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Why do I need to pray in order for God to help me? : Questions to God: Part 2


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In reply to an earlier post on Sep 21, 2012 1:47:39 PM PDT
Sometimes songs give that reminder, viz. Leonard Cohen's "Forget the perfect offering. There is a crack, a crack in everything."

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 21, 2012 5:18:02 PM PDT
soct the gat says:
Clarissa, I didn't say anything about God being limited to potential. It might just be that God can control everything but chooses not to. Thus, God has the potential to control everything.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 21, 2012 5:18:41 PM PDT
soct the gat says:
Where in the Bible does it say that God controls everything?

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 21, 2012 5:20:09 PM PDT
soct the gat says:
God has not controlled anything I have done today--at least not that I am aware of.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 21, 2012 8:00:45 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Sep 21, 2012 8:04:22 PM PDT
Praying is simply getting in tune with and talking to Him/Her/It. The talking part is easy. The work is the "getting in tune with" :-)

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 21, 2012 9:36:52 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Sep 22, 2012 6:28:13 AM PDT
Earlier, at 8:54 PM on Sepember 20th, you wrote "Does God control all events in the universe, OR ONLY have the potential to control all events in the universe?" I have put "or only" in capitals, to highlight.

I replied "He wouldn't be much of a God if he were limited to potential, which is not the same as saying that He has decided to control all events in the universe."

What you wrote at 18:02 doesn't match at all the post sent at 5:18. The later post expresses far better what you meant to say earlier, and I concur with your sensible view about God.

Clarissa

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 22, 2012 5:48:09 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Sep 22, 2012 7:26:42 PM PDT
soct the gat says:
Clarissa, you are right. I meant to use "only" in the sense that "one only does this" or "one only does that", as in "I could eat meat, but I only eat vegetables" (which isn't the case, just an example). The way you put it is much more clear.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 22, 2012 6:27:55 AM PDT
Vicki says:
Dear quert,

You said :"I'm not sure why some folks need a supernatural reminder that "stuff" happens even when you're not expecting it."

It is more than just a supernatural reminder that our lives get interrupted by the unexpected.

Part of being ready is understanding that we don't have the control that we like to think that we have.

That as much as we would like to hang on to what and who we have, we really are called on to let go sometimes, and trust God always.

Also, part of being ready involved realizing that hard times isn't an indication that God doesn't love us anymore or we have done something wrong.

It helps to decide ahead of time, in one's heart, that no matter what happens, trusting God is the best route through the tough times, if one is a Christian.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 22, 2012 2:51:27 PM PDT
quert says:
In this respect, then, what I'm saying is there is no difference between the uncertainty we all experience, Christian or not. Are you saying that your God gives you precognitive knowledge, even if not in detail? Or could it just be the same general realization that something could be and probably "is" afoot, just like everyone else?

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 22, 2012 3:49:03 PM PDT
Vicki says:
Dear quert,

You asked :"Are you saying that your God gives you precognitive knowledge, even if not in detail? Or could it just be the same general realization that something could be and probably "is" afoot, just like everyone else?"

No- not specific precognitive knowledge.

I'm saying that we attended a women's retreat, heard a sermon, and had a Sunday school lesson in close succession that all had the same theme- to be ready. (Readiness was in regard to trouble where it is best before it is upon us to decide ahead of time how we will react- with hurt or blame, or with faith and hope). We discussed among ourselves that we thought something that would effect us as a church family was coming up, but we had no idea what it would be.

When the tragedy happened, we decided that God had been preparing us for that specific occurence. We were moved when we realized that God was preparing us beforehand, as well as comforting us afterward.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 22, 2012 4:51:47 PM PDT
quert says:
Well, Vicki, what I'm "hearing" you say is that its easy to put a "God-spin" on any normally occuring event, especially after hearing a sermon, reading scripture or participating in a religiously oriented pastime.

Imo, your perception of a divine heads-up is simply that...your preferred perception. Non-theists "hear" warnings & have flashes of inspiration, too, only its called intuitive thinking...which is usually the result of being aware of subtle clues and subconscious awareness of surrounding conditions. Or, just being aware that something unexpected is bound to happen.

To say a deity is sending out messages is simply putting a supernatural slant on naturally occurring phenomena.

This, of course, is merely my opinion on coincidental events, no matter how amazing they may seem.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 22, 2012 7:32:10 PM PDT
soct the gat says:
quert said: "To say a deity is sending out messages is simply putting a supernatural slant on naturally occurring phenomena."

"Sending out messages" is a misunderstanding of the way that spirituality works. And a created occurrence is not a coincidence.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 22, 2012 8:40:36 PM PDT
Vicki says:
Dear quert,

You said :"To say a deity is sending out messages is simply putting a supernatural slant on naturally occurring phenomena."

God communicates with those who love Him and who are alert for what He has to say through the many avenues that are available. It was a difficult time, but knowing that God was with us and that what we went through together meant something to Him, had meaning for us. We saw Him bring us closer together and give courage to those who were more directly effected.

That is not what I would call "putting a supernatural slant on naturally occurring phenomena", but I understand why you would hold that opinion.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 22, 2012 9:45:12 PM PDT
quert says:
5m says: " "Sending out messages" is a misunderstanding of the way that spirituality works."

I have a feeling millions of Bible believers would disagree. If the inspired word of God isn't messages sent and messages received, what are they?

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 22, 2012 10:02:29 PM PDT
quert says:
" It was a difficult time, but knowing that God was with us and that what we went through together meant something to Him, had meaning for us. We saw Him bring us closer together and give courage to those who were more directly effected."

I can appreciate that you and the others experienced a difficult time and desired solace and strength, but here's what baffles me. Why is the shared comfort and support of one another not enough? Why is it important that one's troubles be acknowledged by a discrete spirit, and even more, that this immaterial being be sympathetic to them? Isn't the love and compassion of the people in our lives sufficient?

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 23, 2012 7:03:55 AM PDT
Vicki says:
Dear quert,

You said :"Why is the shared comfort and support of one another not enough? Why is it important that one's troubles be acknowledged by a discrete spirit, and even more, that this immaterial being be sympathetic to them? Isn't the love and compassion of the people in our lives sufficient?"

Part of it, I think, is that there is something radically different about God's love. Yes, we like to be on the receiving end of compassion and love from people when we need it, but people- even the ones who are closest to us- don't always understand us, become distant when they think that we might be needing them too much, can be disappointed in us so much that they decide to leave, and can turn against us in a myriad of ways that hurt like crazy. In other words, people's love is as flawed as people are, but God's love is perfect.

Another part has to do with our identity in Christ. There are certain things that happen to someone who places their trust in Christ- spiritual things that you find it hard to accept. We begin to be able to see things in a spiritual light- spiritual discernment, that recognizes God working, God communicating, God giving, God comforting, God loving, God ordering circumstances, God convicting, etc.

Another part is the relationship with God that positions us in regard to Him, as His children who are dearly loved and who will never lose that love. We are focused on that relationship, growing in it, watching our Father and trying to imitate Him and Jesus. We work to please Him and Jesus actually finds us work to do for him and his Kingdom.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 23, 2012 1:15:23 PM PDT
soct the gat says:
quert, I would describe it more as a direct understanding of the all.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 24, 2012 8:04:17 AM PDT
I. L. Walker says:
5 - How True.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 24, 2012 8:21:51 PM PDT
quert says:
Wow, 5m, that sounds pretty ambitious. I think you're the first person I've heard claim to understand the all.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 24, 2012 9:14:10 PM PDT
quert says:
First of all, sorry it took me so long to reply, Vicki.

You said: In other words, people's love is as flawed as people are, but God's love is perfect.

q: I can only respond with, well sure, who doesn't want unfailing, unconditional love and acceptance? But, for me it becomes a question of whether that's a practical desire or a product of wish-fulfillment. Somehow it seems more reasonable to me to accept the reality of life, warts and all, and be grateful for the good times and good people we do find. It seems that love and compassion we receive from less-than-perfect people is more valuable, and to me more appreciated, than being loved by a deity that can't do otherwise.

Just my take on the realities and vicissitudes of life.

Posted on Sep 25, 2012 10:05:41 AM PDT
So it seems like the general consensus here is that praying is for listening to God and getting in tune with God's spirit.

How does that consensus compare with Jesus instructions on prayer in Matthew 6: 5-14?

Posted on Sep 25, 2012 10:45:34 AM PDT
I. L. Walker says:
DKK - A universal Prayer established by Jesus has great instuctive value. It does not restrict the personal prayer, though, in any way.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 25, 2012 11:47:29 AM PDT
ILW - How do you figure that? Jesus actually put a lot of restrictions on prayer in those verses, most of which usually go ignored in churches or at other Christian gatherings.

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 25, 2012 12:01:00 PM PDT
Pathfinder says:
Dakillakon.....if your car broke down.....do you think AAA would automatically show up.....if you do not call them????

In reply to an earlier post on Sep 25, 2012 12:01:40 PM PDT
I. L. Walker says:
DKK - Do not imitate the prayer of the hypocrite, a wise restriction. Do not babble as the pagans do, a wise restriction. What other specific "restrictions" do you see specified in Matthew?
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Discussion in:  Religion forum
Participants:  24
Total posts:  371
Initial post:  Sep 13, 2012
Latest post:  Nov 14, 2012

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