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three more calif cities bankrupt. scranton pa puts all workers on min wage when voters reject 78% real estate tax increase.


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Initial post: Jul 11, 2012 3:07:53 PM PDT
the dems never get the message
you cant keep spending like drunken sailors

Posted on Jul 11, 2012 6:45:29 PM PDT
Katrina says:
OMG!

Another crybaby!

Stop coming around here crying that you're broke and looking for a hand-out.

Go Bankrupt! Deal With It!!!

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 11, 2012 7:07:37 PM PDT
And,

Let me make sure I'm understanding you. The Democrat, the mayor, or scranton pa put the workers on minimum wages and the dems never get the message that they can't keep spending?

I see a democrat cutting what he had the power to do when the people said no new taxes fix the budget instead. What you don't like his choice? Do you know that there was something else to cut?

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 11, 2012 9:15:07 PM PDT
all the mayors should stop the outrageous worker payments and incredible benefits, and stop taxing citizens who cant afford this anymore

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 11, 2012 9:16:55 PM PDT
And,

So you agree with the mayor?

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 11, 2012 9:24:03 PM PDT
it was a good start

now cut their bennies
its the unfunded pensions killing cities

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 11, 2012 9:35:10 PM PDT
And,

I doubt that you'd feel the same about your pensions. And I believe you would find that pensions must be registered with the feds and are picked up by them when pension plans fail. Not sure that is true with state pensions though.

Please don't mistake me for arguing that these pensions aren't outrageous, so I'd agree to reduce them but not erase them. That said, there still has to be a way for the pensioner to plan. If you are already dependent upon your pension as your only income that can be a problem.

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 11, 2012 9:44:49 PM PDT
true

but if the state/biz has no money to pay them
they are not going to get them

all should be required to fully fund all pensions up front
not invest it at phony expected interest rates
and then spend it anyway

best to put all pensions on a defined contribution basis like 401k
everybody saves their own money and if the state/biz also kicks in then they are that much better off

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 11, 2012 9:59:32 PM PDT
and,

right now the feds would pick up the pension. The best you can do is some of the conversion that are already in the law -- sort of what IBM did and were hated for. They did do it gradually as that was what the federal laws required.

I have a small pension and a 401K. My employer converted mine to an annuity when I retired. I didn't have a choice but it is then out of their "care". Mine has no inflation clause as do all of the federal retirements.

Legal contracts are tougher which is why a business can go bankrupt and a CEO still get a golden parachute.

Basically the cuts are necessary and tough --- and they need to happen to all of us.

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 11, 2012 9:59:44 PM PDT
K Moody says:
Pensions remind me of social security...both good ideas that ultimately turned into ponzi schemes.

Posted on Jul 12, 2012 5:49:21 AM PDT
C. Batty says:
Every single city worker in Scranton should stop showing up to work. Let them figure out how to do for themselves until they can decide to pay for a service they want.

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 12, 2012 6:10:36 AM PDT
andhorse says: "best to put all pensions on a defined contribution basis like 401k"

That was the Bush plan.

It works great until you have an idiot like Bush tank the stock market and cut people's life savings in half - or worse.

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 12, 2012 7:40:57 AM PDT
CB,
That would be great. Then the city can find out how many of those civil servants they DON'T need. I'm sure that in the current job market there would be no problem finding employees toi do necessary jobs at real market rates for pay and benefits. Things might be a little chaotic until the new employees learn the new jobs, but most public employees don't have unique skills.

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 12, 2012 7:49:34 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jul 12, 2012 7:50:20 AM PDT
C. Batty says:
Real market rates are what they were paying. But I am sure people can take care of their own trash, sewage and water for a while. And no one NEEDS to get married.

PS: You can hire scabs to break a strike, but you have to fire them when the strike ends.

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 12, 2012 7:56:34 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jul 12, 2012 7:59:00 AM PDT
Market rates are what it would cost to replace them, not what they are getting paid. They aren't facing competition for their jobs now. Market rates are set by the MARKET, not union contracts negotiated by politicians who are in the Public Employee Union's pockets.

Not if the previous employees abandon their jobs. All the city has to do is get an injunction which is easy and fast for necessary services and the employees either have to return, or their jobs are toast. You weren't talking about a sanctioned strike, you were talking about all employees just walking away from their jobs. PATCO tried that and it didn't work out for them did it?

Posted on Jul 12, 2012 8:21:14 AM PDT
Mitt must announce that there will be no bailouts of these cities when he is elected. These liberal cities drove themselves into bankruptcy. The city unions can all go to hell. Not a penny of federal dollars should be used to restore wages or pensions of these cities.

Posted on Jul 12, 2012 8:26:59 AM PDT
You know, one thing I've learned is that you've got to be very leary when people start throwing around percentages instead of actual numbers. For example, if something costs 2 cents and you raise it to 3 cents, that's a 50% increase. It sounds so much worse to say 50% increase then to say the price went up by a penny. Having looked at Scranton's Tax website, the current effective city tax is .221568 per hundred valuation. In this tiny town I live in in NC it's .265 per hundred and we have one of the lowest tax rates in the state. Raising the tax rate by 78% would bring it up to .394391 cents per hundred. Now, I've lived up east and still have friends there and I'm telling you that's incredibly low for that part of the country. What it looks like to me, is that the city has put off raising taxes to a reasonable rate for many years because their council members were too chicken to do what had to be done and now they're facing a big increase all at once to get things back in balance. And yes, the residents will moan and groan and might not elect you next time. But municipalities have bills to pay just like you do and when your electric bill goes up, so does the city's; when you pay more for gas, so does the city.

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 12, 2012 8:27:27 AM PDT
There's good news and bad news.

The bad news: we want to impose a 78% property tax increase.

The good news: your property is worth so little, that only amounts to pennies per year.

P.S. I don't understand why Scranton doesn't figure out a way to harness the energy from those unextinguishable abandoned coal mine fires that dot the landscape. Could be a good source of income.

:)

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 12, 2012 8:28:10 AM PDT
Help me please! My only options are to make minimum wage, get another job, or move almost anywhere else in the country!

Help!

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 12, 2012 8:47:16 AM PDT
C. Batty says:
But what potential worker wouldn't be smart enough to let the trash and sewage sit for a few weeks to jack up the price?

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 12, 2012 8:51:39 AM PDT
i hope the feds dont try to pick up all the pensions of bankrupt states counties and cities. us govt is already bankrupt. that would only speed up the eventual collapse of teh whole world economy.

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 12, 2012 8:52:58 AM PDT
depends how they are done

when they started the money was put away for them
then they played games
and started 'borrowing' it for more urgent needs

but pensions tht the person owns in their own account
and the govt/biz can add to when they have money to do so
works quite well

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 12, 2012 8:53:43 AM PDT
i wish i wish

it would be so great to get rid of all those parsites

there are plenty of folks who are more qualified tht would be willing to work for min wage

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 12, 2012 8:54:39 AM PDT
only if you are dumb enough to put your money into stocks

all stocks are a losing bet
only winners are the brokers
they always get their vig
dont care if the market is up or down

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 12, 2012 8:56:29 AM PDT
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This discussion

Discussion in:  Politics forum
Participants:  24
Total posts:  453
Initial post:  Jul 11, 2012
Latest post:  Jul 19, 2012

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