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Spanking your children should be ILLEGAL.

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Posted on Jun 20, 2012 12:57:22 PM PDT
Deeone says:
Wonder who taught the parents, of the parents, of the parents from the old old days!

and YET contrary to what most people express on here, the oldster's survived the "rough and tumble" childhoods WITHOUT TURNING CRIMINAL . Havin to quit school to work the farm, walkin ten miles to and fro, gettin a whoppin with a cherry switch, oh my my how awful for them poor ol country kids. BUT lety me tell ya, son, them thar country kids learned somethings missin today: RESPECT FOR THEIR ELDERS! HONESTY, DISCIPLINE, CLEANLINESS, AND MANY OTHER IMPORTANT LIFE LESSONS.

I was told once my rights extend to the end of my nose and that's it! The same with yours!

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 20, 2012 1:00:57 PM PDT
mises says:
I'll get to it, okay? Unfortunately there's only one of me to go around. It's like the old song:

Let my love shine throughout the world
To every mountain top and steeple
Let it be felt by every soul
'Til love's all over
Let it reach out to every heart
To every disenfranchised people
'Til it is present and no more is pain all over

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 20, 2012 1:10:38 PM PDT
Richard says:
Deeone,
Research that happens over 20 years or more ! let's see ... WOW
kind of like the stories told in the bible????
+++++

If you want to criticize scientific studies that is fine, but you first must understand the subject. Your comment is grossly daft.

Where on earth did you get the idea that "8 or 10" different people handle it? What are you trying to express? Why did you pick 8 or 10, why not 18 or 30?

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 20, 2012 1:15:37 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jun 20, 2012 1:19:00 PM PDT
kiwani says:
Deeone: "Perhaps those who spend large amounts of time amassing data on here should contribute that time to actual "reality" time in doing something for those children abused/neglected maybe then people could take them serious knowing that person is "doing" something to correct a problem. Not just a lot of "lip" service."
------
~why are you making a huge assumption like this? How do you know people do not/ have not/ are not?

Of course, you have not read back through previous posts on just what was discussed before you joined our thread [3+yrs & 9825 posts after it started] to find out though, have you... ?

If you cannot take the time to do a simple sampling of data/posts here to find out, how do you suppose one could trust you to have up-to-date, accurate info, re. our topic?

Why would you not simply 'ask' if anyone has worked/volunteered time, rather than of assuming & accusing?
[btw, have you??]

It's sorta like: "I know not, what I know not," huh?
-or maybe it's more like: "ignorance is bliss"?

--throw something out there to see what sticks, huh?

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 20, 2012 1:20:56 PM PDT
kiwani says:
yeah, like the last time, lol...
I know how 'that' goes...;)

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 20, 2012 1:42:56 PM PDT
[Deleted by the author on Jun 20, 2012 5:12:45 PM PDT]

Posted on Jun 20, 2012 2:14:53 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jun 20, 2012 2:15:35 PM PDT
Brian says:
Kiwani says: "you have not addressed the "non-criminalized" proposition focusing on parenting-ed as an alternative approach"
------------
Driving around I see a great deal of bad drivers. Do you think forcing people to take driving skill classes years after the pass their driving exam is going to make the worst drivers less inconsiderate of others?

Kiwani what kind of driver are you? A bet Richard is the type who drives in the left lane with the cruise control set at 55 with his seat belt on holding up traffic trying to pass him smugly proclaiming that he is doing the speed limit.

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 20, 2012 3:54:02 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jun 21, 2012 1:11:22 AM PDT
kiwani says:
"Do you think forcing people to take driving skill classes years after the pass their driving exam is going to make the worst drivers less inconsiderate of others? "
---------
yes, if they want to keep their kids [oops, I mean Driver's License], they will learn to be considerate of others...:P

edit: sometimes I'm Road-Runner, and sometimes I'm a turtle...

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 20, 2012 4:06:32 PM PDT
Deeone's comment....

"BUT lety me tell ya, son, them thar country kids learned somethings missin today: RESPECT FOR THEIR ELDERS! HONESTY, DISCIPLINE, CLEANLINESS, AND MANY OTHER IMPORTANT LIFE LESSONS."
------------------------------------------------------------------------
...why is it that you believe.... that the only way to instill these "important life lessons"..in our children.... is to beat them?

and btw.....the demeaning manner in which you portray the damage done to beaten, hit, intimidated and "spanked" children....that effort on your part to minimize the effects of physical punishment tells me that you do know that it can be harmful, but that you cannot intellectually accept change.....

....for you would have to admit that you have known the beatings and spankings are harmful, but you engaged in the actions anyway....and sadly...for yourself, no one has said the beating of kids is not effective in some such way.....the issue is whether beating, hitting or "spanking" a child is the "most effective" and "moral" manner in which to produce a long-term healthy adult who is capable of living up to their potential...without being harnessed with memories of terror, fear, anger and hatred for the souls who were supposed to love, grow and insure their long-term development....

So...if you are trying to "win" the debate through strong voice, critical name-calling and the essential dismissal of every other opinion on the thread....if this is your plan.....it is failing badly....

Regards,

RJ O'Guillory
Author-
Webster Groves-The Life of an Insane Family

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 20, 2012 4:54:24 PM PDT
Brian says:
Kiwani you want to take kids away from their own parents and put them into our foster care system because they were spanked? You really have no credibility if you make that statement with me. Shame on you.

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 20, 2012 7:46:51 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jun 20, 2012 8:48:45 PM PDT
kiwani says:
Brain says: "...you want to take kids away from their own parents and put them into our foster care system because they were spanked?"
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
?WHAT? ---you are unreal...
???WHAT-the-freakin'-Hell are you talking about!!???
I Do Not Want Any Such Thing!!

WHERE in the World did you EVER get such a thought in your head that that is a thought in MY head?
~or what I want???? I Have NEVER-NEVER-EVER-SAID-or-IMPLIED Any Such Thing...
EVER!

Do you KNOW how to read, brian?
Can you interpret accurately what you read?
Do you know how to tell a satirical statement?
I Do Not Think So.

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 20, 2012 11:02:40 PM PDT
"I was told once my rights extend to the end of my nose and that's it! The same with yours!"

--------------------

My dad used to say, "My rights end where your nose begins," and he always made a move with his index fingers, one on his nose and the other extending out to my nose. He meant, "You don't get to hit other people indiscriminately."

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 20, 2012 11:03:27 PM PDT
Richard says:
Brian is a troll, kiwani. It would not surprise me if he and Deeone are one and the same person. There is no way to authenticate people on this forum, so when you see the same ignorant stupid posts originating over and over there is little doubt you are dealing with a troll. Please do not feed them, I regret responding to Deeone. I should know better. Just report every thing brian and Deeone post as inappropriate since all they do is mock and insult people. There is no way either of them are legitimate. Eventually the moderator will get around to seeing hundreds of there inane stupid moronic posts and 86 them.

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 20, 2012 11:10:50 PM PDT
Brian says:
Kiwani and Richard if a parent spanks (nothing more) as a form of discipline and is told by someone like you to stop, would you support a process for taking the child away if the parent refuses to cooperate and take them away from the alleged danger?

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 21, 2012 1:01:50 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jun 21, 2012 1:07:24 AM PDT
kiwani says:
Brian is a troll, kiwani.
----------------
Bump: ^^^
:)

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 21, 2012 1:06:43 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jun 21, 2012 1:08:32 AM PDT
kiwani says:
heard some sports guy answer a dumb question this new way today, so I'll use it with you everytime:

"that is a clown question"

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 21, 2012 1:14:18 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jun 21, 2012 1:15:18 AM PDT
kiwani says:
Brian is a troll, kiwani.
----------------
Bump: ^^^

Posted on Jun 21, 2012 6:44:29 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jun 21, 2012 6:51:01 AM PDT
Richard says:
Overview on partnering with religious communities

Several key elements of the Convention on the Rights of the Child - the most widely ratified and comprehensive legal instrument for the protection of child rights- reflect values shared with the world's major religious traditions. These include:

A fundamental belief in the dignity of the child.
An emphasis on the family as the best place for bringing up children.
High priority given to children and the idea that all members of society have rights and duties towards them.
A holistic notion of the child and a comprehensive understanding of his or her physical, emotional, social and spiritual needs.

Aside from the potential benefits that religious actors bring to partnerships, spirituality and religion can have a profound influence on children's development and socialization and have the potential to reinforce protective influences and promote resilience. The beliefs, practices, social networks and resources of religion can instill hope, give meaning to difficult experiences and provide emotional, physical and spiritual support. When child rights efforts are grounded in the protective aspects of religious beliefs and practices in a community that encourages and enriches the spiritual and religious life of each child, the impact can be far-reaching.

In spite of the positive roles religious communities can play, it is important to acknowledge from the outset that there are often concerns about partnering with them as very real problems and challenges exist. For example, there may be apprehensions that faith-based organizations will pressure aid recipients to convert or will only provide aid to those with similar religious views or practices. There are also reservations about over-stepping religion/state boundaries. In addition, some child rights violations have been associated with religious communities and their values or practices. As religion is one component of a dynamic interaction between social and other cultural factors, some attitudes and behaviours that are understood to be religious may actually be more characteristic of other social and cultural norms. These distinctions are important as unacceptable practices that have their roots in other cultural values can be challenged and changed by religious actors themselves. There remain, however, valid concerns about some religious actors whose approaches and practices are so far out of line with child rights principles that partnerships would potentially undermine the integrity, neutrality and ability of organizations working to achieve children's rights with equity.

At the same time, religious communities also have concerns about partnering with child rights organizations. For example, some have reservations about working within secular structures and being co-opted or used to achieve secular goals. There are also suspicions for some religious communities about the language of rights contradicting core beliefs and forcing religious communities to compromise on their values. It is essential to understand these concerns, as well as why religious communities would want to partner with child rights organizations.

Partnerships are most likely to be productive where there is mutual understanding, respect, trust, open dialogue and shared priorities. Experience in working with religious communities has highlighted the importance of child rights actors having adequate knowledge, skills and attitudes for effective and constructive collaboration. It is important, for example, to understand the immense complexity and diversity of religious communities. Even within particular religious traditions there is a contextualization of moral theology, its interpretation and implementation into action, and a diversity of perspectives among their leaders that needs to be understood to identify entry points for dialogue and partnership around even the most sensitive issues. Ultimately, partnerships should contribute to children's well-being by building on the assets of religious communities, as well as learning from them to shape programme priorities. In many contexts where child rights organizations work, religious beliefs are a significant factor in determining community attitudes and behaviour. Programmes need to understand these dynamics (whether positive or negative) and take religious factors into account in their theory of change. Within such contexts, the question is not whether to engage with religious communities, but how.

It is also important to be aware that the distinctions between religious and secular structures are not always clear cut, given the important role religion plays in the lives of many individuals, including government officials and civil society actors, working within secular institutions. There are also people working within UNICEF and other child rights organizations for whom religion plays an important role and they can serve as a bridge to better understand and engage with religious communities.

http://www.unicef.org/about/partnerships/index_60384.html

Posted on Jun 21, 2012 10:54:33 AM PDT
Richard says:
Teaching children about hell is child abuse. Nothing but the unverifiable promise of permanent bliss or torture in the afterlife would make loving, decent, non-abusive parents inflict it on their children.

http://freethoughtblogs.com/greta/2009/11/25/armor-of-god/

Posted on Jun 21, 2012 11:02:59 AM PDT
Richard says:
Countdown to universal prohibition

Global progress towards achieving prohibition of all corporal punishment of children in all settings is accelerating worldwide, particularly in the context of the UN Study on Violence against Children and its follow up. As at January 2012, the total number of states with full prohibition in law is 32.

http://www.endcorporalpunishment.org/pages/progress/countdown.html

Please bookmark and follow this progress.

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 21, 2012 11:07:47 AM PDT
Deeone says:
RICHARD, please read one of many of the rules you continuously break on here!

What shouldn't I post?

Behave as if you were a guest at a friend's dinner party. Please treat the Amazon.com community with respect. Do not post:

Profane or obscene, inflammatory or spiteful comments
Messages that abuse, denigrate or threaten others

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 21, 2012 12:10:06 PM PDT
awesomep says:
Deeone:

Bravo!

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 21, 2012 12:14:18 PM PDT
Brian says:
Richard only applies his values and standards to others never himself. It is one of the things that makes him so darn entertaining.

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 21, 2012 12:14:32 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jun 21, 2012 1:12:13 PM PDT
awesomep says:
Richard says:

Teaching children about hell is child abuse. Nothing but the unverifiable promise of permanent bliss or torture in the afterlife would make loving, decent, non-abusive parents inflict it on their children.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

So teaching children or anyone about Heaven or Hell is abuse according to your conclusions, because you don't believe? Is there no end to your blindness and nonsense? I ask you again, how about a bible study?

Posted on Jun 21, 2012 12:15:09 PM PDT
Brian says:
Kiwani and Richard if a parent spanks (nothing more) as a form of discipline and is told by someone like you to stop, would you support a process for taking the child away if the parent refuses to cooperate and take them away from the alleged danger?
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