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34 of 35 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars Faith of our Fathers
Faith of our Fathers, holy faith!
We will be true to thee till death!
~ Fr. Frederick William Faber, 1814-1863

"Supremacy and Survival" by Stephanie Mann provides an overview of the history of the persecution of Catholics in England, beginning in the sixteenth century, as well as the later Catholic revival. Narrated with clarity and...
Published on April 24, 2009 by elena maria vidal

versus
5 of 13 people found the following review helpful:
3.0 out of 5 stars Still Whig-ish
One of the excellent reviews here noted that "While she [the author, Stephanie Mann] relies exclusively on secondary sources, Ms. Mann is familiar with all the recent scholarship that debunks the Whig theory of English history. This now discredited view held that England's break with her historic ties to the Church was inevitable and 'progressive.'"

Mrs. Mann...
Published 21 months ago by Janet Baker


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34 of 35 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars Faith of our Fathers, April 24, 2009
This review is from: Supremacy and Survival - How Catholics Endured the English Reformation (Paperback)
Faith of our Fathers, holy faith!
We will be true to thee till death!
~ Fr. Frederick William Faber, 1814-1863

"Supremacy and Survival" by Stephanie Mann provides an overview of the history of the persecution of Catholics in England, beginning in the sixteenth century, as well as the later Catholic revival. Narrated with clarity and insight, Mann draws from a variety of scholarly studies on the Reformation, making the book an excellent introduction to the story of the fall and subsequent rise of the Catholic Church in the British isles. While the book was a refresher course for me about an epoch I have always found fascinating, the way in which Mann synthesizes the information into a coherent and flowing analysis gave me a deeper understanding of the sequence and significance of events.

The extent of the literacy and vigorous participation of English Catholics in the life of the Church before the break from Rome is highlighted. (pp. 6-10) Certain aspects of Mary Tudor's tragic, difficult life and disappointing reign are likewise poignantly presented. For instance, Mary, upon her succession to the throne, had to deal with people such as Stephen Gardiner, Bishop of Winchester, who had worked for her parents' divorce. Mary loved children and had extensive charities, possessing the common touch, an ability to go directly to her people and be at ease among them, an essential Tudor trait. However, her education had been interrupted by the upheavals of her youth; she was afflicted by ill health, including raging headaches. (p. 42) Her Spanish marriage was her undoing; it brought foreigners into England, which did not go over well. Neither did the burning of the heretics, but in that Mary acted no differently from other European monarchs. Nevertheless, one of the themes of the book is that Catholicism came to be seen by the English people as being connected to foreign powers and therefore distinctly anti-English and dangerous.

The reign of Elizabeth is approached in a balanced manner, emphasizing the greatness of the Virgin Queen as a ruler while showing her cynical approach towards religion. As Mann states:

"We do not know what Elizabeth's personal religious convictions were. She acted like a Protestant under her half-brother Edward, then seemed to accept Catholicism under her half-sister Mary. Like her father, she opposed both Puritan and Catholic dissent; but she rejected Catholic teachings he would have accepted, especially the Real Presence in the Holy Eucharist. Henry VIII would never have walked out of Mass as she did when the Host was elevated at her coronation. In fact, he would have executed anyone who did such a thing. Nevertheless, Elizabeth wanted the pomp and ritual of the Church of England service.... Yet she also employed the services of her own pursuivant and torturer of Catholic priests, Richard Topcliffe. Religion was part of her public role as Queen of England. Elizabeth was politic in her expression of it." (p.54)

It was during the reign of Elizabeth that embracing the Church of England became the measure of one's patriotism, as Catholicism came to be identified more and more with the enemies of England. The courage and martyrdom of some the most famous saints are covered, enough to give the reader a sense of the ordeals to which many people were subjected when they refused to renounce their Faith.

Mann is able to follow the complexities of the various sects who strove for power within and without the Church of England, as well as delineate the various stances on theological issues. The rise of Puritanism is skillfully traced, leading to its temporary ascendancy after the execution of Charles I. The brutality of Oliver Cromwell's forces in Ireland is described in the context of the general hatred towards Catholics. Throughout the entire book, it is told how the Irish people repeatedly suffered at the hands of the English invaders, due to the Irish refusal to give up Catholicism. Cromwell summed up the general attitude by saying his slaughter of so many Irish men, women and children was "the righteous judgment of God upon these barbarous wretches." (p. 99)

As one decade led to another, the Church of England increasingly became an establishment church for those who wished to be socially acceptable. I think that Mann expresses it quite accurately when she says:

"Religion became a matter of behaving well, not praying well or believing well. Under the control of the state, the Church of England did not build new churches to accommodate the shifting populations nor did it repair the existing ones.... The Church of England's latitudinarian moderation could satisfy the mind but it could not reach the heart." (p. 117)

"Supremacy and Survival" would make a worthwhile addition to any high school or university course of study, in that it offers a solid background of the period, as well as providing an extensive bibliography for further reading. On a spiritual level, the book inspires courage when recounting the sufferings of those who are our brothers and sisters in the Faith, those who valued truth and fidelity over life itself.
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19 of 20 people found the following review helpful:
4.0 out of 5 stars Instructive popular history, April 18, 2009
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Rich Leonardi (Cincinnati, Ohio) - See all my reviews
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This review is from: Supremacy and Survival - How Catholics Endured the English Reformation (Paperback)
Stephanie Mann has written an instructive popular history of Catholics under Protestant rule in England. While she relies exclusively on secondary sources, Ms. Mann is familiar with all the recent scholarship that debunks the Whig theory of English history. This now discredited view held that England's break with her historic ties to the Church was inevitable and "progressive." The remedial work of Eamon Duffy in The Stripping of the Altars, which demonstrates the health and vitality of the Church in England on the eve of Henry VIII's violent imposition, receives deserved attention. Queen Mary I, maligned by Protestant propagandists as "Bloody Mary," is given sympathetic treatment. We learn that she sought to rule through Parliament, refrained from compelling her subjects to reconvert to Catholicism, and anticipated the reforms of the Council of Trent. Her subsequent excesses, while deplorable, were certainly no worse than those perpetrated by her father, Henry VIII, and her half-sister, Elizabeth I. The book also covers an area of history often overlooked by popular historians -- the fate of English Catholics after the Tudor-Stuart period. The aftermath of the so-called "Glorious Revolution," a conspiracy which put a Dutch usurper on the throne of England, and the emancipation of the 19th century, which freed Catholics of some Reformation-era oppressions, each receive a chapter. The book is based on a seminar Ms. Mann once led, and it occasionally shows when her prose turns pedantic. Yet her love for the subject matter always shines through. If you are a fan of the history of English Catholicism, this is a book to own.
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14 of 15 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars Breathtaking ride through the England's history, July 17, 2009
This review is from: Supremacy and Survival - How Catholics Endured the English Reformation (Paperback)
This short book, aimed at the general reader, tells the story of the Catholic church in England, starting with Henry VIII.

It was Henry, of course, who first broke with Rome. Anyone who did not accept Henry's marriage to Anne was made to suffer, most famously, Thomas More and Bishop John Fisher. But these were just the most noted. More himself said "he saw the Carthusians...going off to their deaths by hanging, drawing and quartering as cheerfully as bridegrooms" (p 17).

In addition to the martyrs, vast libraries were burned, to the point that Scotland practically destroyed it's entire written history, and "of all the great polyphonic choir books...only three remain" (p 23). Statues were broken or burned, ancient stained glass windows shattered.

Yet there appears to be little change in the people, who, especially in the north, continued to cling to Catholic devotions. Recent scholarship has even suggested that Shakespeare was Catholic. As time passed, however, the populace became firmly anti-Catholic, especially after the Gunpowder plot.


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11 of 12 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars Fabulous Primer, September 18, 2009
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This review is from: Supremacy and Survival - How Catholics Endured the English Reformation (Paperback)
Stephanie Mann has written a fabulous primer on the subject of effect the English Reformation on English Roman Catholics from the sixteenth century through the 1800s. The chronology of the period is followed perfectly. Chapters are concise. Her book includes a "who's who" of this period as well as a time line to which the reader can refer. Mann's book will serve as a both a launching platform for and a referrence to the works of other authors of the period, for example Eamon Duffy.
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10 of 11 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars A brilliant summary, November 30, 2009
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This review is from: Supremacy and Survival - How Catholics Endured the English Reformation (Paperback)
I agree with the American reviewers who have rightly praised this useful little volume. As an Englishman, I share their opinion that it provides an excellent overview of a long sequence of complicated events. It does not pretend to be a detailed academic study, but it is well-referenced and the author has carried out a remarkably skilful job of distilling the important points and narrating them in a clear and balanced way. Anyone who reads this book will obtain a sound understanding of the history of Catholicism in England since the 'Reformation'. In my view, the author demonstrates a 'feel' for her subject that would put many English historians to shame. Indeed, I cannot think of any other up-to-date popular history of English Catholicism to match this reliable and thoroughly readable account. If I have one criticism, it is that I would have liked to have seen some reference to the important work of John Lingard (1771-1851), whose meticulous historical research first exposed the English people to the uncomfortable facts about their so-called 'Reformation' and thereby discredited the ignorant basis of much anti-Catholic prejudice. I very much hope the author will take the opportunity to remedy that omission in any future edition.
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1 of 1 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars Entertaining & Informative, August 21, 2011
This review is from: Supremacy and Survival - How Catholics Endured the English Reformation (Paperback)
Ever wonder how English-speaking Christianity ever ended up splitting into thousands upon thousands of denominations--with as many differing theologies and mores? Or why the differing "Christian" churches persecuted each other? Or where the roots of animus between the different faiths sprung from? "Supremacy and Survival" explains a good deal of it.

Stephanie Mann tackles an ambitious project that spans five centuries, three continents, and numerous turn-overs in governments and religions. She does it in such a way that is both entertaining and informative...and supported by a generous dose of footnotes. I would recommend this to anyone interested in the history and religions of the English speaking world.
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1 of 2 people found the following review helpful:
4.0 out of 5 stars Interesting/Different perspective, August 8, 2010
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This review is from: Supremacy and Survival - How Catholics Endured the English Reformation (Paperback)
I bought this book via a recommendation from my professor. I used the book for a paper on Religious tolerance and it gave a very different perspective on Henry, Edward, Mary, and Elizabeth. Obviously written by a Catholic with a Catholic perspective on this time in history.
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5 of 13 people found the following review helpful:
3.0 out of 5 stars Still Whig-ish, April 13, 2010
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This review is from: Supremacy and Survival - How Catholics Endured the English Reformation (Paperback)
One of the excellent reviews here noted that "While she [the author, Stephanie Mann] relies exclusively on secondary sources, Ms. Mann is familiar with all the recent scholarship that debunks the Whig theory of English history. This now discredited view held that England's break with her historic ties to the Church was inevitable and 'progressive.'"

Mrs. Mann actually has not completely purged the Whig view from her own mind-set, and so we find, on page xiv in the author's introduction to her work, "This history of a state church provides citizens of the United States of America a contrasting model to our constitutional relationship between church and state. It might provide us with some insights into the wisdom of our founders, who rejected an official state church at the federal level and provided a foundation for tolerance of differences in religious practice."

Since Catholicism was the state church that Henry VIII savagely attacked, Mrs. Mann is suggesting that the superiority of the state that resulted, one which makes all 'churches' equal under the law, was a desirable outcome, and was therefore, if not inevitable, at least 'progressive.' This is the Whig teaching, it has been seen to be manifestly untrue, and it has not been Church teaching up to Vatican II. Nineteenth and twentieth century popes warned against it, saying, to summarize crudely, that the 'neutral' secular state inevitably leads to state atheism, an unfortunate situation, a disaster, for the spiritual and material life of its citizens, and to religious indifference among its population, with the expected behavioral consequences. We have seen the consequences in the United States, with fifty five million babies aborted, the economy destroyed, state-funded euthanasia looming, the marriage contract debased, and all contracts subsequently tainted. These can all be seen as direct and indirect results of the gradual secularization of the state, although we the public have not made that link--yet.

Mann also attacks the James II (a Catholic coming after Elizabeth, after Mary I, after the English martyrs)in this way: "Winston Churchill remarks that we will never know what James ultimately intended [with his steps toward religious tolerance]. If it was to grant Catholics and Protestant dissenters freedom of worship and stop at that, he deserves recognition as a great modern hero. If it was to use toleration as a stepping-stone in making Catholicism the state religion [again] in place of the Church of England, he was a dangerous despot." Bear in mind the enormous transfer of property, not only from the Church itself but from private citizens who were, if not disemboweled, taxed out of their Catholicism. All that had, historically speaking, just occurred. Bear in mind that Merry Old England had enjoyed, under the Church, prosperity, peace, and an enviable life-style in which roughly one-third of the year was paid holiday among its working classes. It was fetal capitalism that needed this change, not justice. Would that James II had had the restoration of the Church in mind, and not mere tolerance (of injustice, is what it amounts to). But Mann reverses this mindset. Mann calls, in that statement, for the triumph of the secular state, not the triumph of the Church. This is the liberal speaking. This is the living Whig. For both statements cannot be true, that England didn't need the reformation, and that the religious state is bad. England was a religious state before the reformation, and the new scholarship is certainly right: she didn't need changed in any way at all.

Marcel Lefebvre's 'They Have Uncrowned Him' details the Church's traditional teaching regarding the secular state right up to Vatican II, in which the constitution Nostra aetate abandoned the perfectly reasonable and fruitful preference for the religious state. (He also makes the important point that tolerance of private practice of private faith is completely consistent with the religious state, and that was the general experience throughout Christendom, almost all the time. But tolerance is one thing, absolute right is quite another.) This temporary protestant seasoning within the Church will be revisited in SSPX's ongoing talks with the Vatican. SSPX is the dissenting wing, probably most known for their refusal to celebrate the 'new mass' and retention of the Latin liturgy, but they have doctrinal criticism of Vatican II, of which the question of the secular state is one. Lefebvre points out that it is perfectly reasonable to recognize that due to historical developments, we have the secular state, but we don't have to like it, and giving up this element of our faith robs us of the possibility of a consistent independent political stance that could offer an alternative to both class warfare and complete capitulation to capitalism, ultimately (as we are seeing) in favor of the few owning citizens left and to the ruin of the working poor; state fascism. Vatican II made the secular state the desired norm. This work is infected with the bug.
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Supremacy and Survival - How Catholics Endured the English Reformation
Supremacy and Survival - How Catholics Endured the English Reformation by Stephanie A. Mann (Paperback - January 19, 2009)
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