Customer Reviews

Mahler: Symphony No. 8

5 star:		(11)
4 star:		(0)
3 star:		(3)
2 star:		(1)
1 star:		(0)

 

 

That is due to the fact that when it was recorded, the Chicago Symphony Orchestra and Solti were at the top of the Orchestra ladder. The brass section was considered the best in the symphonic world. And this work has monumental brass parts that require superhuman effort to play. This recording was made in Vienna. There's an article written that says many members of the Vienna Philharmonic's brass section were present during the recording and allowed to watch. And after the mighty and heroic conclussion of the work walked out of the recording site mumbling to themselves. The brass playing is that wonderful (I'm a orchestral percussionist by education and performance). The other parts of the orchestra really shine too. The choirs (how can you go wrong with the Vienna Opera Choir?) are exemplary too. And the soloists are at their top form (sadly, many aren't around anymore).

My biggest beef is with Solti's tempi. I have always felt that he moved at a quicker clip than other conductors. In the first movement, Veni Creator Spiritus, this works well because it is a very dramatic and kinetic movement. However, at the very end, with brass choirs supplementing the orchestra and blazing, his tempo moves just a bit too fast. It's a small complaint, but Solti is sometimes accused of this. Also, I feel his conducting is sometimes clinical, say the opposite of Bernstein. On occassion, it happens here. I have the LP still and used it to compare to this recording. The brass parts on the LP shine and are played in correct intonation. But the CD has some really weird parts on the brass. There are times that the brass is so in the background that you cannot distinguish it from the winds. Other times, it comes out blazing in an unnatural crescendo relative to the score. I think the engineers who remastered this version had some difficulties. In all fairness though, this piece is very difficult to record simply because there are so many instruments and singers. Things like where to place the brass choir to give the feeling of a Celestial Host, inserting the piano and organ in proper balance to the rest is very difficult for a balance engineer.

If performance is your criteria though, you can't get much better than this. It's exciting and breathtaking.

Decca's recording engineers were the best in the world at capturing orhestral impact, as they showed in Solti's Ring cycle. His Mahler Eighth won equal fame for sonic drama--this huge symphony sounds as massive exploding from home speakers as it might in live performance. The orchestra and soloists are also first rate--Part II benefits from having almost no weak singers and many that re among the best ever--and to this day Solti's version ranks very high in sales and fame.

Musically, however, thre is the usual high-voltage Solti aggressive drive throughout and little poetry. The famed sonics were surprisingly shrill and uncomfortable in earlier digital issues--whatever hapened to the gorgeous bloom of the LP originals? But this Originals remastering in 96/24 sound is the best ever, even though it doesn't sound natural at high volume levels. I have known this set since the day it shot out of the cannon, and in the intervening decades it's been a relief to hear more musical versions by Haitink, Sinopoli, Bernstein, Abbado, Gielen, and Colin Davis. Not that fans of this blockbuster CD will be discouraged.

Solti and the Chicago Symphony made dozens of excellent recordings, but this is the best of the best--the definitive performance of Mahler's 8th Symphony. But you don't have to believe me; listen to the musicians of the Vienna Philharmonic. In 1971, Vienna and Chicago traded cities for a short time. Chicago recorded Mahler's 8th just before leaving Viennna, when the Vienna musicians had already returned. Many of them were sitting in the hall, listening to the recording session, completely stunned at what they were hearing. This is a performance for all time and a privilege to experience. Enjoy.

The reissue of this recording as part of the "Originals" series has some sound oddities that I do not detect in its prior "Legends" incarnation. There are some places where the brass has been remixed and diminished to the point where they are almost blended in with the wind instruments. In other places they come blasting out of the speakers as though the horn players made a mad dash for the microphone. It's usually refeshing to hear a pre-digital warhorse recording such as this get an updated remastering - here in 96/24 sound; however, the engineers who worked on this release did more than just update it - they tinkered with Solti's intricate and impressive balancing act of the massive forces assembed for this recording - a monumental achievement in classical music.

Though there are many fine recordings of Gustav Mahler's Symphony No. 8, for this listener the recording most often heard in the quiet of the home is this 1971 recording with a cast of artists so brilliant that though they may not count up to the 1000 mark of the sobriquet of the work, they are absolutely extraordinary. Sir Georg Solti conducts the Chicago Symphony Orchestra in the Sofiensaal in Vienna and adds Vienna Staatsopernchor, the Wiener Singverein, the Wiener Sängerknaben, and as soloists the top singers of that era: sopranos Heather Harper, Lucia Popp, Arleen Auger, contraltos Helen Watts and Yvonne Minton, tenor René Kollo, baritone John Shirley-Quirk, and bass Martti Talvela. It would be impossible to gather a finer group of brilliant singers in that time.

One aspect of the recording, now remastered by Decca in the Legends Series, is that the entire work is on one CD, preventing the usual break in recording that the two CD recordings cause. But enough of the technical aspects of the recording. Solti manages to capture the rapture of both the first movement (a densely composed movement that in the wrong hands can become muddy) and the drama and exaltation of the second movement. He allows his soloists to soar over the massive orchestra and choruses, providing some of the finest interpretations of these difficult lines one records.

In all, this 'old' recording remains one of the finest on record. It is everything the symphony can be and more. Grady Harp, March 11

This is obviously a piece of music which engenders passionate responses in anyone who hears it, and that passion spills over into the discussions about the various performances, too.

Prior to the 80s, a frequent assessment of Solti held that he was a fierce conductor who often lacked nuance. I agree with the fierce, but only partly with the lack of nuance. I think that Solti was one of our greatest conductors because he tirelessly worked at finding the right way to shape complex melodic lines and counterpoint. This performance is one of his greatest results. He guides us through Mahler's complex and dramatic music.

With the massive opening of the 1st movement, I feel Mahler himself sets the tone for a driving, volcanic experience meant to sweep listeners along in waves of sound and feeling. But the work is also informed with a symphonic framework that is worked out ingeniously, giving rise to its wonderful variety of mood from a small number of melodic motifs. I believe Solti takes his cue from these motifs (some comprised of only 2 or 3 notes!), successfully achieving a simultaneous sense of musical integration and operatic drama. Which was what Mahler was after, I believe.

Perhaps the most obvious example of this is at the opening of the long 2nd movement (track 7). Solti's hair-trigger tension has bite and seems to be exactly what Mahler is calling for. With violins playing a suspensefully sustained tremolo, the basses and cellos pluck a 7-note melody which I think is actually 3 small motifs that Mahler will develop singly and in combinations throughout the whole 2nd part. 2 descending notes, followed by 3 rising notes, followed by 2 descending notes (the 3 rising notes actually part of one of the main melodies from the 1st movement!). Later, there is a 4-note motif that plays counterpoint to that; 2 ascending notes followed by two descending notes. This motif is very noticeable in the gentle "lullaby" section, only to become the massive concluding "Ewig, Ewig!" I'm not a trained musicologist, but I can hear this music being woven in various guises, sometimes reversed, sometimes played slower or separately or in combinations. And so it seems to me Solti paid *particular* attention to these small elements as guides throughout; what to accurately accentuate (so we can identify the motifs) and when to allow himself more or less nuance. The same is true for the amazing 1st movement.

This 2nd movement, which began in hushed suspense, ends in a massive crescendo of the 4-note motif, and the gates of heaven opening, as it were, to the 7-note motif, now fanfared by the trumpets, followed by echos of the opening of the first movement played out across the entire orchestra and the offstage brass choirs, tying the whole thing together! I'd never really been able to piece it together until I heard the Solti recording, the details jumped out at me, and the performance has the atmosphere of an important event!

With respect to the sound quality, although made in the early 70's, this has always been a demonstration recording. It does not quite equal the newest digital recordings (like Chailly's), but it is still excellent and handles loud and quiet passages amazingly well. Some reviewers here have mentioned Solti's recordings of Wagner's Ring operas. It is worth noting that, of all the Solti/Chicago Mahler recordings, only this one was made in the same hall (the Sofiensaal in Vienna) as those Ring recordings. It seems that location is ideal for large orchestral works - reproducing massive sound as well as important details. It is hugely successful in this recording. The orchestral sound is sumptuous. The sound of the Chicago Symphony brass, french horns especially, is awesome, in the true meaning of the word, they inspire awe!

The singers were all opera stars at the heights of their careers. All the four sopranos soar beautifully, in conjunction with the large choral moments as well as in their solos. Kollo has just the right balance of lyricism and strength for this part. Talvela is terrific, at once powerful and plaintiff in accordance with the music. The soloists are placed a bit forward, but not too forward. It allows us to hear them in the massive choral parts. They are the best team of soloists compared to any other recording.

I have heard many recordings (Tennstedt, Bernstein, Haitink, Abravanel, and Chailly) and seen several live performances of this symphony. Tennstedt's EMI recording comes very close, but I think Solti's conducting really guides us through Mahler's complex, integrated, dramatic music. And it gives us some idea of what it would have been like had Mahler written an opera.

I had heard a lot about this recording before I bought a copy. For me, it has definitely lived up to its reputation. Its sound is very clean and precise with details in the orchestration audible behind the choir. The tutti sections are very powerful dynamically, and while the more reserved sections are dialed back appropriately, some may think they lack the delicate emotional approach associated with other Mahler recordings. I felt that this was a great value, costing under $10 before shipping. For how powerfully the orchestra plays, they exhibit a great deal of control over the music. This is a great Mahler disc.

This recording has been around in various formats for many years: plastic, cassette, double disc set and now remastered on a single disc. I know my opinion is shared by many and it may be that this recording was my teacher, but if one must name a single recording to consider a standard, this is about as close to definitive as one is going to get. I have twelve versions of this music and have seen it five times, once in Berlin with the BPO and still find Solti and the CSO to be the gold standard. The soloists have not been matched (four of them have since passed away) and Solti's dynamics are timeless. (When Chorus Mysticus intones "Alles Vergangliche" to begin the last six minutes, it still sends chills up the spine as no other recording of that moment does!) The recent Tilson Thomas with the SFO is truely marvelous and I would highly recommend it to anyone who loves this music, but if you don't have the Solti, you really should have it for the timeless standard that it is. I would urge the novice to skip the Boulez and the Rattle as they're simply done better by others. Lenny's Salzburg Festival recording from 1975 on DG is splendidly exciting (the best timpani bump before the final "Gleichnis"...ever), and Tennstedt's beautiful recording on EMI is also a must, but if there's only one to have, Solti's is "the one".

For those who are already familiar with the famous Solti Mahler eighth, the pertinent question is, is it worth your while to pick up yet another remastering? I think that much will depend on just how much you love this performance, and what your thoughts are on how it should ideally sound. As someone who is not in love with any of its previous incarnations (I admire it, but I'm also quite indifferent to it), I feel that this "Originals" remastering pretty much serves to highlight the extent to which it comes across - to me, anyway - as rather artificial and contrived sounding. Maybe it's just me, but it seems easier than ever to follow some of the separate tracks of the heavy multi-miking that went into this (sometimes the organ sounds like it's coming from a totally different acoustic venue). For all the sonic faults of the old Bernstein/LSO one (distortion at peaks, for one), it just sounds better integrated to me, as do a good number of more modern ones. But the point here isn't to make those who do love Solti's 8th, feel bad or combative. The point is to help you make a decision. Strangely enough, just the ending of Part 2 from the same Solti Mahler 8th got issued on some kind of Decca choral compilation that was released in the same month, no less! (I forget what they called it, but it's one of these "twofer" compilations with a hoaky name).

While the sound was less brightly lit, and the dynamic range more constricted (just slightly), I thought that the sound was better intergrated on that choral compilation - more of what I remember the "ADRM" version sounding like. Or, just perhaps, the "better" remastering more truthfully reveals what went into the sonic soup pot from the start. But even more disturbing, that choral comp. verified my sensitive suspicion that Decca might have fiddled with the ending on the Originals version. I detect that part of the ending is actually slower than before (the protracted onstage trombone soli)! Perhaps they used a different take, but I do notice a slight difference in tempi, and not in a terribly helpful place either (such as the very, very end, where the offstage brass sound Eb; Bb (a fourth lower); C (a ninth higher) - that would have been useful). Be that as it may (or may not), that's not a major issue. But combined with the fact that a good friend of mine, an audiophile type, thinks that the Originals pressing sounds awful, and believes that there may have been a fair amount of deterioration of the tapes over time, maybe they did have to switch to a different take. I could be crazy, but I detect a very slight drop-out near the end of the symphony too. The problem is, there's so much noise going on there, that it's difficult to detect. But to present a more balanced, less microscopic opinion, Victor Carr (Classicstoday.com) thinks that it's the best sounding version of the three. If that's true, the question remains, should you run out and buy it?

The answer, of course, is to hear it for yourself first. See if you like the way it sounds, if you get the chance. If not, for just a bit more money (not much), I'd like to direct your attention, as well as the attention of those who are coming to the piece for the very first time, to the Antoni Wit M8 on Naxos. If you look at the Amazon page for it, you'll see several favorable reviews including mine. Better yet, look at the enthusiastic yet detailed review for Wit's M8 at Classicstoday.com. (and I'm not trying to give them a plug, as I receive nothing from them). Yes, that review was written by the sometimes controversial and dismissive David Hurwitz. But he really explains, in detail, why it's a good recording. I wholehearted agree. More to the point, I think that adding Wit's Mahler 8th would better augment one of your existing Solti M8 permutations, assuming you own one of them. It's different enough in most respects, and better in some.

Mahler is like a child with a new box of paints...his easel appears messy, the canvas never looks the same. I found this 8th simply sublime, and to my surprise, never difficult to digest, which can't always be said for some of his works...Solti got the "colors" right.