The DS is the most popular system on the planet right now and it's getting the lion's share of RPGs. I don't see how you can make the argument that the RPG genre is dead when it's quite obvious the opposite is the case.
As for your distaste for the DS, I can't really help you there. I will say, however, that most RPGs for the system do not require the use of the stylus so that shouldn't deter you in the least. Also, I assume you sleep at some point. That would be a good time to charge the system. Just a helpful hint!
Personally, I'm thankful that the DS (and the GBA before that) has ignited a revival of sorts for old-school RPGs. In response to your final statement, I'll just say that great RPGs belong on any platform they can get released on regardless of what it is.
I kind of agree I pretty much play nothing but RPGs and I've been noticing that there seems to be a decline on the number of RPGs being released on the different consoles. There were hardly any released last year that weren't remakes. I just hope that 2009 fares better for the RPG fans out there no matter what console they are released on.
Actually, I find the DS to be my favorite system to play RPGs. Even though console RPGs can be nice, there's something about handhelds that are perfect for the genre (especially old-school RPGs). The DS is probably my favorite system right now. The more RPGs come to the DS, the happier I will be. DS games are cheaper than console games, they typically have great control schemes, and having two screens can be very helpful for displaying extra info (such as maps or stats). I think the DS is the optimal RPG system.
In response to your first sentence, Christine, I've thought about that as well. I think that might have something to do with the fact that game companies take a great risk every time they pour money into a big console RPG that takes enormous resources and staff to create. If that console RPG doesn't sell well, then their investment is a failure. If they make it for DS, the risk isn't nearly as huge because they didn't have that much going into it.
I at first was wondering why the good RPGs are only coming out on the DS and not the Wii, but then it hit me. I can play the DS while my wife is watching her shows, and everyone is happy. It would be nice if the screen was a little bigger, but I guess that is what the DSi is for. Anyway, I hope they make Final Fantasy VI for the DS, that is my favorite game of all time.
To the last poster, Dragon Quest VI will be coming out for DS probably sometime next year. As far as the topic goes, lets look back at past Dragon Quest/Warrior Games. When Dragon Quest VII came out for the PS, Enix could of made it have awesome graphics, but did it? No. The quesiton is why? I truly believe the DS is the BEST platform for Dragon Quest games for the simple fact that it is able to keep the spirit of Dragon Quest in it's graphics. Someone mentioned the reason for Square-Enix putting Dragon Quest games on the DS is because they can make more money that way. I don't agree. Why? Look at the sales figures for Dragon Quest games released on both the PS2 and the DS. Dragon Quest 8 has made over 4 million dollars worldwide, while Dragon Quest 4 has only made a little over 1.4 million. Some may argue this is because Dragon Quest 8 has been out longer. Well truth is Dragon Quest 8 made 2.2 million in it's first week! That's way more than Dragon Quest 4 has made up until today! I believe we are going to see Dragon Quest V, VI, and IX on the DS because the simpler graphics give the Dragon Quest developers exactly what they want. Remember Dragon Warrior VII and you will see whats going on.
I think the reason that Dragon Quest 8 did so good is more because it was a brand new game altogether in Japan and the US. DQ IV for the DS is not new for Japan, so it wasn't going to be nearly as big of a deal as a brand new DQ game for them. And they are the main audience for this series.
I honestly have to say I love playing rpgs on the DS, I've been able to experience a different generation of console games I totally missed out on as a kid, due to my parents strict view on video games.. So playing FFIV, FFVI Advance, Chrono Trigger, Dragon Quest IV, and now DQ V, is just pure bliss. I have no trouble playing on this system though, and the power never runs out, because I dim the screen down a notch and it last forever, and just charge it when I go to bed at night, and the best thing is that I take my DS with me where ever I go. I enjoy playing rpgs on the consoles aswell, but I don't have as much time with the consoles, I finished Persona 3 3-4 months ago and then picked up persona 4 and have maybe just had about an hour or two with it and just haven't had the time to get into it, it'll get on the back log for me, and honestly it's because Chrono Trigger and DQ and all these other games are much more accessable to me. I work a job that allows me to pretty much play ds off and on all day long so it works out perfectly.
Here's something to think about when it comes to RPGs. The "J"RPG is a pretty popular genre... but primarily in Japan, yes? Well, with the three major consoles not exactly doing so hot in Japan (with the Wii being the only one that has sold a substantial amount) there's no way the success of the RPG genre in and of itself can be assured on the bigger consoles when in Japan they're not doing so well, and in America the JRPG just isn't that immensely popular to the point where they're assured, beyond a reasonable doubt, sales. So why wouldn't you put them on a system which has colossal appeal? This DS isn't just the most popular console in Japan (where it has sold more than the 360, Wii and PS3 combined), but on a worldwide scale. For one Wii that sells... two DS are sold. For everyone one 360 sold there are FOUR DS's sold. For every one PS3 sold there are FIVE DS's sold.
In short, it's about Japan as much as it is about the rest of the world. For this particular genre, it assures that it has a chance to thrive. Look at how the JRPG has performed on consoles. Despite having some good games like Tales of Vesperia or Valkyria Chronicles out, there's not the slightest chance they'll ever hit sales like the latest Dragon Quest (well, in Japan, even in America Dragon Quest VIII didn't hit the million mark, but it still sold very well!) or Final Fantasy. Even with Tales of Vesperia causing a temporary sellout of the 360 in Japan, it still hasn't even hit the million mark. That's bad for a console. The PS3 hasn't even outsold the Gamecube in Japan... and the Gamecube only sold 4 million in Japan. Around that much, anyway. The PS2 was juggernaut, it thrived on JRPGs so it was a system that people wanted to put a JRPG on. With no system really thriving in Japan (I guess you could say the Wii is, but many developers of JRPGs have expressed they don't have a big interest in developing for the Wii, but that'll change I hope) and the JRPG just not selling well here, there needs to be a way to keep the genre going strong. And on the handheld it actually does that. The remakes of the Dragon Quest games, Final Fantasy III and IV and Chrono Trigger did far better than they could've ever hoped on one of the big consoles. Just the same: "The World Ends With You" might not have done that well had it been on a console. All I'm saying is, the developers know where their biggest audience lies. And it just so happens it can thrive on the DS because there's a much bigger install base, which means there's much better potential. Remember, the JRPG is popular in America, but in spite of that, the genre is very Niche. And with the rise in Western RPGs you're starting to see the popularity of the JRPG decline a little bit in North America.
As for Dragon Quest IV not selling as well as Dragon Quest VIII... well, if you factor in the sales of Dragon Quest IV on the DS, PSX and NES combined, Dragon Quest IV completely stomps over Dragon Quest VIII. That's a game that, in Japan, is considered the best of the series (aside from maybe Dragon Quest III). So while Dragon Quest VIII sold 2.2 million in it's first week, Dragon Quest IV was even bigger when it first dropped down in a time when video games were less popular. And don't think that 1.4 million isn't a lot. I assure you if Dragon Quest IV had been released on the PS3 or the 360 you wouldn't have seen that many units of the game sold because the potential for it to do that well is significantly decreased. 1.4 million is definitely much better than what you'll get otherwise.
I don't mind handheld RPG...but I think they're picking the wrong handheld. DS is great if you want to use Action Replay, but horrible if you want the best experience possible. Star Ocean occupies more of my time than any DS RPG has.
"As for Dragon Quest IV not selling as well as Dragon Quest VIII... well, if you factor in the sales of Dragon Quest IV on the DS, PSX and NES combined, Dragon Quest IV completely stomps over Dragon Quest VIII."
With all due respect I was talking about would Square-Enix have made more money if they released Dragon Quest 4 on the PS2 rather than the DS. My arguement was yes they very well may have. Of course I didn't factor in the cost of development. So my arguement doesn't hold much water there. You bringing up how much money Dragon Quest 4 has made in the past doesn't matter. It has nothing to do with what i was saying. Please read my post over again and you will see that. How much Dragon Quest 4 made o the DS has the ONLY relevancy to what I was saying. I couldn't use the sales figures of the NES and PS versions since it has no relevancy. I grew up on Dragon Warrior and am well aware of the past DW 4 releases including the Japan only PS one.
No, I understand what you're saying, but I was also adding to the fact that this is what contributes to Dragon Quest IV having lower sales, it had already been released in Japan several times before. But the argument could still persists as re-releases of games almost never do as good as the standard release. My point was that Dragon Quest IV has a bigger, more dedicated following than Dragon Quest VIII, and that part of the reason it's sales on the DS are lower is because it's a reissue and not a brand new game.
Let's put it this way, let's say that instead of coming out on the DS, Dragon Quest IV came out on one of the major consoles (by this I mean, PS3, 360 or Wii)... they probably wouldn't have sold that much given that the install base for each console in Japan is not that high. In America, the Wii has sold more consoles than the PS3, 360 and Wii combined in Japan. And even though Dragon Quest VIII sold pretty well in North America, it still didn't sell nearly as well as say... Final Fantasy does in North America. It got results but not the kind of results Square-Enix was hoping to gain. Square noted that they expected more from Dragon Quest VIII in North America.
Japan is just as important as the rest of the world. The install base for the Nintendo DS is bigger than the three major consoles combined. Certainly bringing up past sales doesn't seem relevant, but remember that I brought those up to show that Dragon Quest IV still has staying power. That simply being that Dragon Quest IV is a re-release and re-releases rarely, if ever, sell that well. For the remake to sell as much as it did (and it's a remake of a remake, mind you)... that's pretty good.
To put it simply, if Dragon Quest VIII had been a reissue instead of a brand new game it might not have sold quite so many units in Japan or America for that matter. For a reissue of a game (especially a JRPG) to sell 1.4 million is a really big accomplishment.
And don't think that just because I brought that other stuff into the equation that I didn't see what your original post was entailing. I did. That doesn't mean I can't add to the discussion. I'm not sure why you assume that I didn't see that. My comparison was simply that: If you DO look at it that way, Dragon Quest IV has sold more. It didn't have to be a direct response or even directly relevant to what you were saying. It was just food for thought. It may not have been the smartest thing to say (I admit that) but that doesn't mean that I'm saying it was in anyway relevant to what you were saying. If that's the case then I could easily say that your response is irrelevant because you responded to that part of the post, but not the rest of the post which deals with the fact that the JRPG is very important in Japan and that it wasn't released on the console because Dragon Quest does better in Japan and therefore putting it on one of the three current major consoles (PS3, 360 or Wii) would harm Square-Enix more so than not.
In short, releasing Dragon Quest IV on any of those systems would not guarantee sales of Dragon Quest IV where they're really needed: Japan. And despite Dragon Quest VIII selling well in America, the series isn't popular enough for them to really put a whole lot of faith in it. Within this generation of consoles the number of successful JRPGs on the three big consoles can be counted on one hand, and by that I mean the ones that have seen results for Japan. Ones that have notable sales figures. In short, they're good games but the JRPGs on the DS are the ones that have been getting results. Not the PS3, 360 or Wii.
To add to this argument, Dragon Quest V was reissued on the PS2 in Japan... in the PS2's prime and it sold less than the current remake of Dragon Quest IV on the DS, and the PS2 was, at the time, a "major console." I'm not saying your argument has no validity, I'm just saying that it is possible that yes, they profit more by going with the system that has a bigger install base. It isn't unrealistic to think that they're putting these Dragon Quest remakes on the DS to get a profit. And so far, as far as sales show anyway, it's not a bad move on Square-Enix's part. Dragon Quest IV wouldn't have sold this well had it been on the PS3 and it DEFINITELY wouldn't have sold this well on the 360. Not unless there was a sudden boom of Dragon Quest loyalty in America, and there hasn't been.
Yo Dal, what kind of Job allows you to play games all day long huh? Don't tell me you are the engineer that all you need to do is write a program and let it run for the rest of the day to crank out the results while in the mean time you can play games elsewhere, hahaha
By looking at Square-Enix' history, all the mega hit titles are released only on the most popular console in Japan. Such as Famicom, Super Famicom, Playstation and Playstation 2. It is until recently that Microsoft had some specific agreements with Square-Enix to release JRPGs on XBOX 360 exclusively to boost 360's sales. However, the most popular system in the world is DS, next is Wii, PS2, etc. However, the developer clearly knows that Wii is not a good system to release their high profile games with powerful graphics technology. So what makes Square-Enix move on to develop games for DS more? It's because most of the titles that are released for the DS are either remakes or titles that are popular but emphasize on gameplay instead of graphics. The World Ends with You is the best example it's very innovative but doesn't require powerful 3D graphics. Dragon Quest IX on DS is a surprise to me, but I guess DQ has a reputation for younger kids or those adults are DQ fans since NES era. Square-Enix possibly decides that DS is the best system to for Dragon Quest to infiltrate the young ones to keep up the franchise popularity. Coz DS remember has the largest install base worldwide.
Regarding to high system requirement RPGs, we have Final Fantasy 13 that is going to be released on all platforms, DS, PSP, Wii, PS3, and XBOX 360. Each platform has their own unique perspective of the FF13's epic world. It's like world war 2, the PS3 and XBOX 360 versions emphasize on Asian conflict while PSP version for example is concentrated on another group of people in Europe as an analogy.
RPGs are alive and well and thriving... in Japan. The problem is that the games that sell best in America are all first-person shooting wargames and Grand Theft Auto. That's all American teens want to play. Everyone's all about Halo and SOCOM Navy Seals and the like. The patience and fantasy-proneness required to enjoy an RPG just aren't our bag, baby. Killing and raping and drugs and crime are all the awesomest thing ever to American gamers. Think about the famous RPG themes, like Chrono Trigger/Cross, Breath of Fire, the Dragon Quests, the Final Fantasies... they're all to bubbly and positive and warm and kind for us. Not enough awesome death and blood. The darker, 1st person RPGs might fare better. But the old-fashioned, turn-based, magical-land RPGs are not for us.
Plus, to the degree that anyone wants to play those, they only want to do so as MMORPGs, where they can name their characters "DonkURMomma82" or "Weedluvr420" and player kill everyone when they're not developing time-intensive online relationships with people they don't know.
So, yeah. RPGs are not US moneymakers, and as such, won't be pursued on the high-end consoles where time and $$ must be spent on superb graphics. Instead, they're all ported to the DS, where they're cheap to shell out and require little effort. Don't think that there aren't ANY really cool this-gen RPGs out, though! There are! ... Just in Japan, though. Sorry! Go learn Japanese and move there. Otherwise, learn to be dark and mean and slaughter innocents for fun from a first-person perspective and think that bad = good. That's the American Gamers Way.
Well, I for one, agree with the topic creator. While I love my DS and love being able to play anywhere, I still believe in having RPG's on consoles. My favorite RPG's are Final Fantasy VI, VII, VIII, IX, X and X-2 and they all are so awesome to see on the regular TV screen. I couldn't imagine playing them on a handheld. I feel that they should continue making RPG's for both consoles and handhelds.
I agree with Joy....75%, I say that becuz I absolutely LOVE my DS Lite, not just for DS RPG games, but also for the GBA port to which I can play classic RPG's such as Zelda, Link, SMB and DK Country's that I played and can STILL play on my NES & SNES consoles...IF....yes....here's where I have a problem.....IF I wanna sit in my bedroom alone and play or fight hubby for the TV! So, that's why I love my DS, I can sit here and play it while he is watchin TV and yea, I can do both, but also, I take my DS EVERYWHERE I go! It would be nice if they continued to make RPG's for consoles....but I, for one, sure hope they keep making them for the DS too! It's only obvious tho, that these companies are out to make $$, so they're gonna keep making the games for whichever unit sells the most, wether it be console or handheld! In this case....the DS....hooray!