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Borrowing Kindle books how many times? (NOT Prime borrowing)


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Showing 1-25 of 106 posts in this discussion
Initial post: Dec 25, 2011 10:26:51 AM PST
Deuce says:
Ok ... I borrowed some books from my daughter (Hunger Games trilogy). I read them all. I returned them to my daughter. My wife and I ahve same Amazon Account. She has begun to read my books via Cloud on her computer.

Question: Can she borrow Hunger Games AGAIN (second time) from my daughter to read or is there a limit to how many times you can borrow a book? Seems to me there should be unlimited borrowing ...such as if you cannot finish it in the 2 week period.

Thanks.

Posted on Dec 25, 2011 10:29:11 AM PST
Frank says:
One time, 14 days. That's it.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 25, 2011 10:29:19 AM PST
CLS10 says:
No. Books can be loaned ONE time only or 14 days, per publisher limits.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 25, 2011 10:31:13 AM PST
No. Books can only be loaned one time. You will have to borrow those from someone/somewhere else - local library, perhaps?

You may think there should be unlimited borrowing, but the publishers don't. Because they are the ones who decide what books can be loaned at all, it's their opinion that matters, not yours.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 25, 2011 11:02:09 AM PST
Deuce says:
*****M. Francis says:
No. Books can only be loaned one time. You will have to borrow those from someone/somewhere else - local library, perhaps?

You may think there should be unlimited borrowing, but the publishers don't. Because they are the ones who decide what books can be loaned at all, it's their opinion that matters, not yours.****

I had a feeling. This is one of the things that trouble me re: digital books. They are not TOTALLY mine. I buy a "paper" book it is MINE. I can loan it, sell it, even burn it if I am so ignorantly inclined. But MINE. I bought it. Digital copies (per the "Frankenstein" fiasco at Amazon some years ago) can even be removed from my device if "someone else" desires. Being digital reading is in it's infancy these are the growing pains. But I would support the same rights per ownership as the "paper owners have. Imagine the "book police" comming into our homes demanding to see our "paper copies. Absurd. I fear this will end up in the courts one day. I understand the economics for publishers view but .... I BOUGHT it. I is mine. Or so it should be.

Thank you for the info.

Come the revolution ... first lawyers, then insurance, then life long politicians ...THEN digital publishers? LOL!

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 25, 2011 11:40:00 AM PST
Carbonbased says:
To answer your original question: No, there is no limit on the number of times you can borrow a title. What you need is a broader group of people to mooch off. There IS a limit on the number of times your daughter can lend a particular title...once, for a maximum of 14 days.

As an alternative, you could join Prime. All the Hunger Games books are available in the Kindle Owner's Lending Library.

Too bad you didn't pick up the trilogy when it was on sale in September for $4.38.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 25, 2011 11:57:57 AM PST
But you did not buy the book. You bought a license to read it on specific device(s). That is what you agree to when you buy digital books. If you can't agree with that, then stick to paper books.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 25, 2011 12:16:51 PM PST
Deuce says:
****M. Francis says:
But you did not buy the book. You bought a license to read it on specific device(s). That is what you agree to when you buy digital books. If you can't agree with that, then stick to paper books.****

I detect a certain snottiness to your answer but in the spirit of Christmas I will let it go. I KNOW I bought a license. I said, "They are not TOTALLY mine." I DO live with it. I do not agree to that being my only option. When I buy a "paper" book I do not buy a license. THAT is what I want in my digital copies. I do know there are pirate copies of almost all book online that I can "own" outright. I refrain from getting those because I feel it is theft. My point is unless publishers at least loosen up on the borrowing (certainly more than once would be nice) or the ability to "sell" a digital copy (I would even be in favor of the AUTHOR and publisher getting a cut of that) pirating will spread. Bottom line ...yes ...we all agreed to the licensing (since it is the only option) however , in my humble opinion it is wrong and smacks of interference in my owning a book.

Simply because I disagree does not mean I will "stick to paper books." It does mean I and people like be me will advocate and seek ways to get around this narrow rule. Hopefully legally.

Posted on Dec 26, 2011 1:57:53 AM PST
Carbonbased says:
Of course, the purchase of the paper copy only allows one person at a time to read the book...and only as many times as it takes to fall apart. Really, with a recommendation from your daughter and from you, maybe your wife should just buy her own copy. Again, all the Hunger Games books are available for free lending with a Prime membership. There is no restriction on how many times your account can borrow the books--try your local library. I don't imagine the waiting list is longer than a hundred or so.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 6:23:33 AM PST
loriltx says:
Look at it this way--when you loan out a DTB, what you are really loaning out is the medium which happens to contain the words. You can do the same thing with digital books--the medium in this case being your Kindle. Publishers have no problem with you loaning out your Kindle to your heart's content.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 7:03:11 AM PST
Deuce says:
*****Carbonbased says:
Of course, the purchase of the paper copy only allows one person at a time to read the book...and only as many times as it takes to fall apart. Really, with a recommendation from your daughter and from you, maybe your wife should just buy her own copy. Again, all the Hunger Games books are available for free lending with a Prime membership. There is no restriction on how many times your account can borrow the books--try your local library. I don't imagine the waiting list is longer than a hundred or so.****

Indeed in the end we will get our own copy ...but all this begs the question: present restrictions on loaning/using digital books mean I do not OWN the book. This is as much a inconvienience (instead of freely loaning I must BUY another copy? .... yeah in this economy that helps! LOL) but the deeper question of who CONTROLS our books. This new digital world is increasingly in control of those who own the access to the internet. Our email is stored, our shopping is tracked and now the basis of knowledge ...books ...are controlled. Not good. Not what I signed up for. Will I continue to use my Kindle and read digital books. Yes. Is thew bloom off the rose ? Yes. Will piracy increase as a result. Of course yes.

Posted on Dec 26, 2011 7:07:02 AM PST
Deuce says:
*****loriltx says:
Look at it this way--when you loan out a DTB, what you are really loaning out is the medium which happens to contain the words. You can do the same thing with digital books--the medium in this case being your Kindle. Publishers have no problem with you loaning out your Kindle to your heart's content.***

A joke ... I am not angry but not laughing. the issue is ... the BOOK containing the words. It can be loaned ONCE. Period. True I can get Prime but I have already paid $100 for my Kindle +cover ... more for the book ...NOW I must pay MORe $ for the ability of lending what should be MY book? Nah ... sorry. This either must change or I must rethink my use of digital books.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 7:18:33 AM PST
Just Peachy says:
You do NOT need Prime to let others borrow you ebooks.
If they are on your account, they can read them as often as they want.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 7:58:42 AM PST
Deuce says:
****In reply to your post on Dec 26, 2011 7:18:33 AM PST
Pat rum pum pum pum says:
You do NOT need Prime to let others borrow you ebooks.
If they are on your account, they can read them as often as they want.***

Now this is true. In fact while I have a kindle my wife is being introduced via Cloud on the computer and yes we have a common account. SO yes SHE can "borrow" actually read off the same list I have all she wants. But this still leaves , my daughter , friends etc who I can only borrow once. Look I realize that is the way it is for now. So be it. BUT .... stepping back from the admittedly wonderful device ... all is not perfect and the bloom is off the rose. It is clear the control over information which was once in the hands of those who had DTB is not in the hands of Corporations. They control political parties, much of the Internet (Verizon etc) and our communications are no longer legally secret (snail mail vs. email). I think we need to all step back and ask ...Do we want what is now a benign compnay as Amazon/Barnes Noble/ Apple etc. in control of what we read and with the ability to not only change a books info (think the USSR changing discredited leaders in history photos) or to even delete them from our devices. NO ..I am not parnoid ...simple aware this is what those in power do (see Iran/Syria controlling access to Internet/cell phones.

Bottom line ...do you trust ANY company to have unltimate control over the access of knowledge. Over books. I do not. I want a book I buy ...ANY book to be MINE. Same as any DTB. Nothing less will suffice. What is the upside for us submitting to control of knowledge by others?

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 8:02:52 AM PST
Just Peachy says:
I have seldom lent books to other people. So I'm happy with my ebooks.

No one is taking away my access of knowledge, if anything I have MORE access to knowledge when I look at all the free books I can get through my Kindle. I can also still read DTBs all I want.

If "nothing less will suffice" then perhaps an ereader is not for you. Amazon will let you return it.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 8:32:48 AM PST
Deuce says:
****In reply to your post on Dec 26, 2011 8:02:52 AM PST
Pat rum pum pum pum says:
I have seldom lent books to other people. So I'm happy with my ebooks.
No one is taking away my access of knowledge, if anything I have MORE access to knowledge when I look at all the free books I can get through my Kindle. I can also still read DTBs all I want. If "nothing less will suffice" then perhaps an ereader is not for you. Amazon will let you return it. ***

If fact (google Amazon/ Frankenstein) there have been incidents of people buying books and Amazon removing those books from the devices. True they "agreed" to stop the practices and returned the books but the ability remains and as far as I know is not illegal. Likewise the ability to "change" history digitally remains. True ... as it stands we have more access to knowledge. But it is not secure. It become evident to no me that this new mode of accessing knowledge in it infancy has growing pains. Of course I like the benefits and will keep my KIndle. Do I trust OTHERS with control of my books? No. DO you actually trust Amazon, the govt. or anyone else with "protecting" your books? When I say "nothing else will suffice" I mean ... we must have as complete control over the books on our devices as we have with DTB. Otherwise we concede our freedom of the "press" and reading to the powers that be. This is unaccessible. 1984 / MArxist/ Fascist control over knowledge is not a thing of the past. It may be dormant but not exstinct. Simply put: Why do we not have the same control over our digital books as with DTBs? And becasue "THEY" have decreed does not suffice. I want to keep digital reading ...with DTB freedoms.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 8:36:30 AM PST
Just Peachy says:
I know the story about Amazon removing 1984.
Understand some of us are happy with the current way of ebooks. It's not a big deal for everyone. I understand it is for you. Then go write to publishers and try to get it changed. Return your Kindle for a refund and go buy a bunch of hardcopy books.

I just expect Amazon to "protect" my books long enough for me to read them. Most of mine on my kindle are novels. I'm okay if I don't read them...I still have DTBs and access to DTBs. Seriously, if this is the worst problem in the world you have to worry about then go for it. I have bigger fish to fry in my life.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 9:12:19 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Dec 26, 2011 9:15:15 AM PST
Deuce says:
*****Pat in Georgia says:
I know the story about Amazon removing 1984.
Understand some of us are happy with the current way of ebooks. It's not a big deal for everyone. I understand it is for you. Then go write to publishers and try to get it changed. Return your Kindle for a refund and go buy a bunch of hardcopy books.I just expect Amazon to "protect" my books long enough for me to read them. Most of mine on my kindle are novels. I'm okay if I don't read them...I still have DTBs and access to DTBs. Seriously, if this is the worst problem in the world you have to worry about then go for it. I have bigger fish to fry in my life.***

This is an example of the lack of manners and general snotty behavior people exhibit when their cherished views are questions. I never mocked you or anyone. I engaged in a very simple conversation. I never TOLD you what to do or expect you to care. I was expressing my opinion. Apparently doing so evokes comments such as your that would never be done face to face. Another example of the lowering of manners on the internet. Cyber-punks.

I will not nor have the desire to return my Kindle. I do expect the same protection over digital books I pay for as DTBs. That is all. What I am sayings is ... it is short sighted for Amazon et al to control books as they do which will limit or at worst endanger the future of digital reading. And encourage piracy which has already begun.

What you do is irrelevant to me. It is not the worst problem in the world for me (a life threatening illness, a son-in -law in the military likely soon to be deployed, , the future of our country, economy and children to name a few take precedence) but it is an interesting issue. It amazes me people do not care but then my days of caring what happens to others (I was a street Social Worker who volunteered to live in ghettos and group homes for 10+years) is low on my priority list.

I simply think books I pay for should be MINE, not licensed. Does no one else think this smacks of control? Apparently not. So be it. I tire of your snotty remarks. I have said enough apparently. I will bore you no longer. This does not mean I am wrong. Simply that you and those like you have no or little problem handing over control of books to an anonymous power. So be it.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 9:26:41 AM PST
Just Peachy says:
I didn't say you were wrong. I'm simply saying it is not a big concern for ME. It doesn't mean either of us are wrong, just have different views.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 10:07:48 AM PST
BetHoff says:
So the fact that someone disagrees with your opinion means they lack manners and exhibit general snotty behavior? Looked in a mirror lately? Funny how people who lecture others on how they should behave are usually even more guilty of the behavior they criticize.

If you were only looking for affirmation of your opinion rather than input from others, some of which included suggestions for how to accomplish what you want to do, why did you bother posting a rant like this on a public forum?

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 10:18:49 AM PST
Carbonbased says:
Really Deuce, if you're old enough to have a daughter outside the home with her own Amazon account, you're old enough to stop with the "will piracy increase?" drivel. How is it persuasive argument to demand, "If we can't get it for free, people will STEAL it!!!1!" That's hardly going to sway the publishers.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 10:19:56 AM PST
Exactly!

I don't care about "control" . It doesn't bother me at all. Damazon has always been fair to me.

IMO Damazon should have the right to yank a pirated book (1984) off of our kindles.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 10:22:31 AM PST
Also people forget Damazon is a *business*. Kindles are meant as a consumption device. Borrowing or library books were just suppose to be the icing on the cake.

Damazon wants us to *buy* their media. Why can't people understand that? (not meant towards you Carbonbased but towards the OP and other misguided users).

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 26, 2011 10:31:13 AM PST
Carbonbased says:
Deuce says: "I simply think books I pay for should be MINE..."

And yet, this whole thread is about a book that you DIDN'T pay for, you mooched it off your daughter and now you're upset that you can't mooch it again. Find some other unsuspecting Kindle owner and mooch their loanable copy.

There, now THAT's snotty...just thought I'd point that out, as you have more than once mislabeled thoughtful replies as 'snottiness' in this thread.

Posted on Dec 26, 2011 10:31:54 AM PST
N. Rasmussen says:
Why are so many people being mean just because it's a message board? Would you talk that way if you were face to face with this person? Honestly, the phrase "if you can't say something nice don't say anything at all" applies online as well as in the real world.
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Discussion in:  Kindle forum
Participants:  35
Total posts:  106
Initial post:  Dec 25, 2011
Latest post:  Aug 9, 2012

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