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Men Against Fire: The Problem of Battle Command
 
 
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Men Against Fire: The Problem of Battle Command (Paperback)

by S. L. A. Marshall (Author) "IN THE early years of World War II, it was the common practice of public spokesmen in the United States to magnify the role of..." (more)
Key Phrases: active firers, minor tactics, tactical forces, World War, United States, Major General (more...)
3.4 out of 5 stars See all reviews (10 customer reviews)
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Editorial Reviews

Review
"This is one of the great volumes on fighting published since World War II and should be required reading for every staff officer as well as every combat officer of the arms which fight on the ground. It deserves a place among the really great volumes on combat and command".

Military Affairs

About the Author
S. L. A. Marshall served in World War I and then embarked in a career in journalism. In World War II, he was chief combat historian in the Central Pacific (1943) and chief historian for the European Theater of Operations (1945). He is the author of World War I, Blitzkrieg, Armies on Wheels, The River and the Gauntlet, and Pork Chop Hill. END

Product Details

  • Paperback: 224 pages
  • Publisher: University of Oklahoma Press; 1 edition (September 2000)
  • Language: English
  • ISBN-10: 0806132809
  • ISBN-13: 978-0806132808
  • Product Dimensions: 7.9 x 5.4 x 0.7 inches
  • Shipping Weight: 10.6 ounces (View shipping rates and policies)
  • Average Customer Review: 3.4 out of 5 stars See all reviews (10 customer reviews)
  • Amazon.com Sales Rank: #446,888 in Books (See Bestsellers in Books)

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Inside This Book (learn more)
First Sentence:
IN THE early years of World War II, it was the common practice of public spokesmen in the United States to magnify the role of the machine in war while minimizing the importance of large forces of well-trained foot soldiers. Read the first page
Key Phrases - Statistically Improbable Phrases (SIPs): (learn more)
active firers, minor tactics, tactical forces, junior leaders, live targets, moral incentive
Key Phrases - Capitalized Phrases (CAPs): (learn more)
World War, United States, Major General, Central Pacific, General Staff, Civil War, Infantry Division, Omaha Beachhead, First Battalion, Marcus Aurelius
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14 of 17 people found the following review helpful:
4.0 out of 5 stars Pioneering Analysis...in 1947, Today: Little Value!, January 14, 2005
First published in 1947, S.L.A. Marshall's "Men Against Fire" argues that in spite of long-range nuclear weapons, the next war of nations will not be a push-button war. Rather, individuals engaging each other on the battlefield will again provide the mainstay of a total war even more destructive than World War II. Obviously, Marshall did not foresee the advent of limited wars in Korea and Vietnam just around the corner. Nevertheless, Marshall poses some thought provoking questions of Americans in combat. In a highly controversial claim based on questionable research, Marshall concludes that in World War II, only one-in-four soldiers fired his rifle in combat. Marshall claims to have "personally" conducted mass interviews with approximately 400 infantry companies in the Central Pacific and European Theaters immediately following important battles (If you are doing the Arithmetic, approx. 200 men per company x 400 companies, you're getting the idea!). Not one platoon, company, or battalion commander, argues Marshall, was aware that only twenty-five percent of soldiers engaged in combat fired their weapons. As a result of his findings, Marshall then campaigned for the need of new training methods for infantry soldiers. He stressed, this individual training should be based on long-term psychological camaraderie, not the quick turnover replacement system that was utilized during World War II. Marshall's un-refuted claims (until recently) have influenced a generation of military historians including T.R. Fehrenbach and Russell F. Weigley. Marshall is quick to point out that the alleged seventy-five percent of those who did not shoot were not shirkers or meanderers. These men were on the front line with their assigned units and often performed other essential tasks relating to combat duty. When the confusion and chaos of a fire fight ensued, however, they just did not shoot their weapons. Marshall rejects the reason most often used for not firing, that of giving one's position away. Instead, Marshall contends it is just a gut-level fear that prevents these men from firing at the enemy. Fears of letting down one's comrades were also prevalent among the interviewees. Most importantly, however, Marshall found "that fear of killing, rather than the fear of being killed, was the most common cause of battle failure in the individual, and that fear of failure ran a close second." Predictively, Marshall does not cite any of his evidence and his less than scientific methods have been widely refuted in recent decades. However, the questions that he poses about the psychological makeup of an American in combat have some merit. It is widely agreed by military professionals that two years is enough time to adequately train an individual for combat. Yet given the uniquely American dependence on the citizen soldier, is this time period sufficient to turn an ordinary civilian into an effective combat soldier? Is an American conscript morally and ethically suited for this role? Is there a solution other than Marshall's proposing that units train together and stay together with a tight knit cadre of officers and non-coms that would provide the basis of moral support all through training and eventual deployment in combat? In hindsight, one such inception, "Operation Gyroscope" in the late 1950s was a complete failure. It is the thought provoking answers to these questions that make S.L.A. Marshall's book a significant addition to any bookshelf, though its viewpoints are severely dated and controversial.
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21 of 28 people found the following review helpful:
5.0 out of 5 stars The Proof is in the Pudding, November 13, 2003
By A Customer
I love this book. I've quoted it in articles and still recommend it to anyone currently in Army leadership training, especially PLDC or OCS. It's on my shelf with Keegan's "Face of Battle" and Grossman's "On Killing."

The criticisms of Marshall are entirely baseless. One example: a critic here claims that in the 1970s, veterans retiring from service disagreed with Marshall, claiming that his statements about low rates of fire in WII ("only 15-25% of riflemen actually fired their rifles in combat") MUST be untrue, because... well, because the rate was over 90% in Vietnam (which is the conflict a soldier would have retired from in the 1970s). None of these critics seem to notice that they were the beneficiaries of a training system based on Marshall's book, precisely designed to raise their rates of fire!

The Army applied the lessons Marshall wrote down, and the result was exactly what Marshall predicted.

His observations seem commonsense, but we have to remember that WWII began with a US Army completely unprepared for modern combat. They were still making some things up as they went.

An example of his findings: four men in the dark, who stay in communication and coordinate their weapons, will not panic as often as four men in daylight who make no effort at teamwork. You can prove this to yourself playing paintball. In fact, there is no better predictor of small-unit success.

As for the supposed "lies," such as not being present at D-Day: these are based on flimsy paper evidence ("floaters" like Marshall can often out-travel their paperwork), as well as personal attacks (I'm thinking specifically of Col. Reeder, whose own observations emphasized tactical individual success - but interestingly enough, Reeder found an average of ONE such "pointer" per platoon, which suggests a fire rate LOWER than Marshall's!)

If you want to know how men act under fire, this is one absolute necessity for your bookshelf.

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20 of 27 people found the following review helpful:
3.0 out of 5 stars SLAM Is Overrated, January 17, 2003
By Ryan M. Crosby "clamchowdah222" (Pyongtaek, South Korea) - See all my reviews
As a primer for military knowledge, SLA Marshall's Men Against Fire is recommended reading for both the US Army and the USMC. His information is regarded as factual and authoritative, because he "was there". The reality of SLA Marshall is a little different.

From Dave Hackworth's "About Face", the truth about SLA Marshall can be seen. Marshall wasn't present for D-Day as he claims, and wasn't present in the European Theater until July of 1944. His service in Korea covered exactly three months (Dec 1950- Feb 1951), and was as a historian only, not a combat soldier.

"Veterans of many of the actions he 'documented' in his books have complained bitterly over the years of his inaccuracy or blatant bias..," Hackworth writes. "He didn't seem to care that what he wrote was totally inaccurate and easily disproved." (pg. 584, About Face).

On Killing is a fine work that illustrates a different side of warfare, one more focused on the after-effects of warfare and the stress resultant from the taking life in the line of duty. Marshall's Men Against Fire is an important piece as well, if only for historical value, and as evidence of many of the lessons the Army has still not learned in the application of small unit tactics. However, for anyone to assert that SLA Marshall's information on fire volume is accurate or representative of careful fact-finding is doing a disservice to himself as well as other readers. SLA Marshall's work is sensationalized, and was designed to sell rather than inform or act as a foundation for further study.
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Most Recent Customer Reviews

3.0 out of 5 stars Men against Fire
Men Against Fire: The Problem of Battle Command

Once you read the excellent introduction, it is difficult to escape serious doubts about the methodology of the... Read more
Published 3 months ago by John C. Blount

4.0 out of 5 stars A Pioneering Study of Men under Fire...
S.L.A. Marshall spend a lifetime writing in and about the U.S. Army in conflicts from the First World War to Vietnam, and honed his writing skills as a journalist and historian... Read more
Published 8 months ago by D. S. Thurlow

4.0 out of 5 stars Good explaination of how to lead under adverse conditions
Good explaination of how to lead under adverse conditions. Older book, but most of the lessons are still true.
Published 8 months ago by Stuart Williams

1.0 out of 5 stars S.L.A. Marshall's SLAM on the American Fighting Man
Seriously!
It has been proven that this Marshall charcter grossly fictionalized most of this "research". Read more
Published on February 28, 2007 by Thorulf

5.0 out of 5 stars Marshall still rules
The negative review from "a reader in Boston" is misinformed. As Lt. Col. Dave Grossman puts it in On Killing (Little, Brown, 1996): "Some modern writers (such as... Read more
Published on July 14, 2002

1.0 out of 5 stars "Slam" was a hoax - NEVER did the interviews
S.L.A. Marshall claimed to have pioneered the technique of mass interviews of soldiers. Marshall's 1947 book "Men against Fire" argued that, in the American army, "not more... Read more
Published on May 9, 2001

4.0 out of 5 stars HQDA Recommended Reading!
This book is on the HQDA Recommended Reading list! Enjoy!
Published on September 20, 2000

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