Customer Review

488 of 524 people found the following review helpful
3.0 out of 5 stars Frustratingly Close to Being Really Excellent, August 9, 2012
Verified Purchase(What's this?)
This review is from: V-MODA Crossfade M-80 On-Ear Noise-Isolating Metal Headphone (Shadow) (Discontinued by Manufacturer) (Electronics)
First, the good news. These are a very appealing design aesthetically, have impeccable build quality, and an excellent warranty. More significantly, this extremely slick and attractive product also sounds very good, and does not take the usual thumpity-thump extreme bass distortion that is so typical to mainstream consumer headphone designs, especially the ones targeted towards the young and hip. VModa has designed a credible product that stands out in crowded field of mediocre headphones that look good and sound ordinary or worse.

That said, there are a few issues buyers need to be aware of. The immensely positive reviews these phones have received on Amazon and places like Inner Fidelity and Head Fi seem to have ignored some key concerns which I will voice to fully inform potential buyers.

First, if your hat size is L, these will barely fit. If your hat size is XL, forget it, these will not fit at all. On headphones like the Sony V6 and Shure 440, my reasonably sized head needs 6 of 10 ratchets. On the M80s, 10 of 10 fits with a bit of struggle. Those with a bigger head than mine need not bother. Yes, you could bend the headband in hopes of getting them to fit your oversized noggin, but why would you want to do this? The Phiaton MS400 and Sennheiser HD 25 are roughly the same size and can accommodate heads of all sizes pretty handily. VModa for some odd reason assumes their users are all well on the average side of cranium size.

Second, the pad that goes on your ear is too small. Again, my ears are not that huge and the HD25 covers up the whole ear nicely, but the M80 needs to be precisely centered to sound good, and then sometimes it moves a bit and needs to be re-centered. Annoying, and unnecessary. If the cups were 10 or 15% bigger, there would be no issue here.

So any other issues for those who have heads and ears that the M80s fit well? Yes, a few. First, in the only truly bad design element seen in the phones, the plug that goes into the left headphone cup needs to be removed before you store the headphones in the hard case. The bottom of the headphone does not have enough clearance for the straight connector on the plug to fit in the case still attached. Otherwise you have to bend the cable at a really sharp angle that looks like it will lead to early cable failure. The cable is high quality and sturdy, but even an excellent stress relief bend is not meant to be kept at close to a 90 degree angle for the long periods of time when the phones are sitting in the case. So this means if you take these on the bus, you first will have to take them out of the case and then connect the cable to the phones before connecting them to your device. Minor, but irritating for a set of phones supposedly designed for mainly mobile use.

All minor issues so far. But now we come to the Big Three Problems.

Problem One: The sound profile - too much accent in the mids! Bass is excellent, well controlled yet resonant when needed, quick response. The equal of the HD25, which is tough to do. Excellent for rock and metal, decent bass extension for other genres. The treble is rolled off a bit, lacks some detail at the higher end, but no real problems as many find truly accurate treble to be fatiguing. The real problem (for some music) is that the mids are boosted too much. Listening to rock where you have a mix of quiet instrumentation and vocals (e.g. The National, Lost in the Trees) the singers sound artificially forward and overwhelm the music. Listening to "Fake Empire" from Boxer on the M80 and then comparing it to the HD25s makes the piece sound like 2 completely different songs, with the M80 version sounding unnatural and unpleasant.

For other types of music where vocals are equally mixed with loud instruments (e.g. Lamb of God) there is no problem and for non-vocal or non-amplified music (jazz and classical) this is also not an issue. Most modern popular music uses studio miking where everything is mixed as coming from the center while jazz and classical recording is more positional (e.g. the drums are on the right, the bass is on the left), so I think that may explain this. This may or may not be a problem for individual users. Metal and electronica sounds really fine (probably rap and pop too though I didn't test those types), classical and jazz are decent, but less energetic vocal oriented rock (alternative) may end up sounding weird. In any case, the boosted mids mean these phones are not very accurate, which may offend audiophiles.

Problem Two: Strong competition at the price point. For roughly half the price of the M80s, the AudioTechnica M50, Sony ZX700s. and Shure 440s will thoroughly trounce the M80s. Bass is as good or better, treble handling is more accurate, and the mids are more natural sounding yet also enjoyable. If you want good sound cheaply, any of those options are superior. They are all somewhat larger phones though, none of them are quite as portable as the VModas (though the M50 does at least fold up, something that the M80s rather surprisingly cannot do), none of them look as nice, and all of them are made mainly of plastic (though very durable and good quality plastic).

If you want something more portable, the Senn HD25s and Phiaton MS400s are in the same price range and size configuration as the M80 and so are more of a direct challenge to it. Both headphones sound as good or better than the M80s, especially the MS400s which have a bit of a mid-bass boost that M80 users will like, though without also having the weird artificial over boosted mids that the Vmodas have. The HD25, though being both accurate and fun in its sound, looks drab and cheap compared to the VModas, but the MS400 is just as sexy as the M80s, sounds better, is more portable because it folds, and fits more ears and heads. It sells for less than 10% more (at time of writing) but the main issue is that the build quality is less impressive (my MS400s are a few years old and still holding up well, but they seem delicate and have a few creaks when they are flexed). Phiaton's warranty is also only half of VModas (one year instead of two), and there is no lifetime 50% off replacement deal.

So big heads and ears need not apply. Getting the M80 unpacked from its travel case and set up takes an extra few seconds. Some music genres don't work out too well with the M80s. There are cheaper or comparably priced competitors that sound better, though none that offer the added aesthetics and build quality of the VModa. Still a contender? Sure, except for...

Problem Three: No Isolation. The M80s have a little port on the back of the driver encasement. This helps them to have a nice airy soundstage, much better than the HD25s or MS400. Well and good. This means others right next to you can hear what you're listening to, though not too much. But this also means you get a lot of sound leakage coming into your music from the environment. If you listen to anything but constantly loud music (metal, some electronic) the quieter moments in your music will let in far too much external noise, even with your Iphone at 75% volume. These phones are utterly hopeless on the NYC subways for most music. Even if you don't ride mass transit, the music in a Starbucks café was getting in the way of jazz and classical and could even be occasionally heard during a Muse album, which has pretty few quiet spots. The subway is a bit of a bridge too far for everything except canal phones, but Starbucks?

Basically if you listen to any music with peaks and dips in sound level, you can only listen to the M80s at home (assuming your place is nice and quiet - in my house, the air conditioning was overpowering the sound at some points!). What is the real point of small portable headphones with awful isolation? If portability is not an issue (i.e. you are at home) why not use full size headphones that are cheaper and sound better? I guess you could use these if you were hiking in a quiet natural setting, or were in the library. Or you could listen to metal all the time and leave the volume cranked, which may have other consequences for the long term... The HD25 isolates much much better, sounds better, and costs the same. It just doesn't look as nice.

So to conclude, I wanted to like these headphones more than I did. The aesthetics and build quality of the design are impressive, and its obvious VModa is trying to give Joe Public headphones that do sound decent. The boosted mids are defensible as they make some types of music sound really good, but the poor isolation in a purported portable headphone is the main issue for me.

Sound Quality is 3 and a half stars. Build Quality and Appearance are each 5 stars. Isolation is 2 stars. I'm rounding down to three stars because the isolation problem does not reconcile well with the VModas main raison d'etre which is portability. Because these are supposed to be portable, the cups are small, the frame is small, the cord needs to be removed when carried etc, all of which cause other issues for the user. Without good isolation, these deficiencies are all exacerbated. Three stars for me. If you like metal, add a star or two.

I hope VModa will go back to the design boards and produce the M80 Mk II; ideally, it would be somewhat larger, would have a slightly more naturally tuned driver, and would get rid of the sound ports and otherwise improve isolation. The M80 Mk I is great in many ways, and comes close to being top of its class.

Testing Methods: 20-30 hours of listening to Ipad and Touch Ipod, no amp used, including about 5 hours of A/B comparisons with other phones. Music Sampled: Rock - Muse, Lost in the Trees, The National // Metal - Lamb of God, Agalloch, Opeth // Electronic - Massive Attack (Mezzanine), Lamb, Portishead // Jazz - Kind Of Blue (Davis), Bill Evans Trio, Maiden Voyage (Hancock) // Classical - Bernstein's Mahler (DG), St Saens Organ Symphony, Brahms Symphonies.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews 
Was this review helpful to you? Yes No

[Add comment]
Post a comment
To insert a product link use the format: [[ASIN:ASIN product-title]] (What's this?)
Amazon will display this name with all your submissions, including reviews and discussion posts. (Learn more)
Name:
Badge:
This badge will be assigned to you and will appear along with your name.
There was an error. Please try again.
Please see the full guidelines here.

Official Comment

As a representative of this product you can post one Official Comment on this review. It will appear immediately below the review wherever it is displayed.   Learn more
The following name and badge will be shown with this comment:
 (edit name)
After clicking the Post button you will be asked to create your public name, which will be shown with all your contributions.

Is this your product?

If you are the author, artist, manufacturer or an official representative of this product, you can post an Official Comment on this review. It will appear immediately below the review wherever it is displayed.  Learn more
Otherwise, you can still post a regular comment on this review.

Is this your product?

If you are the author, artist, manufacturer or an official representative of this product, you can post an Official Comment on this review. It will appear immediately below the review wherever it is displayed.   Learn more
 
System timed out

We were unable to verify whether you represent the product. Please try again later, or retry now. Otherwise you can post a regular comment.

Since you previously posted an Official Comment, this comment will appear in the comment section below. You also have the option to edit your Official Comment.   Learn more
The maximum number of Official Comments have been posted. This comment will appear in the comment section below.   Learn more
Prompts for sign-in
 

Comments

Tracked by 8 customers

Sort: Oldest first | Newest first
Showing 1-10 of 35 posts in this discussion
Initial post: Aug 12, 2012 11:51:58 PM PDT
J. Knight says:
Thanks for the very thorough review. I checked out all of the alternative sets you suggest in your article. Most of them aren't as attractive as the M-80; the Shures may be the one exception. The bigger issue for me though, and the thing that keeps me wanting the V-moda's, it the fact that the competition don't offer as many bonus accessories. Particularly, the in-line controls available on the M-80s. I listed to my iPhone at work, while traveling, while cutting the grass, and doing just about anything else. I frequently get interrupted w/ phone calls, and using anything other than a headset with in-line controls and a mic just becomes way too inconvenient. Even without the phone calls though, being able to easily (i.e. by feel, without having to unlock a phone, etc) ff and rw tracks while at my computer is almost a requirement. And having the ability to quickly pause the music when someone comes to my desk to talk is essential. I currently own the V-moda LP Crossfades, and the sound is excellent. Quality is also superb. If the mic on that model was better, I'd be completely happy. As it is though, the mic on the Crossfade is horrible. I am somewhat concerned by the size issue you mention though. I haven't worn a fitted hat in a while, but I think I was wearing a 7.25. My head's not overly large, but it's definitely not small. If I do go with the M80s, at least I know the warranty (as well as Amazon's customer service) is excellent.

Thanks again for the review and for the alternatives for readers to look into! Just wanted to point out that the hard case, the two Kevlar-reinforced cables (each with in-line controls, one that includes a mic), and the warranty all come only with V-moda. And of course there's the build quality/durability. I still haven't found a competitive pair of headphones that sounds as good - one that can match that price-point with those features.

In reply to an earlier post on Aug 20, 2012 2:26:16 PM PDT
Severian says:
Agreed, feature set, aesthetics, and build quality of the M80 all impress. If isolation is not a major need, and if your head will fit comfortably, these may be just what you are looking for, especially if you already like the VModa sound.

In reply to an earlier post on Aug 23, 2012 8:02:55 AM PDT
J. Knight says:
The AKG Q460 may be another option. I might pick those up to see. Price is currently about half that of the M80's.

In reply to an earlier post on Aug 23, 2012 12:51:57 PM PDT
Severian says:
I tried the non-Quincy version of these phones and found them to be way too small for my cranium. Unlike the M80s, the AKG's couldn't even fit on my head! Also, AKGs small portables are not too sturdy; I had 4 different K26s over the years - they sounded great, but broke regularly. AKG customer service was sluggish in responding and servicing the warranty claims, so I would have to say the M80 would be a safer investment.

Posted on Sep 3, 2012 4:12:19 PM PDT
mr.schlong says:
Interesting review. Most claim that the mids seemlessly work with the bass and that the highs are "polite"(a polite way of saying not presented in a balanced manner). I listened to my friends Sonyzx700 and prefer my M80's. The Sony's sounded well balanced and detailed but not as fun. They sounded conservative if that makes sense...polite across the entire spectrum. The M80's are more engaging with a more forward sound and I could feel the music more with drums that pounded as opposed to sounded. I guess it comes down to which sound sig one prefers and how ones ears interpret the sound. I do wish that the highs were a bit more present with the M80's such as cymbals. My ears are quite sensitive to brightness and will shrill with too much treble but these are just a wee bit too polite although I do hear all the detail.

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 8, 2012 2:47:19 PM PDT
A good review that encompasses the M80's flaws. I'd have to politely disagree with you on a couple of points. You say the M50s blow the M80s out of the water. I find that that is mostly up to opinion. I've listened to both, and although I can't deny that the ATH-M50s are great, their bass was underwhelming (and I'm NOT a bass head). I simply prefer the M80s sound signature. You also say that these will be hard to fit if you wear size L hats. I wear 7 5/8 inch caps (about a large, if not more) literally 24/7 and these headphones fit comfortably at 7/10 to 9/10 clicks. I never go to 10/10. The point you mentioned about the mids in these headphones being flawed in that they are too far forward. To that, I'd have to reply that, again, it's up to opinion. No two ears are the same, people have different tastes in music and sound. I've heard from many that they think the mids are actually one of M80s greatest strengths, while you bring up a good point that others may not. I, though, like the mids in the music I listen to (which is EDM, Dubstep, and House). You reflect well on the bass. It's very articulate, not overpowering at all, yet still packs a good "punch". Well, other than the points that I disagreed with, everything else seems to be correct (at least in my personal listening experience). There is very little isolation, and that the size may be a problem to people with size XL hats (though, seeing as mine fits with my hat on on less than max adjustments, that may not be the case), and that there is some mild competition. I wouldn't say strong, because some may like how the M80s sound more than other headphones (like the Senn HD25s sound). Anyways, my last point, and the reason I even replied in the first place, is because of your second to last comment, mentioning M80 MKIIs. Though I don't think V-Moda is going to come out with those any time soon, you may want to look into the VERY soon-to-be-released M100s. I've heard the ear cups are supposed to swivel on durable metal hinges and the padding is supposed to be larger. Not sure what the sound signature is like though. But I really do advise that you look into that. Hope this was helpful to people and wanted to throw it out there that people like to listen to different things, and they like their headphones differently. (Keep in mind that the music that the author of the review and I listen to are quite different).

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 10, 2012 2:32:03 AM PDT
mr.schlong says:
I agree with your thoughts regarding the mids. This is the first and only review I have read that state the mids are artificially forward. Funny, I've read reviews claiming both forward and(oddly) reserved mids, but by far most people hear as I do, which is a very balanced overall sound but with rolled off highs or an excellent mid/low end. I think the mids are excellent with natural timbre , full body and fluid. I would highly encourage anyone interested in the M80 to read reviews on Head fi forum for a more accurate general description of the sound these have. Everyone hears different and has preferences but by sheer number you can get a very accurate idea.

Posted on Oct 17, 2012 2:25:00 PM PDT
Some of his issues, while valid, are just very subjective... Some may even be a positive for others. For instance, I actually prefer slightly less isolation on my portable on ears because it allows me to be aware of PA announcements etc. If I want complete isolation I pick up my Ety IEM. If you want better isolation the Senn HD25-1 and Beyer DT 1350 will suit you better tho, just know they clamp harder.

As far as sound signature, I think the M-80's sound complements the DT 880's at home quite well but others may very well prefer the brighter nature of the HD25-1 ii... I think most people wound say the Phiaton MS400 aren't inherently better sounding tho, they're actually more bass heavy.

I'm a big fan of the easily removable cord too, makes them more durable in the long run... Given how tough they are I could remove the cord and toss them in my bag without even using the hard case (tho a bag of some sort is still a good idea). My only real complaint is that they don't collapse to take up less space, tho neither do my other choices (Senn/Bayer, tho the latter's cups do rotate).

The M-100 will be collapsible but they're also full size around-the-ears headphones so they're bulkier all around except when packed away possibly (cups are still 2x as large/wide).

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 19, 2012 12:00:19 PM PST
Severian says:
[Customers don't think this post adds to the discussion. Show post anyway. Show all unhelpful posts.]

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 19, 2012 12:02:29 PM PST
Last edited by the author on Nov 29, 2012 11:40:42 AM PST
Severian says:
I believe the M100s are also being priced at $300. A tad steep for portable headphones. If they ever end up close to the price point of the M80s, I would happily try them. Most manufacturers can make an awesome headphone for $300, but not many buyers want to spend that much.

Amended: The M100s do not seem to be reviewing well, even among critics who loved the M80s. Sort of a reversion to the LP series bass uber alles sound scheme:

http://www.headfonia.com/style-and-power-vmoda-m-100/
‹ Previous 1 2 3 4 Next ›

Review Details

Item

Reviewer


Location: new york, ny United States

Top Reviewer Ranking: 535