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Is Spanking a loving or harmful form of discipline? Part II


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Initial post: Apr 4, 2010 7:05:46 AM PDT
"No one is more truly helpless, more completely a victim, than he who can neither choose nor change nor escape his protectors."
- John Holt

Posted on Apr 4, 2010 8:40:39 AM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on Dec 26, 2011 3:06:07 PM PST]

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 4, 2010 8:44:16 AM PDT
Lizzie B says:
Oh please! Give it a rest.

Posted on Apr 4, 2010 10:19:14 AM PDT
Chickenmama says:
E. Logan,
your sarcasm betrays you. Kids need to be birthed, loved, fed, etc. No kid wants to be spanked & it's clearly not used by many successful societies so is obvious not necessary. I have been paying attention for decades to who promotes spanking and who doesn't. I've found, informally, that those who insist spanking is a good and necessary thing have a much lower rate of successful kids. My kids are highly disciplined young adults & were never spanked. There's tons of ways to get through to a kid without spanking, ask any good teacher.
Teach your children well.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 4, 2010 10:23:48 AM PDT
W. Van Fleet says:
C,

Do you think that it is possible to engage in child rearing that avoids punishment absolutely as much as possible, and instead makes highly skilled use of reward, teaching, and modeling for identification? Do you think that punishment is necessary?

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 4, 2010 10:49:47 AM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on Feb 22, 2012 1:27:55 PM PST]

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 4, 2010 11:24:31 AM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on Feb 22, 2012 1:27:57 PM PST]

Posted on Apr 4, 2010 11:28:53 AM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on Feb 22, 2012 1:27:58 PM PST]

Posted on Apr 4, 2010 12:59:03 PM PDT
Not Moses says:
Why does the topic have to be handled in all-or-nothing, always-or-never fashion? Might it be that a swat or two (and that's about it) can be useful during the pre-operational era but usually not well into in the concrete operational era (see Jean Piaget), as well as on a case-by-case analysis?

Regardless, we're not going to change a world full of parents who were trained how to parent by -- and about as mindfully as -- whoever parented =them.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 4, 2010 1:13:28 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 4, 2010 1:14:42 PM PDT
"Why does the topic have to be handled in all-or-nothing, always-or-never fashion?"

Because people's minds are very, very small. And it's more fun to personally harass posters.

Now that I am on the front page:

DO NOT GIVE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS TO THE OP! HE HAS BEEN KNOWN TO POST PEOPLE'S PERSONAL INFO ON AMAZON!

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 4, 2010 1:31:09 PM PDT
Not Moses says:
I have no problem with his posting my info, but thanks for the heads-up. The passive-aggressive spraying on Internet forums is expectable. The Internet seems to be a Karpman Drama Triangle "village." In whatever event, it looks to me like the popular culture tends toward black-and-white thinking because of its unconscious oral traditions and authoritarian, as opposed to rational-empirical, values. At heart, we're Old Testament, Holy Roman Empire Germans it seems. (Okay, volk, chew on that! Hahahahaha.)

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 4, 2010 1:54:31 PM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on Feb 22, 2012 1:28:02 PM PST]

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 4, 2010 2:01:15 PM PDT
Not Moses says:
Fair enough... and nice to see that there =are= people participating who can catch that.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 4, 2010 2:01:45 PM PDT
SemperFi-mom says:
[Customers don't think this post adds to the discussion. Show post anyway. Show all unhelpful posts.]

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 4, 2010 7:54:23 PM PDT
"Oh please! Give it a rest."-- ekory

When corporal punishment of schoolchildren is banned in all 50 states!!

Posted on Apr 4, 2010 7:59:37 PM PDT
"A child whose life is full of the threat and fear of punishment is locked into babyhood. There is no way for him to grow up, to learn to take responsibility for his life and acts. Most important of all, we should not assume that having to yield to the threat of our superior force is good for the child's character. It is never good for anyone's character."
- John Holt

Posted on Apr 4, 2010 8:44:11 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 4, 2010 8:44:29 PM PDT
"Fortunately, it is not necessary to choose between styles of parenting that increase the probability of masochistic tendencies (corporal punishment with love) and those that increase the probability of aggression (corporal punishment without love). The alternative is to keep the love and affection, but stop hitting".
- Murray A. Straus, 'Beating the devil out of them', Lexington Books, 1994

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 4, 2010 8:54:49 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 5, 2010 12:41:20 AM PDT
Not Moses says:
"A child whose life is FULL of the threat and fear IS locked into babyhood..." in many cases, but not all. Many children are "resilient" for whatever reasons, genetic, interpersonal, social supportive, educational and otherwise. It appears (on the basis of what we see in the widespread personality testing of college students) that parents do best to 1) make a loud noise and unhappy face immediately upon observing the infant or toddler acting inappropriately, 2) punish inappropriate behavior by limitation or "time out" rather than corporal punishment after the age of about three, and 3) concretely (as opposed to merely verbally) demonstrate the consequences of inappropriate behavior after the age of five or so. That said, escalation to immediate, single stroke "cuffing" on a safe area of the under-five-year-old child's body replicates effective and appropriate animal behavior so long as it occurs immediately after the infraction. Regular striking of, or even yelling at, children above the age of five, especially in public where the child begins to associate humiliation with experimentation and learning, has been shown to create =major= problems over the long developmental run.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 4, 2010 8:59:52 PM PDT
LeslieP says:
Spanking IS a harmful form of discipline.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 4, 2010 9:00:32 PM PDT
LeslieP says:
not in alabama!!!

Posted on Apr 5, 2010 12:00:05 AM PDT
Whale Tart says:
Roger Garrett;
So far you make the most sense.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 5, 2010 12:39:33 AM PDT
Not Moses says:
I'm just a channel for the results of empirical research. But two full centuries after the supposed "age of enlightenment," we're still fighting some of the same old battles. On a lot of fronts.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 5, 2010 7:45:42 AM PDT
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In reply to an earlier post on Apr 5, 2010 7:48:17 AM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on Dec 26, 2011 8:40:00 AM PST]

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 5, 2010 7:48:53 AM PDT
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Discussion in:  Health forum
Participants:  402
Total posts:  4507
Initial post:  Apr 4, 2010
Latest post:  Jul 14, 2012

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