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Rolling Stones fans, I have a question....


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In reply to an earlier post on Jan 6, 2013 8:10:48 PM PST
Last edited by the author on Jan 6, 2013 8:15:26 PM PST
zlh67 says:
I never hated it, but coming between 2 albums that rank among their best (certainly their best post-1972 albums), it's not hard to see why it's now thought of as a massive dud. Sales of an album often have more to do with the album BEFORE, so yeah, I think some people bought it off the strength of Some Girls figuring that whether or not they liked the single, it'd be more vintage Stones (Some Girls had the disco-ish "Miss You" but apart from that was mostly vintage styled Stones). So my guess is that all the die-hard Stones fans bought right away hoping it'd be Some Girls II plus a fair amount of fair-weather fans, propelling it to #1 for a spell, but after those 7 weeks at #1 it sank like, well, a STONE. I personally wonder if the reason we don't see "She's So Cold" on more comps is because if they gave us that and the title track, would anyone still be buying the album? I know I wouldn't have....

But yes, I too bought the ER album for the first time here fairly recently (a year or 2 ago) and don't find it a complete miss, but apart from the 2 singles and 1 or 2 other tracks, it's pretty forgettable. Not terrible, just not real good.

I always found it amazing that the next album they made (Tattoo You) was something of a rush-job they did just to be sure they had a new album before their tour and was made up of a lot of leftover tracks from previous sessions but was so much better than ER. If an album ever had potential to be a complete dud, that was it, but I like it quite a bit. Side 2 bogs a bit but overall the albums is about twice as good as ER imo.

Posted on Jan 6, 2013 10:01:13 PM PST
Last edited by the author on Jan 6, 2013 10:06:24 PM PST
Zlh:

The UK versions of Aftermath and Between the Buttons are fantastic but beware, Buttons is going to take you by surprise as it is very English pop and the Stones had done nothing like it before or since. '67 sure was an odd year for them. Satanic is a great 60s psychedelic album (to hell with the naysayers) but again, very un-Stones like. I really like the UK Out of Our Heads also.

The Singles Collection is superb, but yes, there is some fat to deal with. I happen to find their b-sides charming, if not quite classics but some of them are actually extremely good...like Child of the Moon and Dandelion. Also check out the US only release of Flowers.

Posted on Jan 6, 2013 10:08:03 PM PST
@zlh67: I don't think ER is terrible, either--it's better than almost anything post-81, IMO--but as you say it's a bit of a sag from the two albums immediately surrounding it.

I think your first instincts about their back catalog are correct. Get the UK versions of Aftermath and Between The Buttons. You've probably heard all the singles from that era anyways, so it's time now to see what good albums they made at that time.

"I always found it amazing that the next album they made (Tattoo You) was something of a rush-job they did just to be sure they had a new album before their tour and was made up of a lot of leftover tracks from previous sessions but was so much better than ER."

That's because The Rolling Stones always managed to leave *stellar* outtakes in the vaults. "Tattoo You" was just scratching the surface; they have at least two, maybe three outstanding albums' worth of material still in the vaults. "Metamorphosis" was strange in that while there's some good material on it, in general they picked some of the least interesting 60s outtakes to go on there (esp on side one). They finally started to release some outtakes again on the "Exile" and "Some Girls" deluxe editions, but there's still plenty left, especially from the "Satanic", "Beggars" and "Bleed" sessions. "Goat's Head Soup" yielded a few unreleased gems, too, like "Criss-Cross Man" and "Separately".

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 6, 2013 10:09:54 PM PST
Last edited by the author on Jan 6, 2013 10:10:13 PM PST
@Exile: "I happen to find their b-sides charming, if not quite classics but some of them are actually extremely good...like Child of the Moon and Dandelion."

The b-sides from 66-68 were very good. "Child Of The Moon" is wonderful. Before then you had "Play With Fire" but not much else, and after that you generally didn't have too many non-LP b-sides (a few, but nothing of note that I can recall).

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 6, 2013 10:10:55 PM PST
The Stones themselves had nothing to do with Metamorphosis. In fact they had taken out full page ads asking people not to purchase it. That was all ABKCO's decision.

Posted on Jan 6, 2013 10:13:28 PM PST
Dr. Mikey says:
@zlh67: If you get the ABKCO Singles set check to make sure that you have three different discs. As I've complained about before on this forum, I bought the box and although the labels indicated the three different CDs, it turned out I had two copies of disc 2 even though one of the labels was correct for disc 1. I was particularly upset because disc 1 (the early stuff) was what I most wanted. I bought it through Amazon from an affiliate dealer, but didn't play it for quite a while and didn't catch the mistake. I guess I should go back through my orders to see if I still have a record of which dealer it was and if I can do anything to correct it. I have bought dozens of CDs from Amazon in the meantime, so probably can't find my records. I wish someone would compile the very early Stones' material when they were still bluesing it up, but I'm sure there is only a limited market for it compared to mega sets like Grrr!, which I have btw.

Posted on Jan 6, 2013 10:26:42 PM PST
Also if I'm not mistaken, ER was half Some Girls outtakes and a few new songs to make an album. When I heard the Stones were releasing a deluxe version of Some Girls that had outtakes from those sessions I said, "Why? They have already done that and called it Emotional Rescue." LOL

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 6, 2013 10:31:44 PM PST
Dr. Mikey:

Oddly enough I was perusing through my order history on Amazon and came across a CD I had ordered about 1 year ago but had never received. I had forgotten all about it so I wrote Amazon and explained the situation and they gave me the option to repurchase it or get a full refund. I figured that since I didn't even notice it never came I took the refund.

However if you purchased through a 3rd party it may not be as easy.

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 6, 2013 10:36:46 PM PST
@Exile: by "they", I didn't mean The Stones.

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 6, 2013 10:39:01 PM PST
@Exile: the songs on ER which originated from the "Some Girls" sessions were the better ones. Those 77/78 sessions yielded a gold mine of songs, and was really the last time they were truly inspired. The new stuff on ER wasn't that great, and "Tattoo You" was almost all outtakes (a lot of them also from the SG sessions or earlier), then "Undercover" and everything afterwards...forget about it.

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 5:08:34 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Jan 7, 2013 6:47:11 AM PST
Either it was that album or Decca's "Stone Age" that you're referring to, or both.
The group hated "Stone Age". Though in fairness to Decca, "Stone Age" had tracks available to UK listeners for the first time. Likewise a following compilation "No Stone Unturned".

Allen Klein rejected an outtakes collection selected by Bill Wyman.
There were too many non-Jagger /Richards compositions, so royalties were to be insignificant.
The tracks on "Metamorphosis" were selected because they were (mostly) Jagger/Richards songs, ie royalties.

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 5:21:38 AM PST
zlh67 says:
Thanks, Topper. I was surprised at how many recommendations the Singles Collection set was getting as a starting point for a Stones collection so was thinking maybe I should go there next, but much as I do like some songs like "Play With Fire", "As Tears Go By", etc., I do tend to prefer (overall) their later stuff from 1968-71, so going backwards in time album by album is probably my best bet, and if I like 'em all, then maybe I'll pick up the singles collections to get the non-album A&B sides....

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 6:03:38 AM PST
Dee Zee says:
zih67, I would still consider the Singles Collection. It remains a dynamic overview of the Stones mono singles output in the 1960s. There are some great b-sides not available elsewhere such as Stoned,, Off the Hook, Sad Day, Who's Driving Your Plane. Child of the Moon, Memo from Turner and I Don't Know Why I Love You. But if you wanted to go the album route just dive in on what you don't have. I like both the UK and the US versions of Aftermath and Between the Buttons. I'm a fan of it all. Most of all, have fun while rocking to some great music.

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 6:30:22 AM PST
The Stones to this day do not own the rights to their pre-Sticky material. Allen Klein wanted more Jagger/Richards songs so HE could make more money as he felt people would be more interested. In retrospect, it was a darn cool idea.

Posted on Jan 7, 2013 6:30:56 AM PST
It's fascinating to see not only what Stones albums people like but the one's they don't like either. I did not like Emotional Rescue. And while I liked Exile On Main Street I never thought it was the great album most people did. I like mostly everything else up till Tatoo You. After that I lost interest. Like most people though I consider Let It Bleed and Sticky Fingers to be among their best. I even like Stantic Majesties Request which may be the most controversial Stones album in terms of if was good or not. But all those early blues based albums are real gems too. After all that was what the Stones were before anything else. Steeped in blues and R and B. All those early albums like Now and December's Children and so on seem to be pushed aside except for the hits. That's a shame because there really is some good stuff in there. Years ago I found England's Newest Hitmakers with a bunch of bonus tracks. It was just a lucky fine for a fair price. I really enjoyed several of the bonus cuts. Since then I have only saw one other Stones album with bonus cuts (I believe it was Santanic Majesties) I delayed and when I went back to get it, it was gone. I am not familiar with Stone's demos or bootlegs but there must be a wealth of them. I wish they would release all their albums with bonus cuts and new liner notes. They have done a great job with bands like The Beatles, The Moody Blues, The Byrds and others. How about the Stones too!

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 6:39:13 AM PST
That's right. Money for Klein.

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 8:20:08 AM PST
She's So Cold ~ that is probably the reason. it was available on "Rewind" but nothing else for years. The first song is the only one I do not play. Jagger liked to start those albums off with dance cuts, but after hearing 'Miss You' on the "Some Girls" movie, it is hard to think disco because that song rocks.

From what I remember, the real outtakes from "Some Girls" seem to be more country than what is on the actual album, and not much like ER at all.

As for "Aftermath" and "Buttons", I too went UK, because you get 'Back Street Girl' and 'Out Of Time'. You should already have 'Paint', 'Tuesday' and 'Together'.

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 8:25:13 AM PST
SA:

"She's So Cold" wasn't on "Rewind", only ER.

Miss You
Brown Sugar
Undercover of the Night
Start Me Up
Tumbling Dice
Hang Fire
It's Only Rock and Roll
Emotional Rescue
Beast of Burden
Fool To Cry
Waiting on a Friend
Angie
Heartbreaker

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 8:30:30 AM PST
Well there you go. I guess to get So Cold you had to buy the album.

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 8:34:11 AM PST
The deluxe version of "Some Girls" contains the cover of a Waylon Jennings tune, "We Had it All", which was part of the ER sessions, not SG.

But yes, they were experimenting with a lot more country around that time and "Claudine" was originally intended to be on SG but was replaced by "Far Away Eyes" for fear of legal action as "Claudine" was based on French singer Claudine Longett who shot her boyfriend.

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 8:37:41 AM PST
Yeah, but still seems odd. The Stones never did that before so why do it with ER? Certainly it sold enough copies and if I were them, that is one of the albums I wouldn't want people to dive into just for one song.

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 8:41:56 AM PST
The 50 best selling albums of 1980

[ these are US sales figures during the year itself - up to Dec 31 ]

1 pink floyd the wall
2 eagles the long run
3 michael jackson off the wall
4 billy joel glass houses
5 tom petty & the heartbreakers damn the torpedoes
6 bob seger & the silver bullet band against the wind
7 pat benatar in the heat of the night
8 blondie eat to the beat
9 led zeppelin in through the out door
10 kenny rogers kenny
11 kool & the gang ladies' night
12 soundtrack the rose
13 styx cornerstone
14 donna summer on the radio-greatest hits-vol.one and two
15 dan fogelberg phoenix
16 kenny loggins keep the fire
17 christopher cross christopher cross
18 kenny rogers the gambler
19 pretenders pretenders
20 fleetwood mac tusk
21 supertramp breakfast in america
22 commodores midnight magic
23 herb alpert rise
24 molly hatchet flirtin' with disaster
25 waylon jennings greatest hits
26 whispers the whispers
27 linda ronstadt mad love
28 j. geils band love stinks
29 b-52's the b-52's
30 lynyrd skynyrd gold and platinum
31 foreigner head games
32 cars candy-o
33 bee gees bee gees' greatest
34 journey departure
35 ROLLING STONES EMOTIONAL RESCUE
36 dionne warwick dionne
37 boz scaggs middle man
38 brothers johnson light up the night
39 zz top deguello
40 blondie parallel lines
41 ac/dc highway to hell
42 jermaine jackson let's get serious
43 angela bofill angels of the night
44 genesis duke
45 jefferson starship freedom at point zero
46 journey evolution
47 eric clapton just one night
48 cars the cars
49 clash london calling
50 gary numan the pleasure principle

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 8:47:03 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Jan 7, 2013 8:51:35 AM PST
#35 is really not too shabby, especially during the late 70s and early 80s when record sales blew up in comparison to those of the 60s and early-mid 70s. And they edged out Dionne Warwick by a hair and she was huge in 1980...LOL

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 9:07:54 AM PST
I still prefer it over The Wall and The Long Run, which I also consider to be among the worst of each of the 3 bands output.

In reply to an earlier post on Jan 7, 2013 9:21:00 AM PST
Long Run had some decent hits and was the followup to Hotel Cali...Highly anticipated...
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Discussion in:  Music forum
Participants:  35
Total posts:  389
Initial post:  Jan 4, 2013
Latest post:  Jan 7, 2014

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