Mahler: Symphony No. 10 (Carpenter Completion)

et al Gustav Mahler (Composer) (Artist), Gustav Mahler (Composer), Andrew Litton (Conductor), Dallas Symphony Orchestra (Orchestra) | Format: Audio CD

Product Details

• Orchestra: Dallas Symphony Orchestra
• Conductor: Andrew Litton
• Composer: Gustav Mahler
• Audio CD (September 17, 2002)
• SPARS Code: DDD
• Number of Discs: 1
• Label: Delos Records
• ASIN: B00006IXH5
• In-Print Editions: MP3 Download
• Average Customer Review: 3.2 out of 5 stars  See all reviews (8 customer reviews)
• Amazon Best Sellers Rank: #390,067 in Music (See Top 100 in Music)

Customer Reviews

Most Helpful Customer Reviews

12 of 14 people found the following review helpful:

4.0 out of 5 stars A Mixed Review, Interesting but also Disappointing, October 12, 2002

By 

George John (Houston, TX United States) - See all my reviews
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This review is from: Mahler: Symphony No. 10 (Carpenter Completion) (Audio CD)

re: Delos/Litton/Dallas Mahler 10th Carpenter completion.

I bought this yesterday and listened to it twice, once last night, and today. Normally, I can post after a single listen, but this "completion" is so radically different from the Cooke, and I was so shocked at times by what I heard I thought it best that I listen to it again before giving my initial impressions.

First a bit of background. I didn't recognize the greatness of the Mahler 10th until the Wyn Morris/Cooke 2, but my admiration was almost exclusively for the outer two movements. The Rattle/BPO/Cooke 3+ opened my eyes to the possibility that the inner three movements were well worth listening to also.

My first reaction to this Carpenter completion was very negative. After listening it to it for second time, I give it a mixed review, but overall still consider it significantly inferior to the Cooke. In general, I think the goal of any attempt to "complete" the Mahler 10th should be to give the clearest impression of what Mahler actually left behind. Interpolations and extrapolations should be kept to a minimum. Any addition of notes that aren't actually there should be added only with the greatest of care, only when absolutely necessary, and with a conservative mindset to keep Mahler's intentions as intact and authentic as possible. In light of these criteria and IMHO, the Cooke succeeds and the Carpenter completion badly fails at times.

Too often the Carpenter adds material that isn't in the Cooke (I assume Cooke didn't leave anything out), either quoting or paraphrasing from past Mahler works or adding new material that sounds not even remotely similar to anything I have ever heard Mahler do. While it is true that Mahler never stood still, every Mahler work that I have heard is almost immediately recognizable as his. Even though the notes are largely Mahler's, there are moments in this completion that I would not recognize the work as either being the 10th or Mahler's. For me the critical opening section of the final movement is MUCH less effective than the Cooke 3+. For example, although Mahler marks the bass drum forte, Carpenter decides to make it piano (Litton compromises somewhere in between) because that's what he thinks Mahler would have heard from an 11th floor hotel room when the funeral procession that inspired this section passed by. That strikes me as a poor reason to go against Mahler's expressed wishes. That's only one of several complaints I have with this section, arguably one of the more crucial of the work.

Is there anything good about this release? Absolutely! The Delos sound is just wonderful. Excellent balance, dynamic range, warm, live, 3-dimensional sound is all there. The Dallas Symphony for the most part plays their hearts out and to my mind and ear give a technically better performance than the Rattle/BPO. I like very much some of Litton's approach to the first movement versus Rattle's. Both performances of the 1st movement (where Carpenter's tinkering seems to have been kept mostly to a minimum) are excellent although different and each has its strengths and weaknesses. Elsewhere, there are sections where I actually prefer what Carpenter has done versus Cooke. Carpenter's more dense scoring, when it works for me, does add emotional weight to the work. But the bottom line question remains, did the performance move me? The answer is it did, very much so, in fact to tears, but in different spots than in the Cooke.

Mahler purists probably don't listen to the 10th except possibly the first movement. Cooke purists should probably avoid this performance like the plague or listen to the 1st movement only. Those who can tolerate Carpenter's lapses where he adds far too many of his own ideas or attempts to graft, unsuccessfully IMHO, bits and pieces of prior Mahler material, and a much weaker approach to the initial section of 5th movement, but are looking for different attempts to score and interpret this unfinished masterpiece may enjoy giving this performance a try, but definitely bring to the experience a VERY open mind.

Finally, this release drives home what I already know. It was a tragedy that this work was never completed by Mahler, and there is plenty of opportunity for future completions for those who are so inclined and have the ability and talent to really get under their skin what the Mahler sound is all about.

George

6 of 7 people found the following review helpful:

5.0 out of 5 stars Just judging the performance and sound quality., November 21, 2006

By 

B. Guerrero "Mahler nutcase" - See all my reviews
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This review is from: Mahler: Symphony No. 10 (Carpenter Completion) (Audio CD)

Let's set aside the whole issue of Carpenter's "completion". This Delos recording deserves five and a half stars just for the outrageous execution of such an incredibly difficult score by the Dallas Symphony, along with the beautiful DSD sonics that Delos coughs up here. Come now, give them a round of applause for that much. How you'll react to Carpenter's efforts is a purely personal thing.

Yes, it's true that Carpenter overshoots his mark; often times conjuring up the more expressionistic sound world of Alban Berg (Wozzeck; Three Pieces For Orchestra). But this is also much more of a completion than Cooke's somewhat threadbare "performing version" remains. I would never suggest that one own the Carpenter in lieu of the Cooke - own it as a supplement. As overheated as this may be from time to time, I think that the narrative is pretty well connected and integrated. Nobody would be fool enough to believe that this how Mahler would have finished the piece. But in many respects, it's simply more fun and fulfilling to listen to than the bare-minimum Cooke version is. Proceed only if you can do so with an open mind. Come on, some of you can do that.

4 of 5 people found the following review helpful:

3.0 out of 5 stars Quite subjective and a bit over the top, but fascinating, December 2, 2005

By 

Pater Ecstaticus (Norway) - See all my reviews

This review is from: Mahler: Symphony No. 10 (Carpenter Completion) (Audio CD)

This performance has of course less to do with Gustav Mahler than with Mr. Clinton A. Carpenter. The 'naked body' is Mahler's, yes (the symphony is complete from beginning to end, in a sense: the first two movements and the first 30 bars of the third movement exist as full score drafts, the rest exist as four stave scetches with many indications of orchestration), but the clothes that are being 'draped around it' are a somewhat strange and they do not always fit (what we would think Mahler would have come up with in the end). But the same can be said to be the case - to some degree - with necessarily all 'completions' or 'performing versions' of this, Mahler's last and incomplete musical testament.
On his deathbed Mahler ultimately decided that the scetches were NOT to be burned. Whether one likes it or not, the Pandora's box of Mahler's Tenth has been opened, and can never again be closed. But then, the 'score' of the Tenth as left by Mahler is an evocative piece of music in its own right. As such, it has been discovered and studies by many a musically gifted mind. And I for one am very glad that 'performing versions' of these scetches do exist and are being played and recorded.
The only way that I can 'judge' or appreciate this music is through hearing it. Not being able to judge the 'authenticity' of any performing version of Mahler's Tenth (I can't read music), I have to judge them by what I read about them and what I hear and feel when listening to them. And from what I have heard, the 'performing version' by Deryck Cooke, in collaboration with Berthold Goldschmidt, Colin Matthews and David Matthews is the one that stays truest to the source material. I do like that version the best, especially in the already 'classic' recording by Sir Simon Rattle leading the Berliner Philharmoniker (together with the Chailly/RSO Berlin recording). The starkness of the source material IMHO only intensifies the power and depth of the music as it is left by Mahler, however incomplete, which is good.
Well, back to Clinton A. Carpenter's 'completion'. There are to my ears often a bit too many idiosynchratic and fantastic distractions here, which make this 'completion' sound too much like an 'interpretation'. Nonetheless, the flesh is weak, and I must secretly confess that I am fascinated by all the sounds that Clinton Carpenter weaves around the 'naked body' of scetches for the Tenth Symphony, although the end result is often too baroque and over-orchestrated IMHO. Wacky sometimes, even, to my ears. Too excentric to sound like 'real Mahler' (for as much this is possible). Or, as Tony Duggan from Musicweb so eloquently puts it: "Mahler was heading into a simpler style at this time. Right through [...] the whole symphony in this edition, there is always so much going on in a way that for me is fundamentally un-Mahlerian in one very crucial aspect. Mahler was a master of clarity of thought. Even in his most thickly scored passages the listener's ear never has trouble following his fundamental line of thought. Whereas here, in Carpenter's edition, over-scoring frequently prevents this for vast tracts of the music."
In the end I will turn to Chailly and Rattle (Berlin) (and maybe the Rudolf Barshai - added percussion here and there - and Kurt Sanderling recordings/interpretations as well) more than this rather excentric interpretation. The sound for this recording is just great though: spacious but detailed.
This 'completion' does't really add anything of musical value, but for Mahler-Ten-enthusiasts (like me) it is nice to have alongside the other more insightful, less excentric interpretations of Mahler's scetches, if only just for curiosity's sake.