Customer Reviews

Thrustmaster Hotas Cougar PC Flight Stick

5 star:		(33)
4 star:		(6)
3 star:		(6)
2 star:		(8)
1 star:		(8)

 

 

I have been using the Cougar for over a year now and have concluded that it is a combination of the best and the worst in consumer products. In the end analysis it is ok for someone who doesn't mind tinkering, modifying and repairing. If it wasn't for the online community I would have thrown my Cougar away a long time ago. These guys are the BEST thing going for the Cougar. Support from the manufacturer is far from acceptable. Now for the good and the bad.

This product has a great feel about it. Largely because it's all metal, heavy and seems durable. The metal, however, is very soft and, consequently, easy to strip threads. The switches and pots are low quality. Replacement pots are only available through the manufacturer as they were specially made. (I think by CTS) The Throttle Quadrant has a speed brake switch which is on in the forward position, off in the middle position and momentary on in the back position. The switch itself is the toggle variety. It is guided by a plastic guide that works well when properly aligned but there is nothing designed into the product to insure alignment. You'll have to fix this yourself or the guide is likely to break. Fortunately the procedure is detailed in Frugals World Cougar forum.

Programmability is a big plus with the Cougar. Again, if you are not up to tinkering and just want to plug and play, look for something else. If you don't mind spending some time with your face in the manual and working through a profile or two you will have incredible flexibility.

The throttle itself is rather sticky through its range of motion and there are two detents for idle and afterburner. All in all it is clunky and I opted to remove the detents. As far as the sticky motion is concerned I have yet to find a way to fix it.

The Cougar is not really a desktop item. Sure it's heavy and you would think it would stay put but it doesn't. It is a lot more enjoyable when anchored to a platform. If you are contemplating this purchase I suggest that you go to and get familiar with http://cougar.frugalsworld.com/. They will be your primary support group and you can get some insight to the problems and soulutions that the rest of us are working through.
Pay special attention to the instructions when loading the software. There seems to be a problem with version 2.04 that damages the throttle pot.

Pros:
1. metal and sturdy (except throttle lever support which is plastic and actually broke on mine). Metal makes for great feel of the stick, much better than any plastic joystick.

2. Vast programming abilities (rivaled only by top competition equipment). This is, IMO, the best thing about the Cougar.

3. Impressive looks and design - a real stunner. Better than any other joystick in this regard.

Cons:
1. Poor gimbal construction. The stick will inevitably develop center play which, in combination with stiff springs, makes the center position feel like a detent - this effectively denies any precision control near the center. A fix for this is available as a 3rd party product, but is costly - almost twice as the Cougar itself.

2. Poor quality potentiometers. With joystick this expensive, HAL (contactless magnetic potentiometers) are the way to go, or at least high quality potentiometers found in competition products. HAL potentimeters for Cougar are also available as a 3rd party product, but are costly (a kit of three is slightly less than 200$).

3. Sticky feel with throttle. The material has quite a difference in friction, which means it is hard to move the throttle, but once you do move it, it is hard to stop it in desired position. No precision here. If the resistance is lowered, the throttle lever falls forward/backward due to its own weight !

Verdict: A wannabe quality product which simply falls short in crucial areas. Requires significant additional costs to make it work as advertised. Definitely not recommended, as there are much better options out there.

For two years I owned a Thrustmaster Cougar HOTAS, touted as the ultimate flight simmer's controller, and in that time I all but stopped simming. Honestly, in two years I flew perhaps a dozen hours at most. Before the Cougar, I simmed much more--off and on for years--and did so on lousy to middling equipment: bargain-bin trash, a CH Flightstick, and later, a CH Combatstick USB. By then I found myself playing Falcon 4.0 religiously, so when it became "necessary" to pick up a throttle, I passed over the homely CH Pro Throttle and reached for the sexy, uber-F16 controller, the Cougar.

Next to the Cougar, any other controller looks like it came free with a Happy Meal. It's so sleek yet solid and rugged--it's simply gorgeous. You'll find yourself ogling it, polishing it, displaying it, and even fashioning dust covers for it. You'll also appreciate its features, ergonomics and simplicity. The trigger is dual-stage. Every button on the throttle falls under a finger. And that throttle, along with gameport rudder pedals (should you have them), plugs directly into the stick base, forging a single mega-controller with a gazillion buttons and axes, all routed to your PC through a single USB plug. Elegant.

Packaged with the Cougar comes a simmer's dream date: a 183-page manual, your guide to the complex software suite that drives the Cougar. You'll want to take it to bed, curl up under a reading lamp and spend the night with it. But that's where the problems start. It doesn't illuminate; it obfuscates. If the Cougar Reference Manual concerned baseball, chapter one would be "The Infield Fly Rule," and the first page would delve into the Old English etymology of "field." In other words, one must learn Cougar-programming in spite of it. Expect to spend several Saturdays getting nowhere. Expect to procrastinate, and, for the thin-skinned among you, expect to give up. And that's too bad, because the point of owning a Cougar, besides its looks, is to harness its powerful programming features for your own purposes.

Ultimately, though, the Cougar is a piece of hardware, and yes, a great looking one. So how does it feel? In a word, STIFF. As a former (and current) CH user, I found it difficult to make small, discreet motions with the stick and tiring to hold precise bank angles. I also found it tough to move the throttle; to paraphrase another reviewer, it's tough to get it going, and once going, tough to stop on a dime (though to be fair, it's the only throttle I've tried). Then there's the issue of bad potentiometers, a common Cougar complaint. Bad pots mean dead axes, and dirty pots mean "spiking" or sudden input surges. I experienced neither. Yet reading Cougar forums induces a nagging fear that those pots will eventually require replacement, or at least periodic cleaning. That's off-putting, to say the least; I thought the whole point of buying the best is so you don't have to do this. In fact, many a happy Cougar owner does this and more, tackling its shortcomings through third-party upgrades: new potentiometers, softer springs, precision-machined brass gimbals, aluminum switch casings, and so on. These mods require not only cash--lots of it--but time, technical expertise and a modest workshop, complete with soldering iron, multimeter and an assortment of lubricants and cleansers. Even getting the Cougar to work as advertised with CH Products' Pro Pedals Gameport (arguably the standard in analog pedals) takes a rewiring job. Not exactly plug-and-play.

Clearly, there's a type of simmer who revels in this. He's the kind of person who loves to work on his car over the weekend. Personally, I'd rather drive my car and leave repairs to my local mechanic. In the case of the Cougar, unfortunately, that mechanic is you, baby, you! Do yourself a favor and take a personality test before buying one. If you lack the tinkerer temperament, not to mention time (sims take enough time already!), engineering smarts and excess cash, consider looking elsewhere. Or you just might end up doing what I did: nothing. I let my Cougar sit idle until one day I sold it.

Personal Testimony:
Well, Ive been into flightsimming since 1985. Ive owned every one of Thrustmaster's flight controllers since the: FCS/WCS, FLCS/TQS, FLCS-Pro/TQS, FLCS-Pro/TQS w/Dig Upgrade Chips, and now the Cougar FLCS and TQS controller set. All of these still exist are in working order in my "collection bin", except that Im using the Cougars presently.

I have not needed to fix the Cougars and Ive had them for about 2+ years now. With proper care (dust covers and keeping the dust off them), not beating on the stick & throttlem or hamfisting the little switches when using, proper electrical care when plugging them (they do contain electro-static sensitive EEPROM chip); they will last a long long time. These are not plastic like all the previous TM controllers, but rather are metal. Being in a Falcon4 flight sim squadron, I put in about 5-10 hours a week using the Cougars. So my Cougars have been used for at least 1000 hours and dont have a scratch or exhibit any spiking or other symptoms.

Reliability:
While it is true that many have bad pots and switches either from the day they were recieved or after 100s and 1000s of hours of use, the vast majority do not experience this kind of mechanical failure. TM will send you the parts for free if you write/email/call them. Yes, it did take about 4 months for me to get backup parts (I didnt need them yet). And yes, there are HALL Effect (electro-magnetic parts) to replace the moving pots (potentiometers) which make the controllers even more long lasting. This would be for those with the money and is very worth the investment if youre logging 100s of hours in your favorite flight sim.

Complexity:
Cougars are not for the techically challenged or timid flight simmer. You will have to know how to program in the TM button command file language (or just slightly modify the existing ones to meet your needs), know how to hook up your flight controllers to work with the Cougars, understand Windows controller utility, use the TM Command and Control setup software, use the FOXY stick file editor and Cougar maintenance software (which is super), understand flight controls as they relate to the aircraft you are simulating an how that maps to the stick buttons and axes, understand the complex flight sim (for hard core simmers that would be: Falcon4, LockOn, MS-FS, IL2 and others).

Support:
Thrustmaster controllers, and COUGARs in particular have a super user community of technologically adept users that are there to help world wide due to the web forums. (...).
With almost a 100 Falcon4 and LockOn online flight squadrons, which you can find with any inet search engine, there are lots of opportunities to get help and join a online flight squadron. The software and bios (flash micro code) is a free download, as are many user controller files. The negative side is that this is a French and Canadian business (Guillemot) that took over the American owned Thrustmaster company, so there are delays in getting parts and finding new units. One often has to find them on Amazon or Ebay (and I dont advise buying used ones as you may be buying a damaged set).

Value:
Or bang-for-the-buck? One movie date with condiments will cost you near $50 for about 2 hours of fun, or $25/hr. You will get 100s-1000s of hours with TM Cougars. Thats $300/100 or about $3/hour if you only fly 100 hours total (which is not very hard core flight simmer). Thats just the quantitative value. For the qualitative value you have the realism, full functionality and "feel". Realism wise, I own a real FLCS and TQS from a F16-A fighter jet. When you put the Cougars next to the real set, they are almost identical in form and function. In fact, the functionality of the Cougars are user definable due to their programmability - where as the real ones have set functions. Just put the Cougars in your hands, and you will feel the solid construction and will have as close as you can come to the real things in the palm of your hands.

Realism:
See for yourself, compare these real HOTAS from a F16-A with the picture of the COUGARs which emulate those found in a F16-C:
(...)
In closing, the TM Cougars have a steep learning curve and require care, patience, perserverance, technical skills and some serious bucks. They are clearly for the high end or "hard core" flight simmer. The CH Products Pedal Pro (gameport or USB) work well with the Cougars. If you want force feed back, I recommend that you instead get a MS Sidewinder Pro2 USB which is a stick, throttle and rudder with FFB all in one with limited user function programmability. Other sticks and throttles Ive tried like: Saitek and Ch Prod have their place, but must bow to the king of controllers: the TM Cougars.

Fair skies and check six,
AV8R

This is truly an impressive joystick/throttle combination. I was overjoyed when I got this as a gift. It worked great for the first few months of use. Unfortunately, the system fell into disrepair, mainly because of poor quality pots. This is a common problem with these units. After spending an entire day taking apart the throttle and cleaning the pots with jewelers glases, reinstalling the firmware and finally giving up, I am looking for a replacement. It REALLY BUGS ME to see what was spent on this item and see how shabbily it was constructed. LET THE BUYER BEWARE !!!

I purchased a Thrustmaster Cougar a few months ago for Falcon 4.0: Allied Force, and it works great. The controls, especially the throttle, fit my hands perfectly, and all the buttons and switches are in intuitive locations and are easy to toggle.

I have observed the symptoms I believe other describe, but have found them to be associated with other reasons. If the emulator feature is turned on (basically turning the joystick into a keyboard), the default programming for Falcon 4.0 can make it appear as though there is a faulty potentiometer, when in all reality the problem is just not having a switch in the proper position, or having a potentiometer not centered. This is similar to accidentally resting your arm on the keyboard, and then wondering why your computer is suddenly acting up. If you make sure everything is centered and ready to go, all the described problems go away.

This joystick is an extreme pleasure to use, and I eagerly await the oportunity to add some rudder pedals to complete the ensemble.

The adaptability and universal nature of the joystick also allows for its use in games that originally are not joystick compatible (such as Freelancer, notorious for mouse associated fatigue), through programming a mouse emulator into the joytick's movements. VERY COOL!

All in all, this is a great product, and I can't help but wonder if the probelm other's are describing are software problems rather than hardware problems.

But, this brings me to another point - This stick is for the tech savvy only. To truly bring out the stick full potential, and understand its little nuances, the circuits of the stick and the resulting outputs need to be intuitive. Having something this universal and adaptable seems to almost always come at the cost of increased complexity (which is what I like, so I guess I'm biased).

Anyway, I love this product, and would suggest this for people who are not only looking for the ultimate flight sim stick, but also those looking for a top notch emulator that's adaptable to any game.

The only reason I bought the Cougar is simply because I knew they won't be making the "Cadillac" HOTAS's anymore. Not now that Guillemot has killed this particular market with its offering of the Cougar.

Poorly manufactured in China, you WILL have to replace the pots (sensors that detect joystick and throttle movement) within a year or two. You WILL have to realign the speed brake switch YOURSELF because they're too lazy to correct the manufuring process. You WILL curse a blue streak when you realize the latest "drivers" are worse than anything Microsux could cook up for fumbling your USB.

The joystick itself has a terrible clunky, ratchety feel to it. You can tell when you are in the middle of the X axis as well as the y axis.

You shouldn't buy this product unless you realize it will take at an additional $450 worth of modifications to make it what it's supposed to be. This is for new sensors and new gimbals - i.e.: the heart of any joystick.

For $250+ I'd go with a CH Products HOTAS. Don't kid yourself, this joystick is metal and therein lies the only piece of its worth. Makes a great door stop.

The Thrustmaster HOTAS is by far the best flight controller system on the market today. All metal construction makes it unique in a field that is filled with plastic. The joystick and throttle each weigh in at 8 pounds and will not move off your desk no matter how hairy the situation gets. They are as real as you can get without having a plane strapped to the bottom of them.

If you are s serious flight sim fanatic, then this is the system for you. Be warned though that while almost every flight sim that is out there right now is supported by the accompanying FOXY software, you may have to still do some reading and the manual is 183 pages long. :)

The manual is necessary though, with the ability to program every button and switch to perform almost any combination of actions that you want them to, you need a powerful program to do that and FOXY is the answer. It has a very easy to use interface, a helpful help file (which many programs conveniently forget) and will even let you make a graphic of your joystick with all the functions you've assigned to the switches so you can refer to it (hopefully while you're still on the ground).

Again, if you live for flight sims, then this is for you. If you are only going to use it every once in a while to frag your buddy, then I would consider a less expensive stick - unless of course you just like having the best of the best . :)

A little over 1-year ago, I purchased this TH Cougar HOTAS setup and I was hoping for a lot more than I got. I can speak with some authority here since I've worked on two, major, military flight sim projects: the F-16 (at Link Flight Simulation..great company!) and the Device 2E7-F/A-18 (Hughes Aircaft Company..another EXCELLENT company!!) simulators. So I've had a lot of "stick-time" in both.

The Cougar is a very realistic HOTAS setup. In form, it looks almost exactly like the F-16 Block 5x FBW (Fly-By-Wire) system found in the actual aircraft (minus the "arm-holder", that is) and feels pretty much the same as well. So, if you are just looking for something that LOOKS "cool" then this is THE stick for you!!

However, I will personally recommend the (fairly new) Saitek X-52 HOTAS setup over the TH Cougar, not because the X-52 LOOKS as realistic (not even close!)but because if you want a HOTAS with hundreds of functions (so you don't wind-up in the dirt when you have to look at the keyboard) and don't have the money (i.e. impoverished, like me :(!!) for the TH HOTAS, then Saitek can't be beat. Saitek's older (but still excellent) X-45 was, and is a great HOTAS even for the most die-hard (like me) FLIGHT sim fans (like me) but, if you plan on using this beast in, say...a "race car" simulator then look elsewhere.

The Saitek X-52 actually surprised me. It was a gift from my wife and, when I had seen it advertised before I just thought it looked like a "toy", and it DOES look like a toy - a very SEXY toy but a toy nevertheless! With its blue LEDs and MFD (on the throttle) it looks so nice I thought there was no WAY I could use a stick like this when flying LOMAC or Falcon 4: I was dead-wrong. Compared to the Cougar this stick feels much more like the "real deal" (although, both the real and the simulated F-16 use a "Transducer" which measure the amount of pressure applied to them and converts this presurre into a voltage-level for use by the FLCS) and, I don't know about you, but the very reason I USE a "HOTAS" setup while flying is so that I do NOT have to take my eyes off the screen and lose Situational Awareness (SA)! Thefore, I could care less about the pretty lil' "Blue Lights" on the Saitek when I'm flying! But it is the ARRANGMENT of the BUTTONS on this X-45 that make it superior to, not only the TH Cougar, but IMHO to any other stick/HOTAS at ANY PRICE on the (consumer) market today!

After using the Cougar (flying Flanker 2.5) for around 2-weeks, the stick itself went "off-center" and no amount of software tweaking (which is, BTW, EXCELLENT!!) would fix this problem. Then, only 3-months later, the throttle went out on me electrically - and I spent over $300.00 (not from Amazon, BTW) for THIS :(??? Where my "new toy", this new Saitek X-52 costs 1/3 as much AND has "SST" software which is (IMHO) as good as what come with the Cougar? There is NOTHING I can do with the Cougar that I can't do with the Saitek and, in these tough economic times that extra $200.00 US comes in handy.

But Ahhhh....I hear some rabid, die-hard TH fans say.."what about the UPGRADES hmmmm...?" and to that I say - forget it. For three-hundred bucks I would EXPECT TH (or whoever is manufacturing this stick now) to already USE Hall-Effect Transistors (which is, from my understanding, what is done to these sticks in order to make them work correctly) and NOT have to have my HOTAS out for (again, from what I've heard) almost a MONTH...or MORE!! Hall-Effect transistors/sensors are NOT that expensive anymore so why neither Saitek OR Thrustmaster bother to actually incorporate them into their design is confusing to me (note: Saitek uses what they call "contactless" technology...so I'm not sure, they MAY be refering to Hall-Effect I don't know for sure?) and, if I'm going to spend $300.00 on a HOTAS only to send it out and spend even MORE money to make it WORK the way it should ANYWAY, then I'd rather just spend an extra $100.00 or so to have this capability OUT OF THE BOX and it would be cheaper to mass-produce WITH Hall-Effect than to have a "specialist" house do it too!!

Anyway, good luck on whichever you choose: they are both EXCELLENT HOTAS controllers and, if you are like me, a "die-hard" flight simmer, not having a HOTAS FLCS system is simply NOT an option, so where do you turn? To the less-expensive X-52 or the over-priced Cougar? BTW, CH also makes, from what understand, an excellent HOTAS system as well and I believe it is priced somewhere between the the X-52 and the Cougar, but I have NO experiance with these sticks so I can't recommend this product. I really wish that the Cougar WAS MORE RELIABLE because it really is THE most realistic HOTAS I've ever seen on the market and its "metal-body" construction makes it feel like the "real deal", but for $200.00 MORE? For me its not worth the price.

At a cost of $269 this was touted as "the last joystick (HOTAS) you'll ever buy." Wrong!! In less than 2 months, the potentiometers (pots) started giving out and caused a lot of stick spike in Aces High. Thrustmaster pointed me to Amazon and Amazon pointed me to Thrustmaster. I pointed to a hole in my wallet and a stick that was barely usable. This seems to be a well known problem and new pots can be had for another hundred bucks. I sold mine as is, took a $100 hit and bought CH USB stick, throttle and peds. It will be a cold day in hell before I spent another nickel with Thrustmaster.