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After blu-ray, what comes next?


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Showing 1-25 of 255 posts in this discussion
Initial post: Oct 8, 2012 10:49:40 AM PDT
Nat Whilk says:
A blu-ray watched on an HD LCD screen looks beautiful, but better technologies may be coming. OLED should outperform even LED LCD significantly. A 4K LCD is already available today. Upscaling to 4K is beginning to feature on BD players. Peter Jackson is filming The Hobbit at 48 frames per second instead of 24. Engineers have developed prototype discs that can store ten times the data of blu-ray.

So which of these new developments do we think would add most to our enjoyment of home theater? Which are we likely to get, and when are we likely to get them? Or does blu-ray meet the average guy's needs so completely that, like CD, it'll be the last mass-market medium of its kind?

Over to you!

Posted on Oct 8, 2012 10:52:34 AM PDT
turkish says:
I think blu ray is the last disc based format that will ever be adopted by the masses. I believe whatever is next will be online streaming or some flash drive etc. I believe there might be another disc based media introduced that has a niche following, but it just wont live to become as successful as DVD or Blu ray.

Posted on Oct 8, 2012 11:00:40 AM PDT
Zeemmarax says:
I agree with Turkish, I doubt we will see another disc based media get big again, time is changing.

Posted on Oct 8, 2012 11:35:02 AM PDT
A M says:
The next technology is a pair of glasses with a tiny laser that projects the movie directly onto your retina. The next after that will be something like in "The Matrix" or "Strange Days" where the movie goes straight to your brain bypassing your eyes and ears completely.

Posted on Oct 8, 2012 10:16:51 PM PDT
Izekael says:
we are decades from the amount of bandwidth needed for mainstream download services. Also you have the human need to physically hold something.

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 9, 2012 2:43:43 AM PDT
EdM says:
As you have already pointed out, Blu-ray Disc technology is extensible. It has already added 3D, more/better lossless technology for audio, including the possibility of more channels of sound, 7.1, e.g. The latest high end BD players already have 4k upscaling, just introduced. The standard for BD will continue to be extended for quite a while, IMO, and you'll still be able to play your old style BDs and even DVDs on future gear. Compare, e.g., the soon to be available

http://www.oppodigital.com/blu-ray-bdp-103/

For most people, IMO, having and setting up present day gear to a high standard, video-wise but especially for audio, will provide the best experience for Home Theater enjoyment. What people talk a lot about, streaming, really provides a very poor quality experience compared to real BD quality, especially for discs mastered to best practice for A/V quality. Note that in A/V, it is the A or audio that comes first...

Posted on Oct 9, 2012 6:58:23 AM PDT
A M says:
"Also you have the human need to physically hold something."

Most people are not that materialistic. But it is important since Christmas is when most retailers make their money. Movies, Music, Books, and games are all things we give as gifts. Not so much to family members and immediate loved ones - but to friends, acquaintances, co-workers, etc.

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 9, 2012 7:40:39 AM PDT
Kubricker says:
Decades? Really? You think 'bandwidth' will even be talked about 'decades' from now? I mean look how much has changed in even just the last 10 years......

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 9, 2012 9:35:48 AM PDT
mr. critic says:
Flash memory cards just like digital cameras use today could eventually be lightning fast and dirt cheap. No matter how high tech people get, there will always be drug stores, grocery stores, Wal-mart, malls, and shopping plazas for impulse buyers who might not actually go to the trouble of downloading a movie but would pick it up on the day they get paid.

Posted on Oct 10, 2012 7:04:24 AM PDT
Rykre says:
"Also you have the human need to physically hold something."

There's alot to be said about that statement.

In fact, that is why more that half of the people who still smoke cigarettes, smoke. And drinkers drink. It's that physical sensation of holding something and ingesting it.

Sure, I can see one of my favorite movies that I own on disc, stream on my TV through Netflix, but I don't enjoy it as much that way because I like seeing and reading the DVD box it came in, and putting on the disc in my disc player because I know the picture and sound quality will be at its best, that way. Even if the difference is only tangibly minute, it's the personal possession of the movie, that nurtures a small sense of ownership pride.

Does that make sense to you?

Just like mp3's, too. They can never sound as good as the CD itself. By owning the CD, and it's artwork, and the such: appeases a small pride of personal possession. For me anyway.

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 10, 2012 8:10:39 AM PDT
C. Barbus says:
[Customers don't think this post adds to the discussion. Show post anyway. Show all unhelpful posts.]

Posted on Oct 10, 2012 12:12:40 PM PDT
A M says:
"Even if the difference is only tangibly minute, it's the personal possession of the movie, that nurtures a small sense of ownership pride."

But there is one big thing you are not accounting for. Most people watch a movie once and never again. They don't want to or need to own it. Music is different. Because the average person will listen to the same album or song multiple times in their lives.

Before iTunes revolutionized music, there were online music services like Rhapsody. But they didn't really take off because as Steve Jobs said, "people don't want to rent their music." But in terms of movies, Netflix has taken off because people are fine "renting" their movies. Now of course, none of these are absolutes. Obviously, people do listen to Pandora and do own some movies. But I am talking the general trend of most people.

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 10, 2012 1:08:01 PM PDT
EdM says:
A M - I think there is a lot of variability about what you say on repeat performances. That is, of the YMMV sort. I cannot count how many times I've watched "Casablanca" and many other movies that have repeat performance appeal. I was up to ~ 10 X, for "Star Wars" in the theater alone, much less repeat performances afterwards on LD, DVD and now BD. So, it depends.

OTOH, some movies are so into the mystery or narrative of what will happen, that once you know the ending of the film, the repeat potential goes into the dumper. My wife does not much like to repeat watch movies, but I do. Among the things I really enjoy is some of the absolute beauty of the cinematography. Not to mention all the movies which have great music. How many time has the theme from "Lawrence of Arabia" [which I'm patiently awaiting for on BD, to rebuy after my LD] run through one's head? That music is just magnificent.

OTOH, there are films that are extremely forgettable, and one time is enough [or too much]. There are more than a few films that you can't really appreciate the depth of until you've watched them again, to discover yet more detail in that wonderful film.

Rental serves a purpose, just as does watching a film on TV or cable the first time - so you don't make a mistake. It also is a way to enjoy for not much $$, if the viewer is one of those who do not like to repeat watch.

Music is different, though. Some songs that initially do not appeal, after repeated play on the radio, etc., grow on a person and become quite popular/well liked. This happens much less often with movies, in part because of the requisite investment of time, usually 90-150 minutes for a movie vs. 3-4 minutes for a song.

This also ignores the historical aspect. Who wouldn't like to listen [occasionally watch] to a historic performance of some classic by some long dead great, especially when it is recorded in excellent quality? I have a great fondness for Louis Armstrong doing "We Have All the Time in the World" [recorded when he was too ill to play his trumpet], featured on the soundtrack of the James Bond film "On Her Majesty's Secret Service", to advance the story.

Then, we have the crossover of music and film, with all the great and not so great concert BDs. I have quite a collection of popular and classical music BD performances, many of which are in outstanding audio quality which is possible for the first time [for the vast majority of people] via BD and the lossless audio possible. Just the other day I watched/listened to the London Calling: Live in Hyde Park [Blu-Ray] yet again, with great enjoyment, including seeing the legendary, the great, "Big Man", Clarence Clemons, soul of the E Street Band, no longer with us.

Who could forget such legendary performances or fail to repeat enjoy such? Even some BD movies that have worn thin with time for me, like Risky Business [Blu-ray], still have good parts, like the train ride or the legendary underwear, air guitar and lip sync performance of "Old Time Rock and Roll" by Cruise.

So, as to renting vs. owning, I can only say, YMMV. My collection fondly continues to grow, while my wife bugs me to get rid of some of the old movies [and CDs] that overflow our shelves.

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 10, 2012 7:02:55 PM PDT
Netflix being the future might be conceivable if they have every single movie ever cataloged. Unfortunately, they don't, so if you want to watch something indie or foreign, you're likely out of luck.

Posted on Oct 10, 2012 10:02:37 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Oct 11, 2012 7:16:21 AM PDT
Rykre says:
Well, some people want to go out and buy every movie that is new, and watch it once, then allow it to sit proudly on their DVD movie shelf forever. That's totally ridiculous, and I know at least two people that do this. What's wrong with these people?

I won't buy a blu-ray of a film unless I think that it was something far above fabulous. And nothing much in the past 20 or so years, has excited me much.

I've got about 350 favorite movies on DVD and Blu-Ray. I wish I can find the time to watch them all again. Plus, many favorite concert DVD's. But, I have them, at the ready, proudly to be seen again, whenever I find the time. I've canceled my Netflix account because I'd rather re-watch a favorite classic, than to see a new film nowadays. Most new films, more often than not, bore me. All mostly CGI, and very little tangible story to follow. I'm bored with that.

New stuff simply bores me. If I'm not at the beach, or golfing, then I'll stay home and pour a glass of Negr@ Medella and put on a favorite classic from my youth. The eighties and nineties are where most of my favorite films came from. Even the sleepers that many people may have never heard of, or forgot about, mean more to me than what they put out nowadays.

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 11, 2012 9:51:17 AM PDT
A M says:
@ EdM

Yes, Your mileage may vary. Because if you look at my post I say "Most people" and "the average person." I even say "none of these are absolutes" and end by saying that what I am saying is only "the general trend of most people."

@ Jonathan A. Chang

I wasn't saying Netflix is what is next as an answer to the original post. I was merely pointing out another point of view to Rykre's statement about people having a sense of pride in ownership. I believe that exists for some people, but not most when it comes to movies.

Posted on Oct 16, 2012 6:09:27 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Oct 16, 2012 6:11:53 AM PDT
Nat Whilk says:
I'd be very reluctant to go from collecting discs to downloading. My BD cupboard, like my CD cupboard or my bookshelves, is a reminder of much past happiness and a promise of happiness to come, and one of those things that helps my house feel not just a house but a home. I agree that it would be odd to keep a disc that I had no intention of ever watching again, but - I must be lucky! - all but three of my choices over the years have been more than enjoyable enough for me to want to hang on to them. (Being old and dopy, I find that seven or eight years after I've first watched a disc, my recollections have become so threadbare that revisiting the movie always brings a few surprises.) Also, I like the thought that if I ever become too poor to afford high-bandwidth broadband, all my favourite movies will still be available free in their Amerays - and eventually available to my heirs as well!

As for what will happen if 4K ever comes into our homes, I would guess that some form of disc is a more plausible carrier than the net. 4K discs could be marketed to anyone in the world with an electricity supply - 4K downloads only to people with access to very expensive infrastructure. I would guess that BD will turn out to be home theater's equivalent of the CD - the carrier so good that only the most enthusiastic hobbyists want to go beyond it. 4K son-of-BD will arrive as a niche product about as popular as SACD, I think. I doubt whether most people will be keen enough on 4K to finance the investment that would be needed to create a 4K-capable internet. We'll see!

Posted on Oct 16, 2012 12:02:13 PM PDT
Rainman208 says:
I'm just one person but i can NEVER see myself going to streaming or downloads to build a movie library. There are too many elements that have to be given up (especailly at this point) to replace an inexpensive disc.

Others have made very good points to the fact. Bandwith issues/;imitations. But even if there was unlimited cheap bandwith there's still the fact that you can't take your download anywhere, loan it to anyone, sell it if you get tired of it or are in a pinch. Whatever the next thing will be for me will still have to be something physical and portable. Also where are all these downloads going to be stored. Is everyone going to own banks of Multi Terabyte hard drives? Where one crash/power surge and poof entire library gone. And with all the DRM on online purchased media do you really think you'll be able to go to Netflix and say "Hey my hard drive crashed can I re-download all the movies I ever bought from you again at no charge"? Good luck with that.

If all the new 3D, 4K, 11.1 HD Audio stuff and whatever else everyone thinks is coming can be placed on a flash card (say the size of a credit card) I could see something like that being a replacement for a Blu-ray disc but no way is streaming or downloads with it's inferior quality and restrictions will be the next mainstream media owning format.

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 17, 2012 9:58:36 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Oct 17, 2012 11:10:22 AM PDT
Nat Whilk says:
I've experienced more gremlins in one year of using the internet than in twenty years of collecting videodiscs! I wonder if this record is typical?

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 20, 2012 1:47:11 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Oct 20, 2012 1:57:19 PM PDT
EdM says:
About "If all the new 3D, 4K, 11.1 HD Audio stuff and whatever else everyone thinks is coming can be placed on a flash card"

Two news items:

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-33199_7-57535570-221/ultra-high-definition-officially-replaces-4k/

"The display format formerly known as 4K will now be called "Ultra High Definition" in the home, the Consumer Electronics Association (CEA) announced in California today.
"The CEA said it chose Ultra HD to denote that it has a higher resolution than the existing 1,920x1,080 pixels of full high definition..."

And the first software/movie:

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-33199_7-57467138-221/first-4k-movie-available-for-sale/

"First 4K movie available for sale"

"If you're a fan of visually stunning documentaries like "Baraka" and "Earth" then you might be interested in "TimeScapes," the first 4K film available to own and view at home.

"Called "TimeScapes"... It's a 50-minute film featuring some pretty stunning night sky cinematography, and just one frame of the film (the image above) won 2010 astronomy photo of the year.

"The film is available in a number of different formats with the highest bit rate 4K version on its own hard-drive setting cinema enthusiasts back a whopping $299. Meanwhile you can also get a lower-quality, though still 4K resolution, version on a USB stick for $99. The film is also available in a Mac Retina Display optimized download, as well as Blu-ray and DVD."

OTOH, the ordinary BD and especially the DVD versions are not [yet] in 4k/Ultra HD, nor is the Retina Display version [also yet, although Retina Display is higher than 1080p]. Still, this is what is possible right now. I presume the 4k USB flash drive uses high speed devices to be able to do the throughput needed for Ultra HD.

ADDED - from the supply point of view, one might note this development:

http://www.dpreview.com/news/2012/04/12/Canon-EOS-1D-C-4K-capable-DSLR

"Canon has unveiled its promised 4K capable DSLR, the EOS-1D C, which can capture 4K (4096 x 2160 pixel) video at up to 24p without downscaling, from an APS-H crop of its 18MP full-frame sensor..."

When the tools are reasonably available, I'd expect the movie product to follow with a bit more speed. Plus, all those 4k remaster scans done right for BD could be repurposed for UHD BD ... I think that content providers would be happy to make more $$ for a UHD version.

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 21, 2012 9:22:49 AM PDT
So are you saying that if you had a choice of seeing your favorite movie as a fully restored print in the cinema (which you can't hold) vs a DVD of the same film, you'd prefer the DVD simply because you can hold a box in your hand?? That's fetish and has nothing to do with enjoying or appreciating movies.

Also, people enjoy a drink because of its effect and not because it's "physical" (we'd all be drinking milk otherwise)

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 21, 2012 9:53:24 AM PDT
Nat Whilk says:
I gave up going to cinemas decades ago. At home I can watch a movie without distractions, at the sound level that suits me best, without commercials and without wasting time travelling - and save money into the bargain. Just the bus fare to my nearest cinema is more than $5, and I've got blu-rays that cost me less than that!

I'm not sure that the physicality of media is aesthetically irrelevant. Taking your disc down from its shelf and putting it in your player begins to put you in the right frame of mind to enjoy what you're about to experience. (One of the reasons, I think, that some people are still loyal to LPs - there's something about the little ceremony of wiping away the specks of dust and lowering the stylus into the groove that starting up a CD can't equal.) By the time you've taken a Harry Potter BD out of its Wizard's Collection, you feel as though you're already half way to Hogwarts!

Posted on Oct 21, 2012 2:42:44 PM PDT
Cavaradossi says:
Not to mention the sheer fun of having at your beck and call whenever you want it the best picture and sound. There's no waiting for it to arrive in the mail, nor do you have to wait for it to be streamed or downloaded. (remember that best picture and sound bit?) There is also the fact that collecting is a hobby and owning is a big part of that. Those who disdain physical media and prefer streaming and downloading obviously aren't collectors. The particular joys of that hobby mean nothing to them. Well, more power to them, but I bet some of them have hobbies that not everyone shares, too.

Posted on Oct 21, 2012 3:37:33 PM PDT
Otter0911 says:
Sorry Cavardossi but I have to disagree,

First I have to ask why is it always Streaming vs. Physical ? Why can't you be a collector and have best of both worlds?

I'm sorry to say but sometimes Best Picture and Sound can be streaming. I can give you a couple of examples...

Memphis Belle only on a Non-Anamorphic DVD (piss poor transfer) I own it on Vudu Anamorphic 1080p with Dolby Digital 5.1+...Which is better picture and sound?
The Legend of Billie Jean only made on MOD DVD-R....On Vudu 1080p with Dolby Digital 5.1 again which is better?

I'm a big collector of movies hundreds of BDs and HD DVDs, 1000+ DVDs, I forget how many LDs I still have...I love collecting movies on Physical and Streaming.

Posted on Oct 21, 2012 3:55:08 PM PDT
A M says:
"Just the bus fare to my nearest cinema is more than $5, and I've got blu-rays that cost me less than that!"

And how much is the bus fare to the Best Buy or Walmart where you buy your discs? Maybe instead of collecting discs, you should save up your money to buy a car. Or do you live in New York City where a car is a hindrance?

The funny thing is that when you say, "Taking your disc down from its shelf and putting it in your player begins to put you in the right frame of mind to enjoy what you're about to experience." That is what I get from taking a seat in a theater and waiting for the lights to go down with a tub of Popcorn. David Mamet also writes about that. But I haven't heard anyone talk about that in regards to home theater until now.
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Discussion in:  Blu-ray forum
Participants:  59
Total posts:  255
Initial post:  Oct 8, 2012
Latest post:  Nov 2, 2013

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