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Reasons for me being suspicious about religion.


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Initial post: Jun 27, 2012 11:49:47 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jun 27, 2012 11:54:55 PM PDT
chanakya says:
I was a very religious person when i was a kid. My parents were very religious and taught me how to be a devout religious person. As i became older, my suspicions on the religion started to grow. here are the two main reasons:

1) Human beings as a species have made stupid mistakes in their belief system. We use to believe that the earth was flat, that drilling holes would allow the bad spirits to escape,Alchemy,Mercury could treat pretty much anything and everything ....etc . In fact our reputation is pretty bad.
How come we were wrong about so many things even though almost all the human beings believed in it ? is it possible that we could be wrong about religion as well ?

2) 2.1 billion people believe that Jesus is God. 1.6 billion people believe Allah is God. 1 billion people believe in Hindu gods. Only one of these groups can be right. which means that the other billions of people who whole heartily believe in their religion are wrong.
If billions of people "who are as convinced as you are" about your religion can be wrong, what is the guarantee that you are right ?

Posted on Jun 28, 2012 3:35:42 AM PDT
True spirituality is knowing that there is something outside of belief systems. Don't believe in anything other than that which you experience and know. Maintain all other beliefs as tentative until proven by your own experience.

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 29, 2012 2:33:17 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jun 29, 2012 2:35:04 AM PDT
Brian says:
Not a bad start. However, don't let the discrepencies discourage you.
Here are some more things to ponder:
- Jesus was not Christian. He never even went to a church as there were no churches then. Only sinagogues.
- While most religions are different, they do all have one thing in common: one God. Whether it be jews, christians, moslems, buddists, or native indians, while they all have a different name for "the God", they do all believe in something beyond our comprehension, something that started it all. So should you give up on your spiritual advancement because everyone is discribing it differently, or should we perhaps study things that are common to them all?
- Some religions are better than others. Some promote murder of those who are "non-believers", others not so. That should give you some pointers as to where the truth is.
- Finally - God did not create religion, humans did. Humans are so imperfect that it would be a miracle if any of the religions was perfect. Still, it is said that everyone carries the altar in him or her self.

Posted on Jun 29, 2012 11:59:27 AM PDT
OldAmazonian says:
If God made everything , then what made God, and why would God be necessary?

Posted on Jun 29, 2012 12:12:10 PM PDT
chanakya says:
I am not debating the existing of GOD here ( lets not get distracted). I am just trying to put some reasonable doubt in the religions we believe in.

Posted on Jun 29, 2012 4:58:02 PM PDT
Blackout says:
religions are middlemen and controllers. You don't need middlemen between you and god / all / source / being / isness. Unless of course you WANT them.

Kind of like managers... they don't really do anything.

Posted on Jun 30, 2012 1:05:00 PM PDT
All Aum says:
Spirituality in its purest form is....LOVE =)
God is the name we use to define the source of what we call "self",we are part-taking in (what appears to be.) an amazing full blown cosmic adventure,where each and everyone of us are part of ONE ENERGY that divides itself into many to experience itself in all kinds of subjective ways and manners... =) So...when you look at me,its God looking through your eyes and decoding the information through your mind and experiencing the world as "You",and likewise,when looking through me,experiencing the world as "Me"... That is the pure basics of what's going on as we are Spiritual beings having a Human experience,and once again,Love is the glue that keeps it all together..
In my personal human experience source is Shiva,and my temple is the dance-floor and Tantra my philosophy...Keep Dancing,Laughing Loving and Living,and thereby realizing Gods Presence....its THAT SIMPLE =)

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 30, 2012 6:07:36 PM PDT
apolitical says:
Chanakya,

Religion and politics were both created by man in order to control, sway, induce, force and usually to play on uneducated peoples fears, and both mainly for enrichment (gain) and power (control). This is the conclusion I have come to as a cynic after studying, reading, learning, debating, finding out for myself by going deeply into these two subjects (religion and politics).
I too was made to believe the Roman Catholic faith from an early age (3 to 16yrs) was the right faith, and from my own personal experience of Roman Catholics who are hypocrites, liars, cruel, brainwashed, and so repressed it is scary especially when you have to believe in Heaven and Hell. I believe we make our own Heaven and Hell on earth. All we really own is our name we are born with and our choices we make. Those are our own for which we then take the consequences of our actions based on the choices we make. We can either do what our conscience tells us is the right thing and be feel good for it or knowing do the wrong thing which we will end up paying for one way or another as I believe in cause and consequence, not dogma which is what most religions are. I argued with the nuns about abusive treatment and was told i had the devil in me for not allowing them to crush my spirit. When I left school I changed my faith, not from choice, but for my first marriage, and it never 'kept me convinced' that I had done the right thing. It only taught me what I did not want. For years I then was left in a spiritual vacuum, with no faith, no religion, and no sustaining beliefs. My quest then started also questioning right and wrong, self help, religions, dogmas, faiths, learning all I could. Needless to say I ended my marriage, joined a pentecostal church and was very happy as I found community faith and hope again. Until they asked all members to bring their Harry Potter Books, Madonna CD's and whatever else they had declared 'evil' for a purging of by fire. This woke me up to the fanaticism that was splitting the real from the unreal and I then left the church as it was splitting up into different factions all fighting for control of the power to rule members minds. This made me rethink my choice, and there are good and bad in all religions, good Christian and bad Christians, good Jews and bad Jews, good catholics and bad catholics, and the only religion I have found to have very little bad and mainly good is no religion. This has filled the vacant hole that was left open when I left the church. I was never happy with the catholic religion because of ill treatment by the nuns who were embittered and cruelly repressed women who took their vengeance out on the children in their care. They wanted me to become a nun because I am named after St Theresa but I would have none of that, my experiences with nuns never engendered a vocation to leave the world behind. When I resisted and fought against their cruel treatment, I was told I had the devil in me. My answer to them was, me, a child of five and you a person of God punishing me for not eating my jungle oats that I had puked in because the porridge was oversalted and I was being forced to eat it puke and all. To my five year old mind they were the devil and had the devil in them. These episodes of repression and cruelty only made me more determined to find out all I could about myself, my world, my religion, and every other religion I could over the years.
You will need to learn about which religion is best for you, and if it fills the obvious gap in your spirit you are wanting to fill.

I have spoken to Jews, Islamics,Catholics,Hindus and people from most of the known religions, and the not so well known religions and each person believes that their religion is the 'right' religion. There is no right or wrong religion, when you find the right one that fills the hole in your spirit that is now opened, you will know and be spiritually whole.

What might help you to answer your own question is: Be as curious as you can, find out all you can, learn all you can, speak to as many different religious leaders as you can, but each person has their own perspective and will convince you that their religion is the 'right' one as it is their belief. Each politician will convince you that they and their party alone is the one you must join, as they believe in the party. This is all lip-service used to convince people, saying: do not do as I do, do what I say, and believe my lies, as I am right because of my position of power, as a priest, bishop, nun, rabbi,iman, senator, governor, king, queen, dictator or anyone in power.

Learn,study, read up, use the internet to educate yourself. You will know when you have learned enough. Each of us carry our own God within us, and our aim and purpose in life is to feed our spirit, which is the god in us, and to find out what our purpose in life is. I found mine late in life, well not too late, as I always loved reading and poetry and the written word. I am now a writer, and have been one since the age of 50, for the last 10 years, and every day I feed my spirit, listen to my inner voice which guides me and do what I can to deserve my time and space on this earth by being of service where I can, and writing, living a life of gratitude which is difficult, but I persevere. I do not believe that when I die I will go to heaven, I make my own heaven on earth, as some make their own hell by envy, greed, sloth, vengeance, hate, always wanting more. We all want happiness, but it is not a destination it is a journey, and we can choose to be happy or sad. Like I say, choice and a name are all we own, use your choices wisely as with choice comes commitment, consequences which affect our lives as well as those of others closest to us.
I do hope you find your answers and that this has helped you to understand the question of religion more.

You will need to spend time alone with your spirit, on a retreat with yourself in meditation, and ask yourself the questions you need answers to. When you commune with your spirit, it puts you on the path to finding yourself, and your purpose and the universe then opens to make a way for you to do this. It all falls into place, because you have to know where you want to go spiritually and when you reach that higher level of enlightenment you will know. We do not always get what we want, we get what we need, is what I have discovered. I live by certain ethics and moral codes which I do not expect others to live by so the only person I have to answer to really is my spirit, my inner god, who is guiding me and of course even the people I love know I am on this spiritual journey.

It is a tough world, with many distractions and chaos reigns, so guard your spirit, as it is the essence of who you really are. Questions, never stop asking, and finding out and evaluating for yourself, as there is no right or wrong religion. Do not let anyone convince you that what you believe to be your faith is wrong, if it sustains and fills you you will feel right and not question or doubt.

Remember: To err is human to forgive is devine. We are all fallible, and will make the same mistakes over and over again, until we learn the lesson from the experience that we are meant to learn. Faith, Hope, Charity, Grace, Love, Kindness and Love are really beliefs to live by.

I do hope you find what you are looking for, as I am sure you will. If you desire the answer all you have to do is ask sincerely and with humility, the universe will hear you, and you will finally get it, maybe not in the way you expect, or when you expect, but you will know when you stop questioning your faith and believe in your God.

Cynic as I am, I have a story of faith, believe it or not: My handbag containing all my documents, (ID,Drivers Licence,Diary,a Letter, some notes) plus my purse with a little cash, bank cards, plus other items was stolen from my room, off my bed where I had left it, near an open window with burglar bars on the outside of the window. The thief used a long stick forked on the end to lift my bag off the bed. I was upset, not for the loss of the cash or purse, but for the handbag which had sentimental value,and the loss of all my original documents which would have to be replaced costing me time to renew them, which might take months (I live in South Africa, which means dealing with Home Affairs office, which is crowded with hundreds of refugees, and locals all wanting documents, the bad rep of Home Affairs offices is no joke). After telling my daughter about this and searching the whole house in case I was mistaken about where I left my bag, I said to her how I did not mind the money or the bag, I would be happy just to get my documents back. The universe heard me. The next day, Kim,my daughter got a phone call from the thief who had found her number in the back of my diary. He said he found my documents placed neatly in a pile on Salt River Station, (this is one suburb away from where the bag was stolen from) which sounded very suspicious at first, and could Kim meet him at a cafe in Salt River during his tea-break that morning. When Kim spoke to him he wanted money for the documents, which she never gave him. He asked for my number for the reward, but gave Kim the documents. Now tell me there is not a God of the Universe who listens to our prayers and answers them?
This is a true story, and the lesson I learned is: Ask, with humility, not for money, but what you really need, and my plea was answered, how, why, for whatever reason I do not know, but I am grateful for the grace given to me, to my daughter for helping me and for my faith in believing in a power greater than myself: The Universe.

In reply to an earlier post on Jun 30, 2012 6:07:39 PM PDT
apolitical says:
Chanakya,

Religion and politics were both created by man in order to control, sway, induce, force and usually to play on uneducated peoples fears, and both mainly for enrichment (gain) and power (control). This is the conclusion I have come to as a cynic after studying, reading, learning, debating, finding out for myself by going deeply into these two subjects (religion and politics).
I too was made to believe the Roman Catholic faith from an early age (3 to 16yrs) was the right faith, and from my own personal experience of Roman Catholics who are hypocrites, liars, cruel, brainwashed, and so repressed it is scary especially when you have to believe in Heaven and Hell. I believe we make our own Heaven and Hell on earth. All we really own is our name we are born with and our choices we make. Those are our own for which we then take the consequences of our actions based on the choices we make. We can either do what our conscience tells us is the right thing and be feel good for it or knowing do the wrong thing which we will end up paying for one way or another as I believe in cause and consequence, not dogma which is what most religions are. I argued with the nuns about abusive treatment and was told i had the devil in me for not allowing them to crush my spirit. When I left school I changed my faith, not from choice, but for my first marriage, and it never 'kept me convinced' that I had done the right thing. It only taught me what I did not want. For years I then was left in a spiritual vacuum, with no faith, no religion, and no sustaining beliefs. My quest then started also questioning right and wrong, self help, religions, dogmas, faiths, learning all I could. Needless to say I ended my marriage, joined a pentecostal church and was very happy as I found community faith and hope again. Until they asked all members to bring their Harry Potter Books, Madonna CD's and whatever else they had declared 'evil' for a purging of by fire. This woke me up to the fanaticism that was splitting the real from the unreal and I then left the church as it was splitting up into different factions all fighting for control of the power to rule members minds. This made me rethink my choice, and there are good and bad in all religions, good Christian and bad Christians, good Jews and bad Jews, good catholics and bad catholics, and the only religion I have found to have very little bad and mainly good is no religion. This has filled the vacant hole that was left open when I left the church. I was never happy with the catholic religion because of ill treatment by the nuns who were embittered and cruelly repressed women who took their vengeance out on the children in their care. They wanted me to become a nun because I am named after St Theresa but I would have none of that, my experiences with nuns never engendered a vocation to leave the world behind. When I resisted and fought against their cruel treatment, I was told I had the devil in me. My answer to them was, me, a child of five and you a person of God punishing me for not eating my jungle oats that I had puked in because the porridge was oversalted and I was being forced to eat it puke and all. To my five year old mind they were the devil and had the devil in them. These episodes of repression and cruelty only made me more determined to find out all I could about myself, my world, my religion, and every other religion I could over the years.
You will need to learn about which religion is best for you, and if it fills the obvious gap in your spirit you are wanting to fill.

I have spoken to Jews, Islamics,Catholics,Hindus and people from most of the known religions, and the not so well known religions and each person believes that their religion is the 'right' religion. There is no right or wrong religion, when you find the right one that fills the hole in your spirit that is now opened, you will know and be spiritually whole.

What might help you to answer your own question is: Be as curious as you can, find out all you can, learn all you can, speak to as many different religious leaders as you can, but each person has their own perspective and will convince you that their religion is the 'right' one as it is their belief. Each politician will convince you that they and their party alone is the one you must join, as they believe in the party. This is all lip-service used to convince people, saying: do not do as I do, do what I say, and believe my lies, as I am right because of my position of power, as a priest, bishop, nun, rabbi,iman, senator, governor, king, queen, dictator or anyone in power.

Learn,study, read up, use the internet to educate yourself. You will know when you have learned enough. Each of us carry our own God within us, and our aim and purpose in life is to feed our spirit, which is the god in us, and to find out what our purpose in life is. I found mine late in life, well not too late, as I always loved reading and poetry and the written word. I am now a writer, and have been one since the age of 50, for the last 10 years, and every day I feed my spirit, listen to my inner voice which guides me and do what I can to deserve my time and space on this earth by being of service where I can, and writing, living a life of gratitude which is difficult, but I persevere. I do not believe that when I die I will go to heaven, I make my own heaven on earth, as some make their own hell by envy, greed, sloth, vengeance, hate, always wanting more. We all want happiness, but it is not a destination it is a journey, and we can choose to be happy or sad. Like I say, choice and a name are all we own, use your choices wisely as with choice comes commitment, consequences which affect our lives as well as those of others closest to us.
I do hope you find your answers and that this has helped you to understand the question of religion more.

You will need to spend time alone with your spirit, on a retreat with yourself in meditation, and ask yourself the questions you need answers to. When you commune with your spirit, it puts you on the path to finding yourself, and your purpose and the universe then opens to make a way for you to do this. It all falls into place, because you have to know where you want to go spiritually and when you reach that higher level of enlightenment you will know. We do not always get what we want, we get what we need, is what I have discovered. I live by certain ethics and moral codes which I do not expect others to live by so the only person I have to answer to really is my spirit, my inner god, who is guiding me and of course even the people I love know I am on this spiritual journey.

It is a tough world, with many distractions and chaos reigns, so guard your spirit, as it is the essence of who you really are. Questions, never stop asking, and finding out and evaluating for yourself, as there is no right or wrong religion. Do not let anyone convince you that what you believe to be your faith is wrong, if it sustains and fills you you will feel right and not question or doubt.

Remember: To err is human to forgive is devine. We are all fallible, and will make the same mistakes over and over again, until we learn the lesson from the experience that we are meant to learn. Faith, Hope, Charity, Grace, Love, Kindness and Love are really beliefs to live by.

I do hope you find what you are looking for, as I am sure you will. If you desire the answer all you have to do is ask sincerely and with humility, the universe will hear you, and you will finally get it, maybe not in the way you expect, or when you expect, but you will know when you stop questioning your faith and believe in your God.

Cynic as I am, I have a story of faith, believe it or not: My handbag containing all my documents, (ID,Drivers Licence,Diary,a Letter, some notes) plus my purse with a little cash, bank cards, plus other items was stolen from my room, off my bed where I had left it, near an open window with burglar bars on the outside of the window. The thief used a long stick forked on the end to lift my bag off the bed. I was upset, not for the loss of the cash or purse, but for the handbag which had sentimental value,and the loss of all my original documents which would have to be replaced costing me time to renew them, which might take months (I live in South Africa, which means dealing with Home Affairs office, which is crowded with hundreds of refugees, and locals all wanting documents, the bad rep of Home Affairs offices is no joke). After telling my daughter about this and searching the whole house in case I was mistaken about where I left my bag, I said to her how I did not mind the money or the bag, I would be happy just to get my documents back. The universe heard me. The next day, Kim,my daughter got a phone call from the thief who had found her number in the back of my diary. He said he found my documents placed neatly in a pile on Salt River Station, (this is one suburb away from where the bag was stolen from) which sounded very suspicious at first, and could Kim meet him at a cafe in Salt River during his tea-break that morning. When Kim spoke to him he wanted money for the documents, which she never gave him. He asked for my number for the reward, but gave Kim the documents. Now tell me there is not a God of the Universe who listens to our prayers and answers them?
This is a true story, and the lesson I learned is: Ask, with humility, not for money, but what you really need, and my plea was answered, how, why, for whatever reason I do not know, but I am grateful for the grace given to me, to my daughter for helping me and for my faith in believing in a power greater than myself: The Universe.

Posted on Jun 30, 2012 9:38:16 PM PDT
OldAmazonian says:
Why I Am Not a Christian and Other Essays on Religion and Related Subjects

Posted on Jul 1, 2012 12:55:54 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jul 1, 2012 12:57:28 AM PDT
The two biggest occurences in history that test my faith are the Holocaust and the Jonestown mass suicide/murders of the late '70's. If God is to be a merciful God, why would he let so many innocent people perish, including sinless children ?

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 6, 2012 1:09:53 PM PDT
Brian says:
God did not "let" anything happen. God is not going to interfere into anything that is human creation until humans learn the lessons of selfishness and power struggles.

Right now even you are not aware that the problem of Holocaust is not just the Holocaust, but something much deeper... same for Jamestown. When we finally learn it, it will not happen any more. Until then, people will still support evil and wonder "what happened" (neither of the two events would have happened without overwhelming support). We would all like it to be as simple as banning "hitlers" from this world, but I can assure you we have many hitlers among us right now and most people adore them. They are getting prizes, important positions in governments, they are rich, respected, famous authorities on various subjects and people are in awe with them.
That means there will be more Holocausts and Jamestowns in the future. People have not learned much at all unfortunately.

Posted on Jul 6, 2012 3:05:53 PM PDT
PM says:
Chanakya & apolitical...I too was raised Roman Catholic and deeply indoctrinated both at home and in Catholic schools my whole childhood - until I went off to college. Once on my own I did some deep thinking about God and religion. I concluded the same thing you did...that all the believers of all the religions think THEIRS is the one, true religion. They simply can't all be right, but yet they all profess to be the only true religion. I I had a hard time believing in a religion that uses the threat of eternal damnation to keep it's members in line. I have come to believe that it is all a man-made fairy tale that so many people hang on to, but it is only a crutch for the people that can't face the fact that they are mortal beings who will eventually die. They will cease to exist - a hard concept for us all-important humans to accept, but I believe it is a fact. People can easily accept that a dog, pig or horse dies, decomposes and returns to the earth from which they came. But they deem humans such superior beings that they are deserving of some unimaginable reward in an "afterlife" for living a good life. (And even weirder is the Muslims' idea heaven...72 virgins to deflower!! Yea!) I agree that living a good life has its own rewards here on earth for the good person and those whose lives he touches. And likewise, living a bad, evil life reaps an unhappy and miserable existence for the evil person and those he targets. I encountered so many hypocrites in my 12 years in Catholic schools...priests that were pedophiles, taking pre-pubescent boys on trips, abusing altar boys, priests dating high school girls, nuns dating priests, butch nuns dating eachother...and by dating, I don't mean going out on dates!! You know what I mean. Anyway, all this hypocracy adds up to my losing respect for 99% of the clergy that were supposed to be setting an example of model moral behavior for us students to emulate. And that in no way is limited to the Catholic religion...all religions have similar hypocracy amongst their clergy and members. I took a few "comparative religions" courses in high school in addition to the required Catholic religion classes...each religion we studied (all the major world religions) seemed every bit as bizarre and hokey as the Catholic faith, and some even more so. I wondered, if man created all these religions, why would I take what "they" proclaim as a fact when "they" are just another human like the rest of us? The fact is, no one has ever returned from the dead to verify that there is a heaven or hell. So how do they know what they speak is correct and true? The simple answer is: they don't. It is merely a guess and a hope, just like any other guess and hope. You can believe because you want to believe it - much like Santa Claus - you could still believe in him if you wanted to - people would think you were a little off, but hey. Believing in a religion - any religion - is a choice, but it works a lot better if you are totally immersed and indoctrinated as a young child and thoroughly brainwashed. I was taught that it was wrong to even question any of the beliefs we were spoon-fed. To a child, the fear of eternal punishment in hell is a pretty good deterrent for keeping you from questioning your religion. Anything that has to be forced on people before they are even old enough to think for themselves can't be a good thing. I don't buy it for the same reason I wouldn't buy anything from a pushy used car salesman...if it is something of value that I would want, you don't need to force it on me. I have seen plenty of evil in people who claim to be religious, Christian, whatever, and I think it makes a good cloak for evil people to hide behind. That way it catches victims off-guard, making them easier to manipulate since they assume they are dealing with a moral, trustworthy "religious" person. Sorry folks, but I don't buy any of it. But that doesn't mean I'm not a good, moral person. I would put the moral, upstanding life I lead up against that of most regular churchgoers I know...

Posted on Jul 15, 2012 5:47:09 AM PDT
PWR says:
The story in this book will likely really resonate with you on this particular subject - The Space Between - An Inspirational Tale of the Journey Out of the Ego-Mind and into Spirit

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 16, 2012 2:04:39 AM PDT
apolitical says:
PM, another original and independent thinker! We all come to our truths through our experiences in life, and yes, so much treachery is hidden behind a cloak of 'religious fanaticism'. Thank you for your reply to my post, as it is a lonely profession trying to be true to your beliefs and what you have discovered about your faith. I replied to another post on this same subject on G+ and the anwer I got was that because I was so hurt by the treatment of the nuns I should not let that sour me for life on the catholic faith! I replied that I was not trying to dissillusion the original poster on her faith, just giving her the benefit of what I had learned from my experiences. But what I have learned is that everything happens for a reason, the cause and effect syndrome. I would rather take Einstein as a religious leader as he was true to himself. Our experiences are there to guide us on our path to finding who we really are, and to find our purpose in life. I would like to be able to discuss in depth what you have learned, as being a writer I am very interested in the human experience as perceived and experienced personally.

In reply to an earlier post on Jul 24, 2012 7:20:45 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Jul 24, 2012 7:24:07 AM PDT
Hello Robert, I agree with Brian also

Consider this:

As one who believes,
death is not bad, when you die, you go to be with God.
Yes the holocaust and mass suffering and suicide are among some of the most horrible things that MEN have perpetrated upon other human beings here on earth.

But, to one who believes death is not the end, think about those kamikaze? They give up their lives because they believe that God and heaven await them. Ready to go.

As we live on this side of heaven, we can forget, only seeing the evil that is present with us.

Those innocent lives are not lost...the innocent are with God and live in perfect peace and love. They are free from the pain and death of this world. To perish, is to leave the earth only, not cease to exist.

Once you are no longer on this earth, you will no longer be subject to evil men who will do you harm. Remember it is at the hands of men that the evil is carried out. Not by Gods hand.
He rescues, sometimes here and sometimes that rescue is death- to be taken from here to be with God himself.

You are accusing a God whom you do not believe in of things he has not done. Death is sometimes the merciful answer, for men will not stop doing evil, causing pain and suffering of others.

Be angry and at the MEN who commit these atrocities.
This is where the vengeful God comes in...he will avenge the mistreatment and murder of the innocent.
And they are rescued!

In reply to an earlier post on Aug 8, 2012 9:31:23 AM PDT
You may be correct but Jewish clergy are styled "rabbi," which means teacher, presumably with the function of teaching the uneducated. Other religious leaders in Christianity and Islam have titles which mostly mean "elder" or "leader." The term "priest" does not have the older meaning as intermediary between god and man. These distinctions are important.

Posted on Aug 8, 2012 10:34:06 AM PDT
ZombieDiva says:
Angelmyst, think for a moment. Why would God be vengeful against something HE MADE THAT WAY?

Can you answer this? If God was really an omniscient being, he'd already know that his creation would fail him. He'd already know they'd commit sin. He programmed them that way! If he made everything, and knows everything, then why get upset and act in a vengeful manner? And don't give me that "free will" excuse. Even if he did do that, it proves God isn't so brilliant, and has failed miserably. He's flawed.

Religion was created by man to teach morality, plain and simple. There is no God at all. But it's a nice story to teach others in order to help others cope in life, and that's about the extent of it. A book written by MAN, inspired by MAN.

Posted on Aug 8, 2012 10:36:04 AM PDT
ZombieDiva says:
Oh, and if you're going to talk about God being vengeful and seeking retribution on behalf of innocents, can you point out just one example of this happening? NOT from the fairy tale, but a real life event.

In reply to an earlier post on Aug 8, 2012 1:33:19 PM PDT
Hola,
God made man with choice, we get to choose, behave or not, good or evil, sometimes life or death. His vengeance will be on judgement day. That is sure. I do understand wanting to blame God for the flaws, but its really all us. The culture today, really more than ever, assumes no personal responsibility for their own actions, so the reasoning doesn't surprise me. If you (not you specifically) don't believe in God, you blame your parents, society, the government, etc....
We do not need "religion" to know right from wrong. God has written that on our hearts. That is why those who never hear the gospel, will still be allowed into heaven. We all have this knowledge inside us.
No man would say: Love your enemies and bless those who curse you. That alone proves God wrote it, IMHO :) ----><>*

In reply to an earlier post on Aug 8, 2012 1:49:04 PM PDT
Albert Einstein believed.

Posted on Aug 8, 2012 6:23:06 PM PDT
ZombieDiva says:
Angelmyst, I didn't ask for your opinion. And you are willfully ignoring what I posted. IF God is all knowing, omniscient, he'd know we would fail him. Christians always pull out their handy dandy excuse of "free will", but it doesn't cut it. God is a failure, a loser, and he hasn't avenged anyone. And he never will, because he is make believe.

In reply to an earlier post on Aug 9, 2012 7:18:18 PM PDT
[Deleted by the author on Aug 9, 2012 7:22:35 PM PDT]

In reply to an earlier post on Aug 9, 2012 7:18:55 PM PDT
[Deleted by the author on Aug 9, 2012 7:21:48 PM PDT]

In reply to an earlier post on Aug 9, 2012 7:21:08 PM PDT
why is ZombieDiva so angry and vengeful......
I erred undoubtedly...ooops, its that pesky human condition again :)

like when you are a very small child, about 12 months old and your pulling up on the furniture and falling back down, trying to learn to walk...why do our parents let us do that, fall down again and again and again...those parents are all just failures and losers, they should never let us try, they shouldn't have given birth to us in the first place, they KNEW babies can't walk (silly) until ta da ta da...we finally learn to walk on our own!!!! (He also knows, that one day, we will quit falling down also!!!!!)
XOXO ><>
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Discussion in:  Self-help forum
Participants:  14
Total posts:  38
Initial post:  Jun 27, 2012
Latest post:  Aug 16, 2012

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