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The Global Warming Wackos say, "Oops!"

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Posted on Apr 22, 2012 5:01:16 AM PDT
Truthseeker says:
Anyone want a break from all of this serious discussion and constant mudslinging?

Join my thread
http://www.amazon.com/forum/politics/ref=cm_cd_rvt_np?_encoding=UTF8&cdForum=Fx1S3QSZRUL93V8&cdPage=6&cdThread=Tx3FEI0K1G18PAI#CustomerDiscussionsNew

and free your mind like you were when you were an infant :)

Posted on Apr 22, 2012 5:02:47 AM PDT
Truthseeker says:
BTW: Google got hacked by fanatic environmentalists!!!!
Don't believe me? Go to www.google.com

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 6:37:36 AM PDT
I read through Fraser Cain's paper and must state that he was NOT into this global warming nonsense of CO2 as a major force.
His article on Earth's Magnetic Field greatly points to other causes inducing any warming. We all agree that the earth's temperatures fluctuate. That is not the issue here.

TS: Where is his paper. I have asked for a link (which also meant a working link) 3Xs now, if you have one.

RV: I just attempted to pull up Professor M. Ragheb's article. Ragheb's website has now been restricted to his students only, requiring a special student ID code to access his lectures and exams. That is a shame, for he is most informative, but perhaps he needs to secure his exam sites.

TS: And you don't see this as a sign something is wrong?

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 6:55:25 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 22, 2012 8:00:17 AM PDT
Truthseeker NTPW,
You write: "TS: The Founding Fathers were pro-abolitionists because they followed a liberal movement called the Enlightenment that taught all men were created equal. It was the conservatives, especially in the South who despised the Enlightenment and also fought hard for the institution of slavery."

RV: What was conservative during the American Revolution would have been a Tory, siding with the feudalistic status quo.

Today's Conservatives would have been yesterdays "liberals." Today's Liberals who champion socialism and big government have nothing in common with our Founding Fathers' designs on limiting the power of government, having just fought a revolution to break free of dictatorship.

TS: Actually this is the first time I agree with some of what you re: what are the historical facts:
Now regarding whether power should be centralized at the federal gov't or decentralized: There was a battle within the Founding Fathers -- Jefferson vs Adams and even Washington.

But I suspect you are talking about social benefits. You are talking before and after the Industrial Revolution:

The US was a poor agrarian country at first -- where land was plentiful and most could work on the land to find food. Life expectancy was 37 (moving to 41 in the mid 1800s) Childhood mortality was extremely high.

So the poor could usually find a plot of land to farm; sure there was starvation too.
After the Industrial Revolution and large population growth into the cities, this dynamic changed.
Especially with the advances of science which now greatly raised life expectancy so there was no a large class of seniors.

So let me sure you really agree with the details of what you are espousing.

--In your world view, there should be no social security, Medicare or unemployement (and no welfare including for old age homes). That is purely socialism. [And I agree here this is socialism].

-- Defense should shrink way back. Afterall the Founding Fathers never envisioned the size and scope of the military industrial complex.

--Going back to Dicken's view of England (paralleling what you want) Scrooge should be considered the typical good employer. Employees can be paid whatever the market will bear, even if it means they have no money for any decent housing, food, schooling, and medicine.

The good old days? There are too many people to go back to farming; not to mention large agricultural businesses have taking over much of the industry today.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 7:22:23 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 22, 2012 7:28:48 AM PDT
Truthseeker says:
RV: "Today's Conservatives would have been yesterdays "liberals." Today's Liberals who champion socialism and big government have nothing in common with our Founding Fathers' designs on limiting the power of government, having just fought a revolution to break free of dictatorship. I think the southern plantation lifestyle very closely reflected that of feudal Europe and Mexico, the farthest thing from contemporary Conservatives who base their beliefs on the Constitution, Bill of Rights, and Declaration of Independence."

Rachel, I couldn't agree more. One just has to look across the Pacific to "Communist China", where there is no social security, no unemployment benefits, no free national healthcare for all, very few handouts. Although they have a long way to go in terms of political freedom, on the economic front, China's got it nailed. No dependency culture = booming / over 8% growth, while America and parts of Europe drown in mountains of socialist debt.

People are at their most creative, at their best, at their most productive, at their most enterpreunerial when they know that they cannot depend on a government handout to bail them out. That applies as much to the crony capitalists on Wall Street who have no business to still be in business, as it does to the "poor" citizen on Main Street who gets fat on food stamps. The past few years (including the last year of the Bush administration) have been dependency handouts go wild. NO MORE BAILOUTS!!!! No bailouts of citizens. No bailouts of companies that made wrong or over-greedy decisions. Let the market be free. Let every American be free. Freedom comes with benefits as well as responsibilities.

Posted on Apr 22, 2012 7:44:23 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 22, 2012 7:45:46 AM PDT
Truthseeker says:
Here's another suggestion I made a while back but it got laughed off as usual by socialist liberals.

Washington is broken. Washington is corrupt. The Federal Government is corrupt beyond imagination. The Federal Government is mainly theft of people's hard-earned money through taxation.

How do we fix this? Well our system of government has to be revamped completely.

Below is a proposal. Think it's radical and crazy? Well there is a certain country in Europe which has such a system implemented and it is not only one of the richest / lowest-debt countries in the world, but many of their people appreciate paying taxes because the people see their money coming back to benefit locally, not on some country-wide pork waste.

1) Limit Federal Government to Defense, Foreign Policy and Currency only. Perhaps keep a few other government agencies like the FBI and DEA.
2) Get rid of the IRS, get rid of the Federal Government's right to tax -> No more federal taxes
3) Get rid of all other government bureaucracies - Education, Justice, Labor, Agriculture, Transportation - all wastes
4) Convert the Transportation-related government agencies into neutral private organizations, funded by the transport companies in equal amount be it airlines, Amtrak, etc. That will keep'em honest instead of turning into centers of waste. Do the same with the FCC
5) Get rid of the Federal Congress, get rid of the Federal President - we can't afford them anymore. Instead the States would vote on and nominate a rotating Federal Secretary General doing their collective bidding.
5) Hold a convention with representatives from all states to agree on the limited federal government role and the rules to fund that.
6) Enshrine this into the Constitution, so that any expansion of the federal government's role will require a Constitutional Amendment.

Of course, this will not happen anytime soon - the liberal socialists will first have to run us into complete bankruptcy and impoverishment. Maybe then.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 7:57:48 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 22, 2012 8:01:18 AM PDT
TeaPartywoman: Washington is broken. Washington is corrupt. The Federal Government is corrupt beyond imagination. The Federal Government is mainly theft of people's hard-earned money through taxation.

TS: Which is why this same "lovely" TeapartyWoman (her original name here) started this thread on the Political forum encouraging the violent overthrow of the US gov't throught the OCCUPY movement:

<<Occupy Wall Street

OWS, do something useful for a change!
Initial post: Nov 5, 2011 6:59:39 AM PDT
Amazon Politics Forum

http://www.amazon.com/forum/politics/ref=cm_cd_et_md_pl?_encoding=UTF8&cdForum=Fx1S3QSZRUL93V8&cdMsgNo=1&cdPage=1&cdSort=oldest&cdThread=Tx3ISWK2SYFN58F&cdMsgID=Mx2M36G2RWKO5KM#Mx2M36G2RWKO5KM

OWS, you are making Americans look like chickens, compared to the brave demonstrators in Egypt, Tunisia, Libya and Syria.

Why don't you start marching on the Wall Street Banks and the homes of the top 1%, climb the walls, go inside, ransack the thieves, ransack the tax dodgers?

What are you afraid of? That you will get shot? Well, so be it. Any credible movement needs martyrs - lots of them, otherwise they peter out. In Syria, over 120 martyrs this weekend alone - bodies dumped unceremoniously at the hospital.

C'mon, get acting, before you become a complete joke!>>

==========================

It's easy to verify. Ignore the Truthseeker on that post, then come back here and the same "Truthseeker" will also be ignored.

Or to poke around where I stated this was completely opposite to my views.

Posted on Apr 22, 2012 9:23:01 AM PDT
Truthseeker says:
Of course, socialist liberals will be decrying me for promoting violence, whereas peaceful popular revolution has happened in countries like Egypt you know!!

The system is far too corrupt to be able to change from within. After all, why should people (of both parties) who are stealing trillions of dollars of hard-earned money of Americans and then misusing that for waste, paying off cronies and special interests, paying out handouts to people to create a dependency culture of vote buying with other people's money, weilding unimaginable power with the money stolen from the people, why should they change a system that benefits them so well?

It's like asking a thief who has immunity from the law to reform himself/herself and stop stealing. Why should the thief reform?

I never had faith in the soft liberal Occupy Movement. They didn't have the tenacity or the moral conviction to change this rotten government, so they fizzled out after a little bit of teargassing and beating. What a shameful picture of weakness to thousands of Syrians dying to fight for their freedom and to unseat a corrupt government.

The Tea Party did better in 2010 to clip Obama's wings, to dampen his spirit for the wild socialist nightmares he was planning, but they did not go far enough, and keep up their popular protest long enough. Now they're slowly fizzling too.

So, no matter what the politicians say about fixing Washington, they won't. Why should thieves change the rules so that they can steal less? It goes against human nature. The only way Washington is going to be fixed is by peaceful mass uprising. Only when the politicians sense that they have something to lose, will they start displaying flexibility to fix this broken federal system. I am afraid that such public realization and action will not happen until the country goes completely bankrupt.

After all politicians have been talking about changing Washington for decades and nothing really changed. In the meantime the debt burden of this once fiscally sound country jumped from nothing to over 100% of GDP and will be approaching 150% by 2016.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 9:37:25 AM PDT
Agree that volcanic eruptions can have major effects on global climate but not by their release of heat; it's the release of volcanic gases and particulate matter that cause the effects. Some gases like sulfur dioxide cause cooling as does particulate matter; other gases like CO2 cause warming.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 9:39:26 AM PDT
I don't think there's nearly as much difference between Obama and Romney as either pretends. I don't see the election of Romney causing much of a change, especially if Obamacare has already been declared unconstitutional.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 11:23:29 AM PDT
Truthseeker says:
Right. It's funny that we agree and zero-science TSNTP strongly disagrees that volcanoes can produce CO2 / warming :)

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 11:28:36 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 22, 2012 11:33:29 AM PDT
Truthseeker says:
You are right. Romney won't fix Washington, just as Obama was singing full of hope and change in 2008 to fix Washington and did not. It is neither in their interest, nor in the interest of the corrupt Senators, nor in the interest of the corrupt Congressmen and women making a mockery out of the meaning of "representative" government, neither in the interest of the corrupt political parties.

There's only one way to change the corruption in Washington which is bleeding the country dry to bankruptcy - popular revolution - Egypt or Syria style. There's only one difference between those countries and us. There, the people stood up to a thieving government and threw them out. In this country, our people still put up with a government significantly more corrupt, stealing our money for decades.

Posted on Apr 22, 2012 11:41:22 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 22, 2012 11:46:48 AM PDT
Truthseeker says:
TSNTP and TH were cherrypicking the early cherry blossom in Washington, D.C.
Well, guess what, CHERRYPICKING IS OVER!

A huge snowstorm is about to hit the EAST Coast - hey look at your calendar - it is END OF APRIL!!!!

So much for early spring nonsense.
Guess what, Mother Nature has a cool way to teach weather cherry pickers a lesson for lying that early warm weather is a sign of AGW, by simply sending a SNOWSTORM to SPOIL the CHERRIES. Hope you've picked and eaten them already :)

Here in Europe, it's end-April, and all April it's been WINTER! IT SNOWED DURING EASTER!!!!
Lots of fresh snow in the Alps - normally the ski stations close by now but not this year. I am just on a train back from the Alps after a weekend of fun skiing so late in the season.

And I heard on CNN that a mixture of cold air and dust is causing havoc in China.

So much for AGW prediction of early spring BITES the dust yet again this year.

IT IS APRIL 22ND!!!!

Posted on Apr 22, 2012 11:45:57 AM PDT
Truthseeker says:
Of course TSNTP and TH will wait for the next heat wave when they will again cry AGW wolf - the delusional dishonesty never stops.

Posted on Apr 22, 2012 12:03:51 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 22, 2012 12:09:43 PM PDT
Truthseeker says:
A great little science exchange I had with Arpad on another thread. Arghh, AF, you have given me more work to do for my book :(

AF: "I see you still don't comprehend something as simple as an equilibrium condition, and the effects on it caused by small changes in sources and sinks"

TS: the equilibrium condition is a myth, just like AGWers like to spread the myth that the climate of the Earth is naturally calm and stable. Anyone who has studied the natural history of the Earth knows that there is nothing but equilibrium and stability on this planet. That is the reason why there's life on this planet because it is ACTIVE! Things change all the time turning day into night.

You want stabililty and equilibrium? Look at the dead planet of Mars.

And let us do a little bit of math maybe.

CO2 concentration in 1880 = 290 ppm roughly
CO2 concentration in 2008 = 390 ppm roughly

% change = 34.5% roughly.

Now let us suppose the worst case that humans had pumped 6 billion tons of CO2 into the atmosphere every year since 1880 (less of course) and none of it got absorbed (not true of course).

So that would be a total of 128*6 = 768 billion tons that wouldn't be absorbed, right?
Out of a total emissions of 128* 186 = 23808 billion tons.

% of anthropogenic = 768 / 23808 = 3.2%.

So assuming natural equilibrium, the atmospheric concentration should have gone up by a maximum of 3.2% (and this is worst case because we all know that (i) human CO2 emissions have gone up as the century progressed - we didn't emit 6 billion tons in 1880 or even 1940 - much less and (ii) some of the human CO2 is also absorbed by the sinks).

So again a mathematical failure.

A great addition to my book.

NEXT? Or perhaps you'd like to entertain me with a mathematical explanation which would explain the above paradox in AGW junkscience?

Posted on Apr 22, 2012 12:14:30 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 22, 2012 12:16:25 PM PDT
Treehugger© says:
395-280=115

(115/280)X100=41.07%

March 2012: 394.45 ppm
March 2011: 392.40 ppm

Recent indirect data and direct measurements from ice cores point towards a `pre-industrial' CO2 level of around 260-270 ppmv, considerably below the commonly assumed value of 290 ppmv. Early measurements from the southern hemisphere tend to favour the lower value.

http://www.springerlink.com/content/a06440223792h163/
:)

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 12:22:58 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 22, 2012 12:28:08 PM PDT
Truthseeker says:
So how do you explain that at the worst case human CO2 emissions of 6 billion tons a year since 1880 is just a 3.2% noise above natural levels. And I am really exagerrating the human impact here, i.e. assuming humans have been pumping 6 billion tons of CO2 into the atmosphere since 1880 and none of it got absorbed by natural sinks?

So how do you explain that atmospheric CO2 concentration went up by 41.07% which you correctly calculated?

Posted on Apr 22, 2012 12:31:44 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 22, 2012 12:44:00 PM PDT
Truthseeker says:
Hey Arpad, where art thou?

My fast train whizzing across the European countryside at between 200 and 300 miles per hour will reach my destination in under a half hour.
I know Americans aren't used to such first world modes of land transport, even less used to high-speed internet access on trains, but time is of the essence for a reply / rebuttal :)

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 1:01:22 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 22, 2012 1:46:53 PM PDT
TruthSeeker,
There is something about this other TSNTPW, playing around with word games, misinterpreting references, and redefining words as to render entire intent of language a useless tool for communication, - he does it just to test my patience which really irks me to no end - and he knows it. It's like having a fly buzzing around that really needs to be swatted down.

Anyways, this author on "earth's magnetic field and how it reverses" cites that "how earth's magnetic field controls the internal heat of the earth so that switching [reversal of its poles] can occur is unknown." Others have written that the force of the solar wind can open up an enormous hole in our earth's magnetic field allowing cosmic rays to agitate the inner earth's electrons. so the next question would naturally follow, what is agitating the forces of the solar wind? Gravitational forces or "Dark Matter and Dark Energy" from the Milky Way? Why did the Swiss build that CERN accelerator in the first place if not to search for Dark Matter? Something is up.

Thanks for the websites, well worth looking into :)

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 1:12:13 PM PDT
TruthSeker,
Hurray for the Danish. Fascinating research on these Galactic cosmic rays penetrating our earth's atmosphere. They speak of changes in the earth's magnetic field occurring independently of earth's climate, then what is orchestrating the changes in our magnetic field? Is there a conspiracy of silence about this Dark Matter and its gravitational pull upon our sun in the galaxy? Or is there something to the Ancients' Astrology and the alignment of the planets affecting gravitational pull upon the sun and shaping its solar wind?

You write: "PS: I let you continue arguing with TSNTP who I am sure will say all this is not science, only his CO2 infested non-brain is science. I have the fanatic on ignore."
Good. That will serve the presumptuous little put-on right.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 1:34:45 PM PDT
TruthSeeker,
You write: "One just has to look across the Pacific to "Communist China", where there is no social security, no unemployment benefits, no free national healthcare for all, very few handouts. Although they have a long way to go in terms of political freedom, on the economic front, China's got it nailed. No dependency culture = booming / over 8% growth, while America and parts of Europe drown in mountains of socialist debt... People are at their most creative, at their best, at their most productive, at their most entrepreneurial when they know that they cannot depend on government handout to bail them out."

I would agree with you that America is sliding down the slippery slope of socialism, BUT must disagree with you on the economic picture of China. America need only to privatize the two biggest Entitlement programs, SS and Medicare, and offer welfare to the truly needy to reverse our economic decline. There is no need to put an entire nation of entitlement welfare.

That 8% growth rate you cite is an illusion, for Communist China has only allowed for the growth of Big Business to manufacture and trade with America and Europe, while stifling small business at home to raise the standard of living build a strong middle class. That 8% growth rate pertains to China's military expansion, not enriching its citizens.

America, in its optimistic generosity in trade and technology, has been once again, aiding and abetting the enemy. Just take a look at that 3,000 mile tunnel system carved out by the the Red Army to deliver 1,000 nuclear warheads to the PRC's bordering nations. This has been picked up by our satellites. You tell me President Obama and Secretary of State Hillary Clinton is unaware of all of this?

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 1:37:02 PM PDT
TruthSeeker,
I think you stole Rick Perry's political platform.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 1:38:19 PM PDT
TruthSeeker,
No violence needed. Be thankful we can vote the bums out.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 1:43:01 PM PDT
TruthSeeker,
You write: "There's only one way to change the corruption in Washington which is bleeding the country dry to bankruptcy..."

Just give us ladies our cars and our credit cards and we will lead the charge and jump-start the economy. Men go to war and women go shopping. That would work miracles in the Middle East. This is what men fear the most.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 22, 2012 2:30:06 PM PDT
Treehugger© says:
Along with collapsing fisheries, signs of malignant impact on the regional ecosystem are ominous: horribly mutated shrimp, fish with oozing sores, underdeveloped blue crabs lacking claws, eyeless crabs and shrimp - and interviewees' fingers point towards BP's oil pollution disaster as being the cause.
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