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Self, Not-Self, and Reincarnation


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In reply to an earlier post on Apr 15, 2012 8:48:50 AM PDT
[Deleted by the author on Jun 1, 2012 10:20:24 PM PDT]

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 15, 2012 8:52:15 AM PDT
[Deleted by the author on Jun 1, 2012 10:20:32 PM PDT]

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 15, 2012 9:03:16 AM PDT
sbissell3 says:
Matt,
I know when I was in India the Naga Sadus more or less stayed stoned (on a mixture of 'black' tobacco and Hash) but according to my teacher it had more to do with suppression of sexual urges than anything else. We sat with them one day and even in translation their thoughts were mostly gibberish.

I've thought a lot about this and it is only my opinion of course, but my primary feelings are that 'short cuts' such as any of the drugs that act on the brain are illusory. I don't mean to discount your experience, but my own is the opposite.

BTW, the use of ayahuasca (a harmala alkaloid) is not nearly as prevalent in the Amazon as some contemporary writers lead us to believe. All of this class of drugs work by 'tricking' the digestive system not to metabolize them and then 'getting past' the blood/brain barrier and directly into brain cells. If that description of the process does not scare the bejeezus out of you it ought to.

Again, however, my primary issue is that any insights that involve drugs come, almost by definition, from 'outside' and I would not trust them.

To paraphrase Jack Kornfield (or someone) there are many paths to the truth, but any path you chose has to have 'heart.' I just don't see the 'heart' in drugs.

Much Metta,
Steven

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 15, 2012 9:16:15 AM PDT
[Deleted by the author on Jun 1, 2012 10:20:39 PM PDT]

Posted on Apr 15, 2012 9:41:34 AM PDT
sbissell3 says:
Matt,
Actually as an evolutionary biologist it is easy for me to conclude that drug induced changes in brain function are less 'real' than others. For example oxytocin levels in the brain change during meditation (I have one teacher who can do this in seconds) and the body releases other hormones and such under different stimuli. For example I'm off to, hopefully, let loose a plethora of endogenous opioid peptides on a elliptical machine at my gym. Later today I'll do a long (45 minute) sit and, hopefully, reduce both melatonin and serotonin levels. I find that, as a biologist, to be in accord with my evolutionary and ecological history while the ingestion of drugs in order to change brain function is not.

I've had, in the past, a lot of experience with taking various drugs and, in the end, I personally find them more harmful than not. Again not to discount your personal experience, but I feel keeping things 'simple' and 'real' does not imply short-cuts and may, often is in fact, the more difficult path (albeit less dangerous).

BTW, if you are hanging out with people who put MDMA into your drinks you need to find new company. My teacher often talks about this as being part of 'Right Action' in the eight-fold path. As part of 'Right Action' is, in my tradition, abstention from intoxicating drinks and drugs causing heedlessness.

I don't want this discussion, which is interesting, to become strident, so I'll let this be my last comment.
Much Metta,
Steven

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 15, 2012 10:00:39 AM PDT
[Deleted by the author on Jun 1, 2012 10:20:48 PM PDT]

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 15, 2012 11:00:39 AM PDT
In my opinion it's all creating illusions. Some are beautiful, some are horrible, some are so-so. But all these mental constructions, 'castles in the sky', are the same. They are distractions and the stuff of Mara -the symbolic creature who destroys the possiblity of Awakening.
Check out my book and see what I'm talking about :- )
ciao

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 15, 2012 10:44:59 PM PDT
[Deleted by the author on Jun 1, 2012 10:20:54 PM PDT]

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 16, 2012 6:08:18 AM PDT
[Deleted by the author on Jun 7, 2012 4:40:58 AM PDT]

Posted on Jun 18, 2012 6:39:48 PM PDT
Having seen the how the delusion of a self works, enabled the seeing of how conditioning occurred. Then thoughts arose that considered that Karma is simply the result of conditioning, and sankaras/sankalpas is the process of de-conditioning. This happens simply be the recognition that a reaction is the result of habit.
Reincarnation is what happens every morning when the mind kicks in and re-establishes an I (a self is born) and the death of identity with self is what stops the wheel.

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 27, 2012 10:27:32 PM PDT
jpl says:
Self, Not-Self, and Reincarnation

jpl: [my opinions]
1. The Self. Is there an essence to individuals? [jpl] I think we all possess a self for a short time.

2. Not-Self. [jpl:] I think consciousness is a trick of the mind.

3. Reincarnation. [jpl:] No such thing.

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 28, 2012 11:39:54 PM PDT
The Self: nothing but concept. (believed before awakening)
Not-Self: just another self (called not-self, but still a concept)
Reincarnation: ??? Can't know, so also a concept.
What's left ?

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 7, 2012 12:27:33 AM PDT
FreeThinker says:
Well said Vince

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 18, 2013 10:00:04 AM PDT
Scott Wells says:
You are correct in saying that reincarnation is a concept and that we "can't know" whether there is any validity to it. However. I've read numerous accounts of children who apparently came close to dying, and there is a certain startling similarity to their stories. They see a light, and (almost always) they are met by a guide who makes them feel comfortable. They often go into the light, and they often meet loved ones who previously have died. I find these stories more compelling than the theories that scientists have come up with to explain them (i.e oxygen deprivation can cause euphoria and a perception of "light", or simple hallucination). Also, some people who have had these experiences very adamantly state that they "know" that there is no death.

Posted on Mar 18, 2013 11:06:29 AM PDT
And it could be true. The buddha confirmed that there is rebirth. However, in the 'big picture' of becoming Enlightened it doesn't matter and will only be an obstacle.

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 18, 2013 10:51:12 PM PDT
i have wondered it the rebirth mentioned is what happens every morning when the organism wakes up and the thought story of an I is retold.
Obviously then, once the I is Recognised as conceptual and not actual, that no longer happens, and so the cycle of 'birth' and 'death' (when sleep occurs the I disappears, dies) is broken.

Posted on Mar 19, 2013 10:28:09 AM PDT
[Deleted by the author on Mar 19, 2013 3:23:16 PM PDT]

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 19, 2013 1:00:01 PM PDT
when i dream i think -feel- intend as me the waking person so for me sleep doesn't end the I

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 19, 2013 2:34:01 PM PDT
Isn't it a different I in the dream ?
..and how do you know that what you take as waking isn't a dream. After all you don't know that you are dreaming till you wake up, do you ?
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Discussion in:  Buddhism forum
Participants:  64
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Initial post:  Dec 28, 2007
Latest post:  Mar 19, 2013

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