project out of his own money). So they recorded it anyway, and it has tons of out of tune notes. This is why there is a 4 year interim between the 2 original vinyl releases. Frank sat on the 2nd volume for 4 years, hoping that technology would allow him to hide the shoddy playing, but technology only allowed him a little tweaking, so he released the material anyway. It's really off key. If you want a good version of Strictly Genteel, buy 200 Motels or Orchestral Favorites. I prefer the instrumental version on Orchestral Favorites myself.

The LSO album is a very good album. It's not as good as The Yellow Shark (Zappa's greatest orchestral album), but it's still a lot better than its reputation suggests.

What kind of FZ fan are you?

Completist?
For the comedy?
For the guitar work?
For the amazing creativity?
etc


I'm a completist so I have it, it does not get played much but I love FZ. If your a causal fan or not sure if you want to take the orcehstral plunge with FZ I'd suggest go elsewhere first.
Not bad, but I know I don't reach for it much.
Yellow Shark or some of the orchestral stuff on lather (or orchestral favorites) are a nice place to start.
But if you crave all of what Frank released you have to get it on that level it won't disapoint.

Frank wrote some mean orchestral stuff in his time, some of it appears on this album.Disc1 is better, sad jane and bob in dacron are great, also the epic mo n herb's vacation, which is a 3 movement 27 minute work.It has some eerie bits, sinister like, a delightful first movement with clarinets etc. I'm not qualified to decribe the music, except that it's as good as any of his other orchestral stuff, although it would be interesting to hear other versions. Disc2 is new versions of previously done stuff. Envelopes from the drowning witch album doesn't sound too good to me. It kind of plods along, loses the energy that the 82 band gave it, and the cartoony, nancarrowy quality. It just sounds tired. Pedro's dowry is fine, a longer version than the one on orchestral favorites/lather, however i prefer the earlier version, it has more vitality. Bogus pomp is good, i haven't heard the orchestral fave version, but some people(eg Ben Watson) say that the shorter, 70s version is better. strictly genteel is a great tune, it's a decent enough version. Overall i would definitely recommend the album, there's some great music on it. Thank you

First I should offer the disclaimer that I am not a Frank Zappa fan (though I do have Joe's Garage, and I really like it). Most of the people who buy this album will be fans, so it's important to recognize that I don't have an insider's perspective here. So, with that said...

These compositions demonstrate a considerable compositional virtuosity. Zappa had real skill. He combines the coloristic approach of his major classical music influence, Edgard Varese, with a rhythmic vitality and momentum that I would call Stravinskian if it were coming from anyone else; in Zappa's case, it probably comes more from his interest in rock music. Zappa has a good range and a lot to say... this is captivating, interesting music.

But it's also entirely free-form, freely atonal and dissonant (except for the aptly-named Strictly Genteel, which uses an extended tertian, dance-band sort of vocabulary harmonically), and not easy to follow. This is not a failure on Zappa's part, it's what he intended (why else would Pierre Boulez have been interested in his work?). Zappa's ethos here is aggressively Modernist; accordingly, the music is deliberately confusing and difficult to comprehend at the first hearing.

John Cage wrote an essay entitled, "Who Cares if You Listen?" Milton Babbit flatly dismissed audience comprehension as even a minor priority of the modern composer, and said, "I'm not running a restaurant here." It may also have been Babbit who asserted that modern composers must necessarily go as far over the head of the average person as modern physicists, or theoretical mathematicians.

Zappa doesn't take things quite to those extremes, but still, all of that is representative of his aesthetic ethos. So especially if you aren't a fan, this sort of music is difficult for most people to enjoy.

If you do not like 'classical' music or you have the same tin ear that Andy Gill (who seems to review everything and know little) has, then this may not be your cup of joe but if you are adventurous, like something a little deeper than the music of the million or so 'Divas' that have popped up then buy it.