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Self-publishing is a dead end

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In reply to an earlier post on Jul 13, 2012 10:22:26 AM PDT
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In reply to an earlier post on Jul 13, 2012 10:22:39 AM PDT
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In reply to an earlier post on Jul 15, 2012 10:53:37 AM PDT
Instead of hundreds, there are one and a half million ebooks on Kindle. Assuming that each writer wrote 10 books, that is still a hundred and fifty thousand authors out there competing for attention.

Posted on Jul 18, 2012 5:38:59 PM PDT
timber9762 says:
I'm someone with a foot in both worlds at the moment - self and trade publishing. It's a bit of a psychological experiment (with myself as mad scientist and guinea pig) and I'm finding highs and lows in both forums. With my third book out on partials with four NY based agents, I put up my first two books on Kindle at the end of June. They are selling very well (but what wouldn't, at $.99?) and I am thrilled to know that my work is being read and hopefully enjoyed all across the globe right now. (Plus some great reviews and a piece of fan mail doesn't hurt the ego!) And with the third book, with every partial request I get, I get two or three rejections. Highs and lows for sure. Part of me itches to be 'validated' in the 'real world' of trade publishing, but then, I go on twitter, follow these four agents to learn they are just as human, flawed and egocentric as the rest of us. I think in either forum, the gateposts are acceptance and rejection, and we all try to navigate around them as if they will save us or sink us. If you're a writer, you just write and hope. And hope. And hope...

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 19, 2012 2:32:26 PM PDT
Ecclesiastes 12:12

New International Version (NIV)

12 Be warned, my son, of anything in addition to them.

Of making many books there is no end, and much study wearies the body.


In reply to an earlier post on Jul 19, 2012 2:43:30 PM PDT
timber9762 says:
Ooh, good one!

Posted on Jul 19, 2012 3:32:44 PM PDT
Depends why you write. I enjoy playing piano and guitar-but I'll never be a famous musician..I enjoy fishing-but I never wonder how much money I can make selling the trout I catch (I release them all anyway)..I have a Mead 16 inch telescope and hundreds of people have stopped to look through it when I have it set up--never charged anyone to enjoy the visions of our solar system and beyond, and I'll never be a professional or famous astronomer..TV is (to me anyway) 90% garbage--these activities as well as writing, are a much more creative and enjoyable way to spend time IMO. I enjoyed writing my book with the same frame of mind that my other activities engage..I know it will never make me rich-famous-etc. (just like my other activities). I simply did it for my own personal enjoyment and with the hopes that others would enjoy the visions that I tried to create for them. Will it make money? Who knows? If it does-thats good, if it doesn't-so what? I just enjoy the writing and story-telling (also have a pretty well followed blog). Yea there is alot of junk out there but it's not just indie authors..Nothing wrong with someone being creative-not going to please everyone-but try to please yourself..

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 19, 2012 4:35:31 PM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on Aug 8, 2012 7:29:05 AM PDT]

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 19, 2012 5:51:31 PM PDT
Uh, so you're saying that Amazon is going to hell? Or just all the indie authors?

Guess I better put those angel wings out for the weekend garage sale.

Just sayin'

Not really. Just saying, rest assured, we will never see no end to the creation and publication of books. That's all.

Thought that was cool enough to share with all. :)

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 19, 2012 6:41:20 PM PDT
"let's ignore, for a moment, a nightmare world in which every talented editor and designer needs to become an independent contractor with no health benefits. What happens to the writer?"

You mean the guy that is already an independent contractor with no health benefits?

I'll ignore the rest of the article you referenced. It is, to my mind completely in the corner of "DIY hurts the book industry - well, except for the guy that actually did the work that started the process! He it's his DUTY to stay the Status Quo! Us and the music industry, CDs all the way!"

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 20, 2012 3:42:18 PM PDT
evry now an than I say things that hurt pepoles feelings.

Sory of that. I applogizse

Posted on Jul 20, 2012 3:43:17 PM PDT
goddby my friends

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 20, 2012 5:53:19 PM PDT
Rune Stone says:
Unfortunately I do not need your subjective point of view to tell me what is good and what isn't. Do you really believe any author is going to actually come out and say their writing is bad or not worth reading? The problem with posts like this is that anyone can say anything without an objective model to back it up. All I would say to other writers is to ignore rhetoric like this and proceed with your passion. In addition, you might want to choose your words more carefully, " not necessarily a dead end" is a pointless statement.

Posted on Jul 20, 2012 6:07:12 PM PDT
Knightmare94 says:
I'm sure that we can conclude that self publishing is not a dead end. It's just that there are a lot of poor writers clogging the roadway.

Posted on Jul 20, 2012 6:16:02 PM PDT
Can a writer say something about her work that would make me want to read it? Sure! It happens all the time. I've bought several books based on what a writer said in an interview on Terry Gross or Steven Colbert or Jon Stewart, or in writing in a newspaper or magazine.

I'm looking for two things.

One: the writer has to be able to clearly and engagingly explain the context of his work: its genre and influences. I'm looking for evidence that the writer is also an avid reader who knows her field at least as well as I do.

Two: the writer should demonstrate what makes his work unique, prove she is making an original contribution to her field.

Some professional writers do this much better than others. It definitely requires reflection, practice, and outside input. I have read hundreds of posts by self-published authors, and I am yet to find one that did those things for me.

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 20, 2012 6:27:44 PM PDT
Knightmare94 says:
Those are very good standards to go by, Dmitry. While I'd point out that many self pub authors will never get anywhere close to that level of exposure in order to present their case, it's also true that a large number don't deserve that aforementioned exposure. But it's definitely something that self pub authors can keep in mind when presenting their work in smaller circles, since their work will still be judged by similar merits.

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 21, 2012 6:44:39 AM PDT
That's a good point. Sub-consciously a lot of people judge self-published stuff on a different standard than they do books from a publishing house. Even though publishing houses have marketed bad books. (the caveat is that sometimes an established writer will want to do something new, or experiment, and a publisher will not go along and they will self-publish. In that case I don't think it matters) People don't expect a professional author they'd heard of to write something sub-standard. They seemed surprised when they read a self-published book that is very good. I wouldn't necessarily say that an unknown writer is being judged exactly the same as someone would judge say James Patterson, I think the unknown is actually being scrutinized a slight bit more.

Posted on Jul 21, 2012 1:32:07 PM PDT
Knightmare94 says:
The problem with self pub is that anyone can do it. I was on the Wattpad boards and three teens were looking for reviews for the book that they just published. I checked it out and it was just awful. They had no sense of proper grammar structure and the preview was filled with errors from the very first paragraph. It's instances like that which makes it so much harder on any indie writer who actual strives for professionalism. The market is glutted with beginners who would never even get consideration by the proper avenues. Because of that, the professional indie writer is lost in a heaving sea of untalented hacks all waving manuscripts that suck.

Posted on Jul 21, 2012 6:35:00 PM PDT
But I suppose that is the point of self publishing, right? Either you're not good enough to be trade published, or you are but just haven't hit the right alignment of stars yet (agent, editor, publisher, public, etc). It's hard wading through the mire, yes, but ebook sales are rising exponentially, so it can't be that ebooks are so bad that no one is giving them a chance. Quite the opposite, I should think. If your book is good, it will sell. If it's not, it might not. Readers are, by and large, hoarders. We love to acquire many, many, many books. It's not either-or, it's more and more.

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 21, 2012 6:57:25 PM PDT
Knightmare94 says:
I see your point, but at the same time no one who places a price tag on a book should get a pass because it's self published. If they're giving away permanently free copies then that's something else. But when I purchase a book then I expect the same level of quality from a indie author as I do a traditionally published one. Take the Wool - Omnibus Edition series for example. The author produced a work that was as professionally written and edited as any that you'd find at the big publishers. If a person still is working on their writing then they should partake of the many writing groups out there to hone their craft. No one should think that just because they put together a stack of written pages that it's time to sell it, unless it's on par with what the readers expect in terms of good writing. That's all I'm saying. Readers may buy a lot of books, but a good writer takes pride in delivering something that a reader will be glad they purchased, instead of tossing it to the side after a few pages.

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 21, 2012 7:12:21 PM PDT
[Deleted by the author on Jul 21, 2012 7:21:24 PM PDT]

In reply to an earlier post on Aug 13, 2012 9:27:55 PM PDT
JNagarya says:
Over time, the junk (indie or traditional) will sink to the bottom and disappear.

. . . to be replaced with the subsequent and continuing flood of junk.

In reply to an earlier post on Aug 13, 2012 9:36:54 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Aug 13, 2012 9:59:30 PM PDT
JNagarya says:
The whole idea to me of the internet, was to break away from the typical, the status quo setup where only well known, well heeled authors are publishing.

Along with a million others . . .

The term "author" means "published writer". One can be a successful writer without being published. Little Emily (Dickinson) is an example.

I've been writing since 1965, and through the decades have developed superior skills -- more important, a "voice" that distinguishes my writing from that of others.

But the publishing aspect of it doesn't hold that much interest for me (what I need is a second person who will do the submitting.) I've published, and have learned how to get things published first time out; but the thrill isn't as much as one expects.

And there's the irony: those who are sufficiently knowledgeable to be impressed should know better; and those who aren't sufficiently knowledgeable to be impressed should know better.

In reply to an earlier post on Aug 13, 2012 9:58:37 PM PDT
JNagarya says:
The writer must respect the language, the reader -- it is a deadly sin to waste their irreplaceable time -- and, before, during, and after, himself. If the latter is missing then leaving the slipshod-well-enough-alone will be the result.

The writer should always fear being embarrassed, and as often do everything he can to avoid being embarrassed.

In reply to an earlier post on Aug 13, 2012 10:27:01 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Aug 13, 2012 10:28:27 PM PDT
there are many valid reasons to self pub instead of going the current traditional route

speed to market
control of content and format
more profit
yada yada

in the beginning there only was self pub
then corps grabbed power and became the only way

now the pendulum is swinging back
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Discussion in:  Science Fiction forum
Participants:  39
Total posts:  90
Initial post:  Jul 7, 2012
Latest post:  Nov 30, 2012

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