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Global warming is nothing but a hoax and a scare tactic

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In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 5:32:02 PM PST
Last edited by the author on Feb 22, 2012 5:39:35 PM PST
TeaPartywoman: What is this science fiction topic of AGW doing in the science forum?

TS: What is TeaPartywoman doing here on a non-fiction topic? ANSWER: Creating fictions!

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 5:38:48 PM PST
Last edited by the author on Feb 22, 2012 6:51:03 PM PST
ML: OK, I don't want to appear as a hypocrite and argue one way for Heartland, and another for East Anglia or another for Mann's emails...... but I have to ask if the cases are comparable.

It seems scientists should be willing to release information under the Freedom of Information (FOI) Act, when that research was sponsored by Government grants. But, should FOI requests be thought of in the same way as a private corporation or Charitable 503(c) corp?

It seems Mann has an obligation to release under FOI.

TS: Very true. Which is what he did. Mann released the FOI requested data.

ML: East Anglia was indeed a hack, and seems like the theft was clearly a dishonest act.

TS: It wasn't the hacking that bothered me as much as the purposeful cherrypicking a few sentences out of context and interpreting them in a GROSSLY deceitful, distorting manner.

I would have had little to no problem with internal auditors reading their personal emails, and exposing any wrongdoing they saw.

ML: Heartland was also a theft through impersonation and a dishonest act.

TS: They should be open to internal auditors too. Barring that and being deceitful, I had no problems with the impersonation. Again, I see it like the FBI infiltrating the mafia.

NOW I would be furious if Gleick had distorted these emails, either changed the original, or like the CRU hack, had cherrypicked lines to distort them out of context.

ML: but I have a hard time thinking Mann is justified in resisting the FOI request... am I missing something in my ethics logic here??

TS: What you are missing: are your facts! Mann released all the requested data via FOI. Else you would actually have a point on this one.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 9:17:34 PM PST
Truthseeker says:
Leadership challenge to Australian PM Jullia Gillard - she may get ousted on Monday.
The Australian people are fed-up with climatequackology and corrupt quack Gillard imposing the fraudulent carbon tax on their economy and pocketbooks. That's despite AGWers constantly censoring the truth from the people.

Yay, hopefully on Monday, good riddance to bad carbon Gillard rubbish. And didn't JDC say she'd get back popularity fo the Australian people? What fantasy!

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 9:19:48 PM PST
A customer says:
Joe - "At least the climate clowns are starting to come clean."

Shame that organisations like Heartland and Cato don't do so, eh?

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 9:22:14 PM PST
Last edited by the author on Feb 22, 2012 9:23:25 PM PST
A customer says:
Having lived in an ozone hole for decades now, I think you'll find that Australians mainly endorse climate science.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 9:22:30 PM PST
Last edited by the author on Feb 22, 2012 9:23:14 PM PST
Truthseeker says:
"What you are missing: are your facts! Mann released all the requested data via FOI. Else you would actually have a point on this one."

Lies and creation of sceince fiction yet again.
With information suppresssion and censorship by the climatequackologists, hacking the truth is the only way for the public to learn about the truth

Global warming's `dirty laundry'

"Those who say man alone is responsible for overheating the planet frequently dismiss any role the sun might play. As can be seen in an ongoing freedom-of-information lawsuit leveled against the University of Virginia (UVA), sunshine is precisely what the heralds of climate catastrophe fear most of all.

The American Tradition Institute (ATI) is going after 12,000 emails sent or received by Michael E. Mann while he was on the staff of the publicly-funded university. Mr. Mann is famous for coming up with one of the "tricks" used to "hide the decline" in global temperatures. On Wednesday, ATI released a small selection of emails it hopes will convince a Prince William County judge that full disclosure of the rest is in the public interest.

In March 2003, for example, a trusted colleague of Mr. Mann's emailed to find out how the UVA professor arrived at his conclusions. Mr. Mann admitted he was missing crucial data and "can't seem to dig them up." Though he was working on this project on the taxpayers' dime, he provided the information for the researcher's personal use only. "So please don't pass this along to others without checking w/ me first," Mr. Mann wrote. "This is the sort of 'dirty laundry' one doesn't want to fall into the hands of those who might potentially try to distort things."

David Schnare, a scientist and lawyer who runs ATI's Environmental Law Center, said he was shocked that anyone claiming to be a scientist wouldn't keep a detailed log of his research activities. "In science, there is no dirty laundry," Mr. Schnare told The Washington Times. "Science progresses by proving to yourself that you were wrong, that your hypothesis was in error. Every time you're wrong, it means you can cut off some area of research and start on a better one."

The institute has about 200 emails that it obtained from a number of sources, including the Climategate leaks. The messages show preachers of imminent climate catastrophe like Mr. Mann weren't interested in the kind of open discussion that allows scientific progress. Various exchanges included warnings to "PLEASE DELETE" the email after reading.

Mr. Mann insists disclosure would have a chilling effect. "Allowing the indiscriminate release of these materials will cause damage to reputations and harm principles of academic freedom," he wrote in an August letter to UVA.

As important as it is to protect Mr. Mann's feelings from being hurt, trillions of dollars are at stake with climate-policy decisions being made based on his work. From cap-and-trade to the Kyoto treaty, it's not enough to make a choice based solely on a trust that this secretive cabal of climate scientists is telling the truth. The taxpayers paid Mr. Mann; they deserve to know exactly what they were getting for their money.

So far, the Climategate disclosures have unmasked shoddy methods in service of a leftist public-policy agenda. Compelling release of all communications - dirty laundry and all - is the only way to provide the full context. Let an informed public decide on its own whether they've been hoodwinked by charlatans, or that the sky really is falling."

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/jan/27/global-warmings-dirty-laundry/

Also....

"5,000 files of private email correspondence among several of the world's top climate scientists were anonymously leaked onto the Internet. Like the first "climategate" leak of 2009, the latest release shows top scientists in the field fudging data, conspiring to bully and silence opponents, and displaying far less certainty about the reliability of anthropogenic global warming theory in private than they ever admit in public.
The scientists include men like Michael Mann of Penn State University and Phil Jones of the University of East Anglia, both of whose reports inform what President Obama has called "the gold standard" of international climate science, the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC).
The new release of emails was timed to coincide with the second anniversary of the original climategate leak and with the upcoming United Nations climate summit in Durban, South Africa. And it has already stirred strong emotions. To Rep. Ed Markey (D., Mass.), for example, the leaker or leakers responsible are attempting to "sabotage the international climate talks" and should be identified and brought "to justice."
One might sympathize with Mr. Markey's outrage if, say, the emails were maliciously rewritten or invented. But at least one scientist involved-Mr. Mann-has confirmed that the emails are genuine, as were the first batch released two years ago. So any malfeasance revealed therein ought to be blamed on the scientists who wrote them, rather than on the whistleblower who exposed them.
Consider an email written by Mr. Mann in August 2007. "I have been talking w/ folks in the states about finding an investigative journalist to investigate and expose McIntyre, and his thus far unexplored connections with fossil fuel interests. Perhaps the same needs to be done w/ this Keenan guy." Doug Keenan is a skeptic and gadfly of the climate-change establishment. Steve McIntyre is the tenacious Canadian ex-mining engineer whose dogged research helped expose flaws in Mr. Mann's "hockey stick" graph of global temperatures.
One can understand Mr. Mann's irritation. His hockey stick, which purported to demonstrate the link between man-made carbon emissions and catastrophic global warming, was the central pillar of the IPCC's 2001 Third Assessment Report, and it brought him near-legendary status in his community. Naturally he wanted to put Mr. McIntyre in his place.
The sensible way to do so is to prove Mr. McIntyre wrong using facts and evidence and improved data. Instead the email reveals Mr. Mann casting about for a way to smear him. If the case for man-made global warming is really as strong as the so-called consensus claims it is, why do the climategate emails show scientists attempting to stamp out dissenting points of view? Why must they manipulate data, such as Mr. Jones's infamous effort (revealed in the first batch of climategate emails) to "hide the decline," deliberately concealing an inconvenient divergence, post-1960, between real-world, observed temperature data and scientists' preferred proxies derived from analyzing tree rings?
This is the real significance of the climategate emails. They show that major scientists who inform the IPCC can't be trusted to stick to the science and avoid political activism. This, in turn, has very worrying implications for the major international policy decisions adopted on the basis of their research.
That brings us to the motives of the person calling himself "FOIA" who leaked the emails onto the Internet last week.
In his introductory notes, he writes: "Over 2.5 billion people live on less than $2 a day. Every day nearly 16,000 children die from hunger and related causes. One dollar can save a life. . . . Poverty is a death sentence. Nations must invest $37 trillion in energy technologies by 2030 to stabilize greenhouse gas emissions at sustainable levels. Today's decisions should be based on all the information we can get, not on hiding the decline."
For the service he has performed in pursuit of this larger end, FOIA deserves not opprobrium but gratitude.

http://online.wsj.com/article/
SB10001424052970204452104577059830626002226.html"

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 9:25:22 PM PST
A customer says:
Mark - "East Anglia was indeed a hack, and seems like the theft was clearly a dishonest act."

Hacking happens. The problem isn't some e-mails getting dumped on the Internet but people like Vader lying about what they contained.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 9:29:18 PM PST
Last edited by the author on Feb 22, 2012 9:30:10 PM PST
Truthseeker says:
EB: "Having lived in an ozone hole for decades now, I think you'll find that Australians mainly endorse climate science. They are probably sick of Gillard because she is a neocon ideological fruitcake."

As usual, you are creating science fiction fantasy. This is what happened after Gillard introduced the quack carbon tax:

Australian Prime Minister Julia Gillard's popularity has nosedived in recent weeks as a result of her government's climate change policy.
www.telegraph.co.uk/.../7924721/Julia-Gillards-popularity

JDC: "More on those funding denialists...."

Still no evidence for a link betwen Easterbrook, Lindzen, Spencer, myself (who you always accused of) being linked to Exxon.

Well, I guess baseless presumption and hearsay accusations which the former USSR would have been proud of, are the fundamental mode of operations for AGW junkies.

JDC: "Australia was recently force-fed two freak shows performed by two sad little men - the fraudulent, Christopher Monckton and cut-and-paste weather man, Anthony Watts - hilarious! Verrrrry "scientific" eh? Is that the best you can produce deniers? Gulp!"

Well, judging by Gillard's dismal poll numbers, it is clear who the Australian people attribute more credibility to.
Force-fed how? GIllard's a carbon quack. So presentation of the contrarian side is now mislabled as force-feeding? Kim Il Sung would be proud of you! Hey why don't we make it mandatory to hang a photo of Al Gore in every room in the Western world? Would that be better?

You can accuse the seekers of truth to be stooges and liars all you want, but the people aren't buying.

=> AGW censorship and Göbells tactics haven't worked in Australia either.

PS: Oh by the way JDC is not the only Australian around. There are about 20 million other Australians and many of them are fed up with climatequackology, as they are in the United Kingdom, the United States, even in Germany.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 9:30:04 PM PST
A customer says:
E. Vader - "Those who say man alone is responsible for overheating the planet frequently dismiss any role the sun might play."

If you can't even get the first sentence right why do you think anyone would listen to the rest?

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 9:32:00 PM PST
A customer says:
E. Vader - "Australian Prime Minister Julia Gillard's popularity has nosedived in recent weeks as a result of her government's climate change policy."

Oh, yes. A denialist propaganda outlet - THAT's a good place to go for an objective interpretation of poll figures.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 9:32:37 PM PST
Truthseeker says:
Mark - "East Anglia was indeed a hack, and seems like the theft was clearly a dishonest act."

Sorry, I have to disagree. The CRU is paid for by taxpayers. What a shame that taxpayers are paying climate quacks to censor and steal the truth from them. The Climategate hacking wasn't a theft, it was an act of Robin Hood - revealing the stolen truth to the people.

Only way to counteract rampant climatequack censorship is to hack the truth.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 9:34:10 PM PST
Truthseeker says:
EB: "Hacking happens. The problem isn't some e-mails getting dumped on the Internet but people like Vader lying about what they contained."

Lol EB calls direct quotes in full from the climategate mails lying.
The only liars here are the AGWers, but, of course, liars are the quickest to accuse honest people of being liars.

Posted on Feb 22, 2012 9:35:58 PM PST
Last edited by the author on Feb 22, 2012 9:36:25 PM PST
Truthseeker says:
Anyways, I don't generally post about AGW in the Science forum anymore because climatequackology is SCIENCE FICTION.

If you want to argue with me, the AGW thread in the science fiction forum is the only place. Otherwise, goodbye and good riddance.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 10:31:04 PM PST
A customer says:
E. Vader - "EB calls direct quotes in full from the climategate mails lying."

No, I call your lying about them "lying". Pretending to understand them, for starters.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 22, 2012 10:35:56 PM PST
A customer says:
E. Vader - "The Climategate hacking wasn't a theft, it was an act of Robin Hood - revealing the stolen truth to the people."

As far as I know, no-one has identified the hacker as a taxpayer, nor where the participants in the mailings by any means all UK government employees. So no, it was theft.

And your continued defence of theft is of course duly recorded.

"Only way to counteract rampant climatequack censorship is to hack the truth. "

Which is that repeated investigations have concluded that the stolen mails were innocuous. Something else with whose truth you are economical.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 23, 2012 5:15:51 AM PST
Truthseeker says:
Oh by the way I forgot to mention, I visited a little village on the Bödensee last weekend and, to my amazement saw a thick layer of ice covering the lakeside, the beach, the pier, etc.

First I thought that it was heavy snow frozen into ice.

But then I asked the locals. They said NO. It was lake water that had frozen over and accumulated on the shore for weeks of extreme cold between -10 and -20 C. One man in his 30s said that he'd lived there all his life and never saw such a thing! BTW this was a few days after the thaw had set in and the ice was STILL THERE in abundance!

I asked innocently the locals, ah but you know the world is warming, so the climate scientists tell us. There was a chorus of laughter, and several insults were thrown at the climate quacks such as "Narr" "Blödheit" and more profane terms in German I don't want to use here.

On the other side of the world, Gillard is hopefully being ousted early -> Australians have had enough of her quack tax.

In recent years, despite the mountain of censorship, the climate quacks have been proven to be the most absurd jokers of the universe all over the world.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 23, 2012 5:19:27 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Feb 23, 2012 5:21:12 AM PST
A customer says:
It's not Bödensee, it's "Bodensee", you Afsonderliker, and it froze on the shore within the last ten years while I was living there.

Oh, and the storks and kites are back already on the South side. I happen to commute onto the Bodensee Rheindelta every morning.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 23, 2012 5:20:06 AM PST
Truthseeker says:
"ML: East Anglia was indeed a hack, and seems like the theft was clearly a dishonest act."

No, the hacking was similar to our good spying to reveal the dirty secrets behind the Iron curtain. Today we have the Climate Curtain - a huge web of deceit by people who get paid salaries by the same people - the taxpayers - that they are busy deceiving.

The hacking was an exercise in the seeking of the truth. If the climatequacks had nothing to hide, they'd have nothing to panic about. But just look at Mann panicking that all of their deception might at last be revealed to the public. That says it all.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 23, 2012 5:24:20 AM PST
Truthseeker says:
Lol, EB, now resorting to spelling corrections, eh? Yes it is Bodensee, although it is pronounced Bödensee.
As to the rest, of course you know better than the locals who live there (while you fantasize about the alps from your heated basement in Clownwall)

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 23, 2012 5:24:51 AM PST
A customer says:
E. Vader - "No, the hacking was similar to our good spying to reveal the dirty secrets behind the Iron curtain."

And similar to their doing so against us, yes. Remarkably good metaphor - stealing someone else's confidential communications and claiming you serve a Greater Good. You'd have been a good communist.

"If the climatequacks had nothing to hide, they'd have nothing to panic about."

What a coincidence. I just encountered almost the exact same sentiment while reading this: Dogs of God: Columbus, the Inquisition, and the Defeat of the Moors

Or a good Inquisitor.

Posted on Feb 23, 2012 5:25:12 AM PST
Treehugger© says:
An internal document of the Global Climate Coalition (GCC) -- an industry front group that disbanded in 2002 -- reviewed some of the "contrarian" arguments used by Lindzen and other climate change skeptics that they later discarded. The document, which was obtained as part of a court action against the automobile industry.

In a section on the "Role of Water Vapor", the GCC's Science and Technical Advisory Committee wrote that "In 1990, Prof Richard Lindzen of MIT argued that the models which were being used to predict greenhouse warming were incorrect because they predicted an increase in water vapor at all levels of the troposphere. Since water vapor is a greenhouse gas, the models predict warming at all levels of the troposphere. However, warming should create convective turbulence, which would lead to more condensation of water vapor (i.e. more rain) and both drying and cooling of the troposphere above 5 km. This negative feedback would act as, a "thermostat" keeping temperatures from rising significantly."

However, the GCC's science advisers noted that this argument had been disproven to the point that Lindzen himself had ceased to use it. "Lindzen's 1990 theory predicted that warmer conditions at.the surface would lead to cooler, drier conditions at the top ofthe troposphere. Studies of the behavior of the troposphere in the tropics fail to find the cooling and drying Lindzen predicted. More recent publications have indicated the possibility that Lindzen's hypothesis may be correct, but the evidence is still weak. While Lindzen remains a critic of climate modeling efforts, his latest publications do not include the convective turbulence argument."

In conclusion the GCC's science advisers was that "Lindzen's hypothesis that any warming would create more rain which would cool and dry the upper troposphere did offer a mechanism for balancing the effect of increased greenhouse gases. However, the data supporting this hypothesis is weak, and even Lindzen has stopped presenting it as an alternative to the conventional model of climate change."

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 23, 2012 5:25:22 AM PST
Truthseeker says:
"I happen to commute onto the Bodensee Rheindelta every morning."

Sure sure, shall we speak in German? Last time I checked you couldn't speak a word of it.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 23, 2012 5:26:58 AM PST
A customer says:
E. Vader - "Yes it is Bodensee, although it is pronounced Bödensee."

No it isn't, you cretin. You are so desperate to prove that you don't know what you're talking about that you're actually resorting to spelling the names of other people's homes wrong now.

"As to the rest, of course you know better than the locals who live there"

I'm one of the locals who live there, you cretin. Come to that, so is John.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 23, 2012 5:27:43 AM PST
A customer says:
E. Vader - "Last time I checked you couldn't speak a word of it. "

You've never checked, and wouldn't know if you tried.

In reply to an earlier post on Feb 23, 2012 5:29:40 AM PST
Truthseeker says:
"stealing someone else's confidential communications"

Climate deception by people who is paid by the taxpayers cannot be considered confidential, except in a totalitarian state. As per my recent experience on wiki, climatequackers apply censorship at will all over the place.

ATTENTION: Any article you read on Wiki, automatically has any evidence against climatequackery CENSORED!!!!

So any whistleblowing through hacking of such deception is to be most highly commended.
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