Automotive Deals HPCC Amazon Fashion Learn more Discover it $5 Albums Fire TV Stick Handmade school supplies Shop-by-Room Amazon Cash Back Offer CafeSociety CafeSociety CafeSociety  Amazon Echo  Echo Dot  Amazon Tap  Echo Dot  Amazon Tap  Amazon Echo Starting at $49.99 All-New Kindle Oasis AutoRip in CDs & Vinyl Water Sports
Customer Discussions > Religion forum

Why?


Sort: Oldest first | Newest first
Showing 1-25 of 64 posts in this discussion
Initial post: Mar 16, 2013 4:15:45 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Mar 16, 2013 5:05:02 PM PDT
Mark Hubbell says:
CNN has a story today about an underground Christian church in China. (http://www.cnn.com/video/?/video/world/2013/03/12/mckenzie-china-defiant-priest.cnn#/video/world/2013/03/12/mckenzie-china-defiant-priest.cnn).

In a country that outlawed and persecuted religion, why does Christianity endure? More than enduring, it returns with great passion! The same has happened in the former Soviet Union and other atheist nations. Christianity thrives under persecution.

What makes the Church so resilient?

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 16, 2013 4:37:15 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Mar 17, 2013 9:54:21 PM PDT
Joe W says:
Mark: In a country that outlawed religion, why does Christianity endure?

Joe: For the same reason that Christmas, Judaism, Islam, paganism, animism, and non-beliefs have endured in the places where Christians have outlawed them. Outlawing things doesn't make them go away. That is not a particularly remarkable attribute.

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 16, 2013 5:33:43 PM PDT
Bubba says:
For much the same reasons that even though street drugs are illegal, there is a thriving market for them, and for the same reasons that huge amounts of liquor was sold in the US during Prohibition.

Posted on Mar 16, 2013 5:35:44 PM PDT
Yeah, but drugs and liquor, at least you get high. With Christianity, you just get ...?

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 16, 2013 5:41:02 PM PDT
Bubba says:
"High On Jesus" by Kinky Friedman

Walking down division street
I happened on to meet
A stranger with a package in his hand.
He said, "mister, if you follow me
Rainbow colors you will see,
I'll take your head into the promised land."
"friend, I don't need your stuff,
My jesus is enough.
You see them colors bright,
Why can't you see the light ?"

Let's get high on jesus, high on jesus,
I believe that he was here in town.
Flying high on jesus, high on jesus,
I'm so high I'm never coming down.

One man buys a nickel sack,
Another buys a Cadillac,
They both think they will drive their cares away.
But neither thinks to lend a hand
To help his struggling fellow man,
They'd better buy their tickets now for judgment day.

Oh, friend, let's try to score
For peace and not for war,
For love and not for hate
Before it gets too late.

Let's get high on jesus, high on jesus,
Ain't you ever heard the Nashville sound ?
Flying high on jesus, high on jesus,
I guess, my friend, the lord still gets around.

An angry mob confronted me
By the university,
"down with this and down with that" they cried.
A burning bottle in his hand,
A long-haired youth screamed, "come on, man,
The conscience of america has died!"

friend, I don't get my kicks
Starting fires and throwing bricks,
I pray someday you find
The gentle reason i'm

So high on jesus, high on jesus,
They tried to put his body under ground.
Flashing high on jesus, high on jesus,
But friend, you just can't keep the good man down.

Oh, let's get high on jesus, high on jesus,
They tried to put his body under ground.
Flashing high on jesus, high on jesus,
But friend, you just can't keep the good man down.

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 16, 2013 6:15:25 PM PDT
[Customers don't think this post adds to the discussion. Show post anyway. Show all unhelpful posts.]

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 16, 2013 6:15:59 PM PDT
[Customers don't think this post adds to the discussion. Show post anyway. Show all unhelpful posts.]

Posted on Mar 16, 2013 6:23:47 PM PDT
tokolosi says:
"Why? . . . . Why not?"*

(*Timothy Leary's last words.)

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 16, 2013 6:55:04 PM PDT
J. Potter says:
Unfounded reassurance. An ill-advised release from the burden of rationality. An unearned pass on personal responsibility.

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 16, 2013 7:02:50 PM PDT
Re OP: "What makes the Church so resilient?" People are easily swindled. Consider Bernie Madoff...

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 17, 2013 6:36:57 AM PDT
Vicki says:
Dear Mark,

Unfortunately I don't have a connection to the iternet that supports viewing your video link, but I think that your question about why Christianity is thriving despite the fact that it is outlawed outside of the walls of state-sanctioned churches is a very interesting one.

I came across an article at
http://berkleycenter.georgetown.edu/events/why-christianity-is-thriving-in-china-today which said:
According to Fenggang Yang, Professor of sociology and director of the Center on Religion and Chinese Society at Purdue University:
"the reason for the growth of Christianity in Chinese society is "its perceived compatibility with modernity. During the rapid modernization process, Christian beliefs, rituals and organizations appear to meet the economic, political, social, and cultural needs of the people.".

Sounds kind of dry, so I looked for an article with a more personal touch at
www.aljazeera.com/programmes/101east/2011/06/2011629646319175.html
which quoted a lady by the name of Yang

"Our life has become so hectic, there is so much pressure. When my husband left me, I was devastated. But one of my friends took me to one of their gatherings and I realized that someone loves me. I want my daughter to grow up knowing that there is more to life than just money. I want her to care more about other people," says Yang

So, I would agree with andthehorse and say that the reason that Christianity is growing in China, despite opposition, is because of Christ.

I would also add that the people who have chosen to follow Christ in China, feel a great need that their culture does not fulfill but Christ does.

It is interesting to note that the mother meets in an unauthorized home church because the approved churches do not teach the gospel to anyone under 18 (China outlaws it).

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 17, 2013 7:43:58 AM PDT
Ariex says:
Lucy in the Sky with Hedgehogs says: "Yeah, but drugs and liquor, at least you get high. With Christianity, you just get ...?"

Ariex: ......the opiat of the masses.

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 17, 2013 7:50:31 AM PDT
Ariex says:
Vicki says: "I would also add that the people who have chosen to follow Christ in China, feel a great need that their culture does not fulfill but Christ does."
Ariex: People have needs that their culture doesn't fill. But does "Christ" actually do anything beyond altering their personal perceptions by making promises of things to come? Certainly there is no perceptible change in their living conditions other than personal behavior, but is this due to "Christ", or to their own beliefs serving as motivation for causing the changes?

Is it Christ, or Placebo? People have embraced Islam and found the same life-changing experiences. I suspect that the ancients had similar experiences with their own gods.

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 17, 2013 8:06:16 AM PDT
Astrocat says:
That's an excellent point, Ariex, about the "highs" people get in all religions, including Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism, and no doubt every religion that's ever existed. From my point of view I'd say the "high" is not from any external source, but from the what I call Soul, the divine life within each form.

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 17, 2013 8:44:19 AM PDT
Vicki says:
Dear Ariex,

You asked :"People have needs that their culture doesn't fill. But does "Christ" actually do anything beyond altering their personal perceptions by making promises of things to come?"

Christianity is not just about "things to come". It is about living a life of purpose that is pleasing to God right now, along with the knowledge that Christ will never leave us nor forsake us as we face life's problems- such as the woman I quoted in my post. It isn't just a placebo, when you take into consideration the very real and devastating problems that come up in people's lives.

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 17, 2013 8:57:11 AM PDT
Mark Hubbell: What makes the Church so resilient?

Rachel: The martyr mentality is built into the religion. Not only was Jesus supposedly killed for his faith, the letters of Paul tell the unwary believer that they will be persecuted. Even when the Christian is in the vast majority and under no attack, he will still complain about being persecuted. For the believer, actual persecution is proof of the teachings of Christianity.

Even on these relatively benign forums, look at how often the Christian complains about being discriminated against here for having his beliefs questioned at all. The level of hysteria is nearly out of all proportion to the level of "attack."

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 17, 2013 10:14:36 AM PDT
tokolosi says:
"From my point of view I'd say the "high" is not from any external source, but from the what I call Soul, the divine life within each form."

.
Or restated with a bit less woo-woo: it is simply an emergent quality of human* consciousness, and certainly not "supernatural".

(* Not sure about other "higher" life forms, though I'm inclined to believe the phenomenon is limited to humans alone.)

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 17, 2013 11:30:45 AM PDT
Astrocat says:
tokolosi, that's interesting, that you consider a reference to Soul as "woo-woo".

Posted on Mar 17, 2013 11:33:45 AM PDT
Without the Holy Spirit,Christianity would have died out ages ago,with the Holy Spirit,its impossible to stop

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 17, 2013 11:41:46 AM PDT
"Without the Holy Spirit,Christianity would have died out ages ago,with the Holy Spirit,its impossible to stop"

Which is why Islam, Buddhism, Taoism, Shinto, Judaism, and Paganism all died out ages ago.

Oh, wait...

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 17, 2013 12:13:48 PM PDT
Bubba says:
I haven't heard of a soul being called a "woo-woo", but I have heard of a part of the female anatomy being called the "woo-woo".

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 17, 2013 12:30:22 PM PDT
The Weasel says:
Last edited by the author 19 hours ago
Mark Hubbell says:
CNN has a story today about an underground Christian church in China. (http://www.cnn.com/video/?/video/world/2013/03/12/mckenzie-china-defiant-priest.cnn#/video/world/2013/03/12/mckenzie-china-defiant-priest.cnn).

In a country that outlawed and persecuted religion, why does Christianity endure? More than enduring, it returns with great passion! The same has happened in the former Soviet Union and other atheist nations. Christianity thrives under persecution.

What makes the Church so resilient?
***
Falun Gong has had it even worse there. Why are they so resilient? No one outside of China cares about them much either.

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 17, 2013 12:55:24 PM PDT
Re Davison, 3-17 11:30 AM: "... you consider a reference to Soul as "woo-woo"." Is there the slightest reason to consider it to be anything else?
You have referred to "Soul" at various times in these threads, but have never presented evidence of the existence of such a thing.

Posted on Mar 17, 2013 2:12:02 PM PDT
Jonn Jonzz says:
I like woo-woos though!

In reply to an earlier post on Mar 17, 2013 2:22:26 PM PDT
Astrocat says:
Robert, once again you ask for objective proof of something that is subjective, that is, behind or within the form. And again I tell you, you have to experience it for yourself, but it cannot be touched, tasted, seen, smelled or heard with the five lower senses. You know this, yet you keep pounding away at it. Sad.
‹ Previous 1 2 3 Next ›
[Add comment]
Add your own message to the discussion
To insert a product link use the format: [[ASIN:ASIN product-title]] (What's this?)
Prompts for sign-in
 


Recent discussions in the Religion forum

 

This discussion

Discussion in:  Religion forum
Participants:  20
Total posts:  64
Initial post:  Mar 16, 2013
Latest post:  Mar 20, 2013

New! Receive e-mail when new posts are made.

Search Customer Discussions