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Our Socialist trend.....


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In reply to an earlier post on Feb 28, 2012 2:23:40 PM PST
M. Daniel says:
kbw says: "He is right about that. Che shirts too."

That was my post. He said those who show the Confederate symbol represent slavery and hatred. I said that for many young people it is more of a fashion item and they don't know the first thing about Southern heritage or the Civil War.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 28, 2012 1:54:01 PM PST
Last edited by the author on Feb 28, 2012 1:56:09 PM PST
M. Daniel says:visionary says: "Can you interpret that line for me?" Young people have very little understanding of history. Many of those with Confederate symbols do not know what it is. I am around young people every day and they wear peace symbols, Confederate symbols, and Malcolm X t-shirts and have no clue about what any of these things mean.

=================

i didn't read Vis' post to you. He is right about that. Che shirts too.

this statement of his i disagree with. visionary says: "Freedom of a specific expression does not exist in a civil society when that expression harms others."

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 28, 2012 8:52:03 AM PST
M. Daniel says:
visionary says: "What makes you think I don't understand those around me? What would your criteria be to think I do? Not according to intelligent, educated people I have befriended and become intimate with."

Because of your statement about the Confederate symbol (for which I have no strong feelings about one way or the other). The problem is that those educated people have no understanding of the working class whites they are mocking. They see the symbol as representing slavery and you accept their view, not the views of those displaying it.

visionary says: "Can you interpret that line for me?" Young people have very little understanding of history. Many of those with Confederate symbols do not know what it is. I am around young people every day and they wear peace symbols, Confederate symbols, and Malcolm X t-shirts and have no clue about what any of these things mean.

visionary says: "Freedom of a specific expression does not exist in a civil society when that expression harms others."

The very essence of fascism. Free expression never harms others (it may offend them, anger them, or hurt their feelings). When we begin to prohibit freedom of expression because of someone's definition of "harm" we have destroyed free expression and a civil society including this forum. The free exchange of ideas

To suppress free speech is a double wrong. It violates the rights of the hearer as well as those of the speaker.
Frederick Douglass

To suppress free speech is a double wrong. It violates the rights of the hearer as well as those of the speaker.

If we don't believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don't believe in it at all~~Noam Chomsky

At no time is freedom of speech more precious than when a man hits his thumb with a hammer.

I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.~~Voltaire

If the freedom of speech is taken away then dumb and silent we may be led, like sheep to the slaughter.~~George Washington

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 28, 2012 8:35:49 AM PST
Now. I was referring to the superior types elected by their inferiors to operate the levers of industry not the levers of government. Get it yet?

=========================

only industry huh?

is that to mean that you don't care if the workers of a particular company became wealthier than those at other companies or the populace at large? What happens when they become the wealthy class?

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 28, 2012 8:03:15 AM PST
visionary says:
daniel [[Those of your ilk are completely lacking in the understanding of the culture around you.]]

What makes you think I don't understand those around me? What would your criteria be to think I do?

[[the symbol is also seen as representing the South and its traditions with no regard to slavery.]]

Not according to intelligent, educated people I have befriended and become intimate with.

[[so stupid they don't know what the Civil War was meaning the symbol has no connection to slavery.]]

Can you interpret that line for me?

[[It is typical of the political correct attitude of forcing tolerance onto others at the expense of freedom of expression. ]]

Freedom of a specific expression does not exist in a civil society when that expression harms others.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 28, 2012 7:26:45 AM PST
M. Daniel says:
J. jones says: "arbitrary breaking up of families ( which explains the issues with today's black family),"

I am not sure if the evils of slavery and segregation can be blamed on the troubles with the black family today. The black family was very strong in the 1920s-1950s. The white family has experienced those same problems without those factors being present. I expect the same societal changes are responsible for both the black and white family problems.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 28, 2012 7:21:21 AM PST
M. Daniel says:
visionary says: "realizing the confederate flag is an omen of slavery and stupidity is probably beyond your ken. The confederate flag is flown in front of houses all over this state as a symbol of hatred towards black Americans and hatred towards the northerners who took away their slaves."

Those of your ilk are completely lacking in the understanding of the culture around you. No doubt many of those displaying the flag are racists; however, the symbol is also seen as representing the South and its traditions with no regard to slavery. Some of the people are no doubt stupid; so stupid they don't know what the Civil War was meaning the symbol has no connection to slavery. Many of these people have no political thoughts in their head.

Some people want to make everything political onto which they transfer their hostilities rooted in personality issues. Many of those people would deny others the freedom of speech to display such symbols (even if it is to symbolize racial hatred). It is typical of the political correct attitude of forcing tolerance onto others at the expense of freedom of expression.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 27, 2012 8:29:18 PM PST
J. jones says:
M. Daniel
I don't need lessons in technicality. It is commonly referred to as the Confederate Flag.The dictionary, history books, and encyclopedias call it that. That's what I will call it. I didn't say anything about abolishing anything. I am perfectly aware that many southerners don't look at it that way. For them, it represents a way of life, a symbol of a culture that they don't want defined by race and slavery alone.

Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion. As for NASCAR, yes I do watch it. I also never said anything about a symbol on top of a car enslaving me. Are you putting words in my mouth, M. Daniel?
It is noteworthy that you mentioned enslavement. That was on point. That is what the flag reminds me of--enslavement. The flag represented the gallant efforts of millions of misguided souls to keep black folks as animals and the property of whites, forever. The Confederate Flag is the remembrance of that primitive and peculiar institution. It is one of the few haunting survivors of the most horrifying of times in the lives of people anywhere in human history. A reminder of lynching, castration, rape, breeding, decapitation, mutilation, humiliation, deprivation, whimsical and arbitrary breaking up of families ( which explains the issues with today's black family), and a host of other stubbornly persistent dysfunctions still plaguing the black race today.
God curse the Confederate Flag.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 27, 2012 7:15:07 PM PST
visionary says:
kbw, Don't you realize that Reagan and Bush were stupid but the ones who elected them stupider yet. That goes along with what I wrote.

Now. I was referring to the superior types elected by their inferiors to operate the levers of industry not the levers of government. Get it yet?

Again - In a factory, the lesser brained will elect the brained to be the managers and supervisors because they know their own limitations and the limitations of their cohorts. Since they want their factory to continue, they elect the better people.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 27, 2012 7:06:07 PM PST
visionary says:
daniel , As I said, realizing the confederate flag is an omen of slavery and stupidity is probably beyond your ken.

The confederate flag is flown in front of houses all over this state as a symbol of hatred towards black Americans and hatred towards the northerners who took away their slaves.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 27, 2012 8:41:57 AM PST
visionary says:
kbw [[kind of goes against the argument you have been making where you used FDR and JFK as an example.]]

What does that mean? Can you explain yourself?

====================

you said
visionary says: "The fools would not control because the intelligent, educated ones would control. The fools, most knowing they are fools, elect those they know to be superior, mentally, to operate the levers of industry."

then, in reply to by post about Reagan and bush. You said.

visionary says: "I was disgusted with the Americans who elected both the dopes."

Your second statement proves your first statement to be incorrect, or at least not an assured conclusion. The conclusion in your first statement is hardly assured.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 27, 2012 8:12:30 AM PST
M. Daniel says:
J. jones says: "Personally, the Confederate flag offends me"

Actually, it is not the Confederate flag. However, I understand how you feel. Unfortunately, or fortunately, we cannot abolish everything that offends us. Do you watch NASCAR? If not, it has not actually offended you--only the idea. I hardly think a symbol on top of a car is enslaving you. By the way, I am not a fan of NASCAR and have no strong feelings about Confederate symbols.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 27, 2012 7:46:16 AM PST
J. jones says:
visionary says: "Realizing the confederate flag is an omen of slavery and stupidity is probably beyond your ken."

Personally, the Confederate flag offends me. I am opposed to seeing it anywhere. It represents the suffering of my forbears, and the great effort to keep them and me enslaved forever.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 27, 2012 7:07:37 AM PST
M. Daniel says:
visionary says: "Realizing the confederate flag is an omen of slavery and stupidity is probably beyond your ken."

It has nothing to do with sensitivity. It has to do with a person's political views creating such hostility about such innocuous things that it makes ordinary life a pain for others. Do you think people don't remember we had slavery? Should we not study it in school because the subject would offend someone's sensitivity? In New Orleans you can visit the old slave auction site. Should that be closed down?

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 27, 2012 6:08:35 AM PST
visionary says:
worky [[uphold the Supreme law of our land. ]]

By whose interpretation?

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 27, 2012 6:06:25 AM PST
visionary says:
daniel [[If it agonizes a person to see a confederate battle slogan (or anything else) he needs some counseling. Get over it. There is probably a deeper psychological problem the person is experiencing ]]

Your inability to empathize is not surprising. Your rearing under either cruel or ignoring parents made you that way.

Realizing the confederate flag is an omen of slavery and stupidity is probably beyond your ken.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 27, 2012 6:02:43 AM PST
visionary says:
kbw [[kink of goes against the argument you have been making where you used FDR and JFK as an example.]]

What does that mean? Can you explain yourself?

Posted on Feb 26, 2012 8:44:51 PM PST
Most socialist types base their assumptions on the idea that people are making optimal choices but yet just can't make it. They are doing the best that they can given the system and its constraints. That is a flawed assumption. Not everyone makes the optimal choice. there is nothing wrong with that. It simply tells us we are all imperfect. Therefore rewarding us with when we make good, if not optimal, choices. Why should we demean these people by saying that they should pin their economic success on those who are far removed from them. Political decisions take time to filter down to the lowest economic levels. Why not give those on the bottom rung, the ability to shape their own lives with their own choices? I find it incredibly rewarding that I rose up out of the trailer park. I could have said that the system made my situation what it was and demanded that it change for my benefit. No one knows better how to make my life better than me so why not give me optimal opportunity to do so?

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 26, 2012 6:27:24 PM PST
MD: "I don't think most money from infrastructure comes from consumer spending."

We want to increase consumer spending by giving jobs to people working on our delapidated infrastructure.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 26, 2012 5:58:35 PM PST
Workicrat says:
<"Just not the ones I have seen around here">

Name ONE...Simply name ONE from "around here" who DON'T favor greater freedom and LESSER -not NO - government.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 26, 2012 5:55:41 PM PST
Workicrat says:
Name ONE libertarian who does NOT believe in the United States Constitution.

By DEFINITION the U.S.Constitution legalizes FORCE,you clueless,Marxist-adoring dolt.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 26, 2012 5:54:35 PM PST
Workicrat says:
No,you clueless dolt....READ what was STATED...."self defense" !!!

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 26, 2012 5:53:36 PM PST
Workicrat says:
<"This is the most heartless, immoral post I have ever seen anyone have the gall to post.">

As opposed to Dem thugs such as yourself who believe that a human being should be imprisoned for NOT contributing to government "charity" programs !

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 26, 2012 5:52:36 PM PST
Workicrat says:
"factory workers, our policemen, our firemen, our teachers" are NOT the "have-nots" you clueless,Marxist-adoring dolt...

The recipients of government "charity" programs are the ones do ZERO of the work.

And no,you clueless,Marxist-adoring dolt, one who receives government monies - in exchange for PROVIDING a service to the citizenry - is NOT a recipient of government "charity".

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 26, 2012 5:48:34 PM PST
M. Daniel says:
Kathleen M. Pelley says: "the middle class doesn't have enough spare $$$ to spend so the economic idea is to get more money flowing in the economy by spending it on various infrastructure projects,"

The 2% payroll tax deduction gives a middle class person $1,000 extra to spend and an upper income person $2,000 to spend. Plus, the EITC and child tax credit gives millions of workers up to $5,000 cash and the child care tax credit another $1,000 or more. That is a lot of stimulus. However, I don't think most money from infrastructure comes from consumer spending.
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Discussion in:  Politics forum
Participants:  43
Total posts:  1165
Initial post:  Feb 9, 2012
Latest post:  Feb 28, 2012

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