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In reply to an earlier post on Nov 11, 2012 6:17:03 PM PST
Gregory Mays says:
>>Second, I did not know the Mormons were also baptizing Muslims.<<

Actually, I don't know that either.....I know lots of Mormons, but I know none that has done a Mission to the Arab or Islamic World. That may not be a coincidence. Firstly, trying to convert a Muslim to anything else, is a crime in all Islamic countries. Quite often, punishable by Death!!

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 11, 2012 6:57:06 PM PST
Gregory Mays says:
>> circumsize dead Mormons <<

You know, that is an issue....
Utah has the lowest rate of circumcision, organ donation, and autopsys in the US. Why?
Because the Mormon Faith believes that the physical body that is buried upon Death, will be 're-animated', intact, during The Rapture. Not as a spirit, but as a physical being. Men will die, and then reanimated as Gods. They believe that God walked the Earth as a physical man, and therefore it's consistent that men whol become Gods, and reanimate as physical beings, to assume a physical rule over many planets.. A physical being missing a foreskin, or a heart, or kidneys, or lungs???? Or worse yet, an autopsy victim whose guts have been cut away and scrambled? That's a problem for Mormons.
More of a problem when you consider decomposition. Is the remaining skeleton going to be re-animated with some memory of the body that went with it? If so, why does it matter if the kidneys were cut out after Death?
They have no answer for that.
But in the early Mormon Faith, they thought The Rapture was right around the corner. Brigham Young thought that the American Civil War was certainly, 'The Event'. Rotting bodies, missing various parts, were not worried about, nor contemplated.

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 11, 2012 11:11:48 PM PST
They stopped sending the boys to Russia, too. Too many of them were coming home in boxes. The LDS, oddly enough, has a huge virtual area in Second Life that they use to train the missionaries. I used to really hate having the missionaries stop but lately it's a session of "Do you know x?" and I call their parents and say they look fine. It's a parent thing I guess, kind of like Munchausen by proxy. My Bishop absolutely hates Mormons, but, then, he hates just about everything but money, when you get right down to it. I rather like their predictability.

Posted on Nov 12, 2012 5:43:59 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Nov 13, 2012 5:33:51 AM PST
Steelers fan says:
RE Joseph Smith

I live not too far away from Kirtland, Ohio; the original Mormon temple is still there. The Kirtland bank failed, which didn't endear Joe and his followers to the locals.
Mormonism is absolutely fascinating as a part of American history. It shows how ignorant most people were of the Bible at the time. Doctrinally, it is Anglo-Israelism with an American twist; Jesus came to America and preached to the Indians. It borrows very heavily from Freemasonry; Joe Smith himself was a Mason. The Mormon temple rite is depicted in "The Godmakers", which is on YouTube.
Smith's history as a "treasure digger", and his family's reputation for shady dealings, were well known in upstate New York. The sect kept alienating itself with people and had to keep moving farther and farther West (New York--Ohio--Illinois), ending up finally in Utah, where there weren't any more white men to pi/s off. Brigham Young was one of the great leaders in U.S. history; he must have been enormously strong and charismatic, in order to keep the group together. Without him, Mormonism might well have gone the way of many other nineteenth-century sects which eventually died out.

"As man is, God was. As God is, man may become." Not exactly Judaism, or Christianity.

Posted on Nov 12, 2012 5:51:32 AM PST
Steelers fan says:
To date, no etymologist in the world has yet identified any language known as "Reformed Egyptian", which is, supposedly, the language of the writings on the golden plates Smith claimed to have found. And, if I'm correct, none of Joe's original "witnesses" (Cowdery, et. al.), actually SAW the plates...

You be the judge.

Posted on Nov 12, 2012 9:09:03 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Nov 12, 2012 9:24:52 AM PST
Steelers fan says:
There is absolutely no archaeological evidence of the humongeous battle in North America between the (white) "Nephites" and the (dark) "Lamanites", which, according to the Book Of Mormon, took place in ancient times. Not a single spearhead.

Posted on Nov 12, 2012 9:14:13 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Nov 12, 2012 9:15:22 AM PST
Steelers fan says:
And the Book Of Mormon itself is interesting. It is a direct imitation of the King James Version Old Testament, down to its English-translation vocabulary, syntax, and grammar. One would expect the Book Of Mormon, in translation, to use 19th-century American English. But it mimics the English of the 1611 KJV, as if it had been translated over two centuries earlier! You be the judge.

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 13, 2012 3:36:16 AM PST
Ard Fhaidh says:
Why would one would expect the Book Of Mormon, in translation, to use 19th-century American English?

Posted on Nov 13, 2012 4:48:49 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Nov 13, 2012 4:49:09 AM PST
Steelers fan says:
Uh, because it was "discovered", in America, in the 1830s...not in England in 1611....

Posted on Nov 13, 2012 4:49:54 AM PST
Steelers fan says:
Although, I suppose a divine spell could have come over the translator, causing him to write in early 17th century English English...

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 13, 2012 4:52:28 AM PST
The LSD Church was founded about 1820 and is considered to be the first religion established in America. A new church and a different religion
that has surpassed older religions in membership and finances and is still a mystery to many. A Catholic President frightened many but if any
mention of voters being afraid of Romney because of his religion was not mentioned on a large scale.
I live where the Mormon Trail begins,they were welcome when they first settled as honest,hardworking people but then more and more arrived
and it was clear that it would be a Mormon Church,livery stable,bank,dry goods store to the point that people said enough is enough move on.

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 13, 2012 4:54:03 AM PST
Cliff Sedge says:
Latter Say Daints?

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 13, 2012 4:56:17 AM PST
I am sure there will be some posts about the Generals so I have only one short story that sums it up.
Mother is helping her 3 year old son take a bath in the tub.
Son points down between his legs: "Brains down here?"
Mother: "Not yet."

Posted on Nov 13, 2012 5:36:49 AM PST
Steelers fan says:
Or 1820s. I forget the year Smith discovered the plates. He needed special glasses to translate them, and they had to be kept in a hat.

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 13, 2012 6:34:54 AM PST
Bubba says:
Smith said he found the plates on September 22, 1823 at a hill near his home in Manchester, New York after an angel directed him to a buried stone box. No mention was made of whether Smith had imbibed in any intoxicants prior to the angel appearing.

Posted on Nov 13, 2012 7:20:22 AM PST
Steelers fan says:
Yeah. The hill was "Cumorah". The angel was "Moroni".

Posted on Nov 13, 2012 7:33:14 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Nov 14, 2012 7:17:05 AM PST
Steelers fan says:
Very early on, Charles Anthon of Columbia University, one of the leading scholars of ancient languages at the time, was consulted about "Reformed Egyptian", as it related to the golden plates. One Martin Harris was Joseph Smith's scribe in writing down the characters copied from the plates. The copied characters as sent to Anthon were forged by Mark Hofmann, who claimed to have found them in an old Bible; Hofmann sold them back to the LDS hierarchy, which was eager to bury anything related to Joe and the plates. Hofmann, caught in his fraud, committed two murders in the 1980s; he is doing life in prison. Fascinating stuff; "The Mormon Murders" is an excellent read.

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 13, 2012 3:16:24 PM PST
vespasian says:
Good news everyone. My wife and I had our hearing today with the IRS to determine how much of my outstanding tax bill of 95'000 we will have to pay.. The answer is 0.00. Kudos to tax attorney Andy Jackson in St Augustine fl,,,vesp

Posted on Nov 13, 2012 3:18:48 PM PST
vespasian says:
Ive been off site for awhile. Has anyone read "Under the Banner of Heaven" by Jon Krakauer?. Its about the Mormons, polygamy and murder. Highly recommended.. vesp

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 13, 2012 4:05:42 PM PST
Leslie Funk says:
Hey vesp! Good on you and the nil balance! If we ever hook up, the next round is on you! What the hell, buy yourself a round, as well as your attorney! Great news!

Cheers, Les

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 13, 2012 4:07:04 PM PST
Leslie Funk says:
I've read several of Krakauer's books...mostly dealing with Everest and the like. I will give this a try. Thanks...Les

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 13, 2012 6:58:10 PM PST
Rachel says:
vespasian:

I am glad to hear this news!

Rachel

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 13, 2012 7:03:33 PM PST
vespasian says:
Thanx Les. Im going to give my attorney a 250$ bottle of cognac I bought on a cruise as a gift. I dont know if he drinks or not. Hes a tall rangy kid who went to college at Hampton-Sydney in Richmond Va. One of two all mens colleges in the U S A. He did a heck of a job for us but a lot of credit goes to my wife who spent endless hours in gathering documents etc. We had submitted earlier an enormous amount of information plus we put our heads together and wrote an apologia worthy of the Bard>>> vesp

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 13, 2012 7:10:21 PM PST
vespasian says:
Bubba, The hill was near Palmyra NY and apparently there is something of a Mormon theme park there now. On one of their summer outings they have a reinactment of the Book of Mormon on stage with a cast of hundreds. The place is kinda their version of Mecca and a Mormon should go there at least once in his life. Funny thing that both Mitt and Dem Majority leader Harry Reid are both Mormons. Reid says that Mitt is screwing up the religion. I would think so if you abondon 47% of the population as being unworthy of consideration as Mitt does...vesp

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 13, 2012 7:24:06 PM PST
vespasian says:
Steelers fan, Youve got the story a little mixed up. Smith was a seer and had something called a peepstone which he put in the hat while the hat was on the table. Hed then stick his face into the hat and was able, due to the stone, to translate the gibberish. Apparently that period of American history was called the "Second Great Awakening" of religious fervor. New messiahs were popping up all over the place. Smith was the only one to last it out, though. The place they finally ended up was naumoo , Ill before heading West. They had a continuing problem with their neighbors for being very clanish. People didnt like them and there were many murders on both sides. Young had a hitman named Porter who did Brighams dirty work for him . He's said to have murdered over 20 guys and actually shot the exgoverner of Missouri twice in the head. The guy was a pscho but apparently theres a restaurant named after him in Salt Lake called "Porters Place" ITs a fascinating story to read. If a person wanted to read only one book on the Mormons Id read "No man knows my history" by Fawn Brodie. She was an ex-Mormon and a splendid historian and told the whole story, warts and all..vesp
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Discussion in:  History forum
Participants:  166
Total posts:  10000
Initial post:  Feb 1, 2012
Latest post:  Feb 13, 2013

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