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Deleting posts and banning people in Amazon is correct?


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Showing 1-25 of 138 posts in this discussion
Initial post: Apr 20, 2009 8:22:58 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 24, 2009 9:43:51 AM PDT
J.J. Edwards says:
Hello everyone.
I'd like to put forth a question as mentioned above.
Though it looked small and nobody's business, I reckon that it ultimately affects each and every one, including Amazon itself.
So I decided to bring it up. Please express your candid opinions.
The more voices heard, the better ideas and adjustments be available in the future.

Accused: Kevis Hendrickson (Author of The Legend of Witch Bane)
Prosecutor: Amazon
Charge: Violation of Terms and Conditions

Mr. Kevis Hendrickson was allegedly accused of spamming while promoting his book in discussion forums.
In response to the alleged violation, Amazon had deleted all of his past postings (regardless of relevance pertaining to the charge)
and revoked his posting privilege permanently. Currently he is no longer able to join any discussion.

It is noted that some postings of Amazon are regrettably abusive, profane, vulgar or purposefully hurtful and sometimes pure slander,
which remains every corner of Amazon, uncensored and untouched, which makes customers frown, yet an individual (an author, a reviewer of nearly 50 reviews, and a contributor to whom many customers gave credit of being helpful)
was singled out and banished from a domain, to which public are expected to access. Given that Amazon is the host, however, I was surprised,
and couldn't help since but keep wondering if there could have been a better way of dealing than current measure by Amazon.

This is a summary of the said matter. I'd like to gather your thoughts and opinions.
And I encourage you to visit other communities as well to take a look at what others had to say about this.
I wish our discussion help better and freer atmosphere in customer discussions as well as future action of Amazon be more constructive.
What do you think?

Posted on Apr 20, 2009 11:22:36 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 22, 2009 8:25:51 PM PDT
D. Becker says:
I have no idea who Mr. Hendrickson is or what he allegedly did, but I'd venture to say that, as an author, he should be held to a higher standard than a common, garden variety internet troll.

If he was truly spamming I'd say the punishment was harsh, but just.

Posted on Apr 21, 2009 1:52:46 AM PDT
Colin Taber says:
I've had a few posts out there myself to let people know about my own book, but no where near as many, or pushing as hard. I did think, in the above mentioned case, a line was crossed.

Repetitive posts with that kind of agenda are irritating. A concern about that kind of conduct is that it soon becomes dominant in the forums and disaudes people from joining the discussions - or even being able to find any!

Someone cut-and-pasting comments to enter them repeatedly into threads is not adding to the discussion.

The real problem is that there are few effective ways to promote a product here for new authors - I've been waiting for a reply to my own query emails to Amazon for months (regarding buying paid advertising space).

In the end, there's no easy solution.

What do others think?

Posted on Apr 21, 2009 3:39:28 AM PDT
They say that any attention is good attention. But it's not true. There is one thing worse. Utterly negative attention. That will kill your will, and desire to continue, faster even that being completely ignored. One does have to wonder, though, how many of the rest of us have crossed that line, intentionally or not?

Posted on Apr 21, 2009 5:40:46 AM PDT
Someone did run some forum posts that specifically ask authors to promote their books. I thought that was a great idea and it allows people to put in their sales pitch. It also didn't force uninterested forum readers to be exposed to advertising, they could just skip the post.

I don't know the author mentioned, and although the ruling sounds harsh I didn't see the spam to decide for myself.

As a small author on Amazon, I have also not tried to cross lines in advertising where inappropriate. I bring that up only to mention something that someone else did on my own book page. Under my fantasy book, in the Tags, appeared a person's name and a book name which had no relation to my book. I looked it up, and sure enough such a name existed and was the author of that other book. It left me wondering, is that author using my book as advertising space?

I know any author wants to put their book in the minds of people, but you have to be careful of crossing any inappropriate lines and generating a negative image.

Posted on Apr 21, 2009 6:05:47 AM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on May 6, 2009 2:57:26 PM PDT]

Posted on Apr 21, 2009 7:19:42 AM PDT
Hypothetically, if it were Stephen King posting about his book everywhere, would he have been banned?

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 21, 2009 7:24:18 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 21, 2009 7:25:46 AM PDT
CJS says:
An interesting point, but, of course, Stephen King would have his own forum.

...or forums.

...or multiple dedicated websites.

...or a gazillion-dollar marketing campaign being rolled out by his publisher. ;-)

Posted on Apr 21, 2009 7:37:14 AM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on Apr 21, 2009 1:00:50 PM PDT]

Posted on Apr 21, 2009 8:12:51 AM PDT
Ithlilian says:
I know a couple of people I'd like to not see around here trolling on forums, but I just ignore them, no need to ban.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 21, 2009 8:46:14 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 21, 2009 8:47:14 AM PDT
I agree with Ithlilian (your ID is hard to type accurately). These forums give us the option to ignore a customer completely or comment on the pertinence of the post. I avail myself of both. I haven't noticed Kevis Henderson being more than sometimes pushy on any threads I was following so I can't comment on the infraction. I do think that if the various gadflies that cluster on these forums (including the one that posted here) can continue then a permanent ban may be harsh.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 21, 2009 9:21:45 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 21, 2009 11:47:49 AM PDT
peace says:
Frankenstein aka "Jim The Waco Kid",

WOW! They banned him and the they let you stay?

You may think it's funny, but saying stuff like that crosses the line of common decency and is in very bad taste.

He could sue you for libel.

Posted on Apr 21, 2009 9:27:44 AM PDT
S. Lyn Hill says:
J.J., this is a thoughtful forum. Well done. I like your comments, Joyce! Go for it, chaos!

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 21, 2009 12:35:52 PM PDT
Mrs. Garside says:
I read a couple of this guy's post. Does anyone know if Amazon warned him he would be banned if he didn't cool it?

There are plenty of places to push your own work. Jumping into discussions just to yell 'Hey! Read my book!" won't get you anywhere.

Posted on Apr 21, 2009 12:43:38 PM PDT
Mrs. G:
Kevis is a good egg, he's just over-endowed with enthusiasm. A couple of times, he almost went 'viral' (posting many KTT-related threads in one night, for example). Several of his friends (myself included) dumped ice water over his head for that one. Thing is, he wasn't just promoting his own stuff...he was also spreading the word about other books he liked, and other authors he respected. He was actually quite selfless, but didn't realize that he was irritating a few 'Zonners. That's all it takes, really.

He was kinda like a big ol' Labrador...just full of tail-wagging, cat-chasing enthusiasm. He was warned once, but it was about something else, I believe. It's too bad, because his posts weren't hard to avoid if one found them annoying. He never trolled, said anything bad about anyone, or was anything other than supportive both as an author and as a reader. His opinions were generally well-conceived and helpful when he participated in discussions.

Oh, well...and so it goes.

'Archer'

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 21, 2009 1:00:21 PM PDT
[Customers don't think this post adds to the discussion. Show post anyway. Show all unhelpful posts.]

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 21, 2009 1:23:01 PM PDT
peace says:
Not sure why you find that funny. You can't just go around saying inflammatory things about people and expect no reaction. It's one thing to go around trolling and causing trouble, but his post did cross a line. Not funny.

Amazon did delete his post. Who's laughing now?

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 21, 2009 1:26:33 PM PDT
[Customers don't think this post adds to the discussion. Show post anyway. Show all unhelpful posts.]

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 21, 2009 1:37:57 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 23, 2009 6:38:08 AM PDT
peace says:
Well, that's where we disagree. His (Frankensteins aka Jim) comments went far beyond simple insults. He was maligning his reputation.

And I really didn't expect he was going to be sued. I just said he "could" be sued for comments like that. And I stand by that.

Posted on Apr 21, 2009 1:47:41 PM PDT
I'm not familiar with Kevis, but I regret Amazon's decision-any intelligent voice deserves to post, and I'm sure Archer is right about the rest. I bet he was a nice guy. It's a shame. I wonder why Amazon doesn't ban others who only seem interested in insults? They create lots of work for Amazon, I'm sure.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 21, 2009 1:52:38 PM PDT
Magdalen77 says:
I was puzzled by his posts being removed. I don't frequent the KTT threads and I found most of the other things he posted to be pretty innocuous. Certainly there are enough other people posting rude, random, off-topic and just plain weird things without banning Kevis.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 21, 2009 5:37:34 PM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on Feb 9, 2010 11:29:38 PM PST]

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 21, 2009 5:38:06 PM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on Feb 9, 2010 11:29:38 PM PST]

Posted on Apr 21, 2009 6:01:58 PM PDT
Hmmm....the appeal of KTT. Took me 'til the eighth iteration to discover the appeal. Until then, I found it annoying for some odd reason. Since I've discovered the fun of a purely social thread full of talented people, most of whom have a sense of humor, I wish I had the time to keep up.
;-)

Posted on Apr 21, 2009 6:20:50 PM PDT
Ithlilian says:
I'm not a fan of authors spouting on every single thread about their book. Put it in the threads made for that purpose, not on every thread imaginable. It's pretty obvious that they are the authors too, "oh you should check out this obscure book with no reviews with a paint program cover by author such and such, it's really great..."
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Discussion in:  Fantasy forum
Participants:  43
Total posts:  138
Initial post:  Apr 20, 2009
Latest post:  Jul 27, 2009

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