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Is Sanderson obsessed with Terry Goodkind?

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Showing 1-25 of 45 posts in this discussion
Initial post: Oct 12, 2011 8:25:36 PM PDT
I have never seen an author talk about another author as much as Brandon Sanderson. Specifically, he has posted countless snarky comments about Terry Goodkind on his blog, even stooping so low as to criticize the title of 'Wizard's First Rule' (as if 'Alloy of Law' is better). I first noticed this from Sanderson's feeds but now that I've dug into it all I'm just blown away at how immature this behavior really is.

What's worse is that these guys are with the same publisher (Tor NY).

I'm not the biggest fan of Goodkind but I've loved all of the RJ books and I hate to think the mantle has been passed onto someone that acts like this. Sanderson gets paid oodles of bucks to write books now and insulting other authors that helped pave the way to your good fortune isn't going to be tolerated by fans that love all of the TG's, RJ's, Martin's (and more) of the world.

Posted on Oct 13, 2011 12:03:12 AM PDT
Not seeing what you are referring to. There was a Vin vs. Zedd thing Sanderson posted earlier this year ( Is that what you're referring to? I don't think that's obsessed or even that bad really. Rude maybe but I read it as having fun with a contest and giving readers something to crow about.

Posted on Oct 13, 2011 2:01:40 AM PDT
I was just putting together a list to come back and post with. WAY MORE than just that one. It's crazy. And most of the things that he says do not seem even remotely true. Here's a few others and this is just the tip of it.

Vin versus Zedd cage match:
"'Wizard's First Rule'?" Vin asked. "I mean, really. Is it too hard to say 'The First Rule of Wizardry' or 'Wizardry's First Rule'? The way you say it sounds stupid. That's always bothered me."

Brandon Sanderson
Heh. Line from TofM said: "And Rand did such and such." Brain keeps reading "Ayn Rand." Did Goodkind sneak over and rewrite my manuscript?

Brandon Sanderson
Curiously, I find myself on the opposite side of Goodkind again. He returns to his characters as I'm leaving mine.

Brandon Sanderson
" ties back to the self-loathing I sense from a lot of fantasy authors who get big. I know I've mentioned this before, but nothing annoys me more than a writer who says something like "Well, you're right, fantasy is crap. Fortunately, I don't read or write that crap. I'm special." (I'm looking at you, J.K. Rowling and Terry Goodkind.)"

Happy news: Mistborn boxed set was the #5 in the nation last year, with Tolkien in #4 and Goodkind in #6. I can live with that placement.!/BrandonSandrson/status/22738332479913984

Yes, gay men are few and far between. But it could be much worse. See: Eddings, or worse, Goodkind and Newcomb.!/BrandSanderson/status/49664528782340096

Goodkind is...well, let's not go there. It's good, sometimes, to be anti-PC, as the world isn't PC.!/BrandSanderson/status/49665606940753921

It is an incredible experience. Goodkind time 1000 in the anti-feminist department. And it seems unconscious.!/BrandSanderson/status/49667297912160256

Brandon Sanderson
I had no idea that imaginary Terry Goodkind had cover quoted my imaginary book!

Brandon Sanderson
Mostly, my aversion to Goodkind stems from two places. First, WoT fandom and SoT fandom on-line have had kind of a 'rival teams' type of thing going on. Much of it comes from this. It's like picking the Yankees or the Mets. (And there's nothing wrong with liking both. My editor goes to both teams, and Tor publishes both WoT and SoT.) So, it's kind of a root for the home team (for me, the WoT) and not the rival. On the other side, Terry has been notoriously bad to work with in the publishing industry and has said some very divisive things to both other writers, and to fans. He kind of comes off as a jerk.

...That's just with a minimal effort. I've never seen an author so seemingly obsessed with another. What's the deal with that? Incredibly immature and really saps any enjoyment I could have about Sanderson finishing the work of RJ. He also takes random pot shots at a bunch of other authors too. It's like he's a spoiled brat lashing out at everyone around him.

Calling TG "bad to work with", "anti-feminist", suggesting he's "anti-gay", bragging about book list positioning, claiming TG hates fantasy (when he's never said that).. man the list goes on. I really hate to see it.

Posted on Oct 13, 2011 5:25:54 AM PDT
Well that is pretty messed up.

Posted on Oct 14, 2011 12:33:53 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Oct 14, 2011 1:00:30 PM PDT
Brandon liked reading Wizard's First Rule and has no trouble telling people that the first book in the Sword of Truth series is a good read. Brandon's issue with Terry stems from Terry's statements outside of his books.

Brandon spells it out pretty clearly in the quotes above. Terry Goodkind has talked about the fantasy genre and other fantasy authors exactly as Brandon says he has. There are plenty of quotes online that you can look for and see what he's talking about. Try a Google search for "Terry Goodkind quotes fantasy". (Not in quotes.)

Terry has no respect for the fantasy genre. Brandon thus has no respect for Terry. If Terry changes his tune and recognizes that Terry himself writes fantasy novels (which Terry denies), Brandon will be happy to change the way he talks about Terry.

But it's not like Brandon obsesses about Terry. He may go months between brief mentions of Terry Goodkind. He talks much more often about Terry Pratchett, but those are positive references.

Posted on Oct 15, 2011 4:49:07 AM PDT
Thank you for the reply Peter. I had to look up your name because you speak with authority yet made no effort to introduce yourself. I see that you are Brandon Sanderson's personal assistant. Ok glad you guys decided to respond to this. I appreciate the time.

With that said, everything you posted feels very disingenuous, at best.

Terry Goodkind has never said he hates fantasy. Never once. That is in fact a rumor propped up by people such as yourself and obviously Brandon Sanderson to (apparently) inflict harm on his public image without cause. Further, Terry Goodkind has never once said anything negative about another author. The same cannot be said of Brandon Sanderson, as you yourself proudly state here.

Thus, claiming to have "no respect for Terry" is completely and totally baseless.

You guys are slandering another author and claiming TG is "anti-feminist" and all of the other, forgive the pun, B.S. I linked to above, is immature, baseless, and an offense to readers -- not just TG fans either. I would only narrowly put myself into that group. But as a Robert Jordan fan and someone that loves fantasy and books of virtually all other genres, this kind of behavior is abhorrent and inexcusable.

Now, how about you guys reconsider changing that tune?

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 15, 2011 2:46:52 PM PDT
Ben Coleman says:
Seems like someone really has an ax to grind here...

When Terry Goodkind says something like "Because most fantasy is about world-building and magic, a lot of it is plotless and has no story", he can easily come across as saying "fantasy is crap".

Also, when Terry says stuff like this it further reinforces the negative impression

Haddonfield, NJ: Second Question - I've noticed similarities between your Sword of Truth series and Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time series...(Black Sisterhood vs. Black Ajah; The Order vs. The Seanchan; Richard vs. Rand both discovering their powers, both have Nameless evil Gods...etc.) I've often voiced my suspicion that these two series might be occurring on the same crazy am I?

Terry Goodkind: If you notice a similarity, then you probably aren't old enough to read my books.

Anybody in the community college mythology course I took could give the correct answer, which is that both Richard and Rand are very conventional heroes, etc and in fact have their basis in mythology, but Terry dismisses the question and insults the asker.

Posted on Oct 17, 2011 2:26:58 AM PDT
If you look around, there is a lot of criticism for Terry Goodkind on the internet that is much, much worse than anything Brandon Sanderson has said. Nothing you have posted indicates "obsession". There would have to be a lot more out there than the examples you have provided.

There is a large volume of interviews and conversations out there involving Sanderson. As a mathematical comparison to the whole, his remarks about Goodkind are a tiny fraction of a percent. At best.

In fact, what I find obsessive is that someone would seek out all these little snippets and compile them in this way. I suppose the author of this discussion is a huge Goodkind fan, perhaps copying and pasting all these "transgressions" from some Goodkind fan site. I could really care less if some author is obsessed with some other author. I really only care how they write.

Personally, I do not care for Goodkind's books. His attempts to introduce gravitas into his narrative does not hold a candle to other authors out there (Joe Abercrombie, for example) and comes off rudimentary and puerile, as if his intended audience are adolescent boys.

While Sanderson can be hit or miss with me, I've never felt like any of his books have been a waste of my time. Some of them I have recommended to friends, which I have never done with Goodkind (who's books I actively avoid). I can't say that Sanderson is my favorite, but his books are at the very least well written.

Sorry to the OP, but you posted this here, where I went looking for information about Sanderson's latest book. So if it seems I'm bashing Goodkind; I never would have if this had been posted in the discussion section for a Goodkind product. In fact, I never would have gone there in the first place.

Posted on Oct 17, 2011 10:50:08 AM PDT
Brandon hasn't seen this thread and didn't direct me to respond, but he would support my response (with the caveat that authors responding directly to criticism has created some amazing unintended humor in the past, so Brandon is justified in being wary of that sort of thing).

Brandon stands by his words, but everyone is free to form their own opinion. The interviews with Terry where he addresses these topics are numerous, verbose, and easy to find.

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 20, 2011 10:23:00 AM PDT
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Posted on Oct 24, 2011 6:48:49 PM PDT
C. Sievert says:
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In reply to an earlier post on Oct 25, 2011 9:01:28 AM PDT
Kevin Kahn says:
It seems like he does say these things...

Posted on Oct 25, 2011 4:45:29 PM PDT
[Deleted by the author on Oct 25, 2011 4:54:38 PM PDT]

Posted on Oct 25, 2011 5:00:20 PM PDT
SashaG says:
Nothing in the link Kevin posted affirms what Sanderson and his lackeys have been saying. If anything, it only further proves how ugly and untrue Sanderson's statements really are. Yep, I'm disappointed. As a fan of Goodkind, Jordan, Tor in general, and all the rest of it, this is pretty sad.

In reply to an earlier post on Oct 25, 2011 5:08:02 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Oct 25, 2011 5:08:29 PM PDT
Kevin Kahn says:
"First of all, I don't write fantasy. I write stories that have important human themes."
"Most fantasy is one-dimensional."
"Because most fantasy is about world-building and magic, a lot of it is plotless and has no story."

Excuse me Sasha?

He clearly looks down on pretty much the entirety of the fantasy genre. I'm not arguing if it is warranted or not or who is right or whose books are better, but you can't dispute the fact that he DOES say these things.

As for Jason in St. Louis. Not saying, that Sanderson isn't being petty bashing Goodkind, but it seems that Goodkind does just as much bashing (though at the entire genre instead of a single person). Using your same logic, all this time spent bashing other fantasy authors just means Goodkind is jealous right?

Posted on Oct 25, 2011 5:27:39 PM PDT
SashaG says:
Most second tier fantasy is one-dimensional. So much in fact that I've stopped diving into every book that comes my way (I write for a mid-sized blog network). How could you possibly deny this? Do you believe the opposite, that most fantasy is wonderful prose deserving of high-merit? By comparison, other genres have rules that authors need to work within -- those rules make writing a more difficult process. Thereby, other genres, seem to suffer less from the influx of new writers cobbling together derivative work in bland, one-dimensional epics.

As for the other comments, are you being intentionally daft? Goodkind is clearly expressing his interest that his writing elevate above any one genre. He's being inclusive, for chrissakes. Every author wants people to read his or her work and it's obvious from that comment that Goodkind is concerned about being pigeon-holed into a category. In context, it is painfully obvious he simply wants his work to be viewed is something greater than what most people believe is Dungeons and Dragons (yes, I cringed even writing that -- but it's true).

What is sad is that people like you and apparently a major author (Sanderson) leap on him for it and translate that into something it is obviously not ("Goodkind hates fantasy"). It smacks of elitism and is clearly an attempt to harm another author for a totally baseless reason.

Is that really what you want to defend and uphold?

Sorry, but SLANDERson is no bueno to this chica and while I knew about his bias before, I'm glad someone took the time to bring this into the light. Suspicions confirmed.

Posted on Oct 25, 2011 5:59:00 PM PDT
Kevin Kahn says:
Take a chill pill Sasha...

When did I ever actually bash Goodkind here? All I did was recopy some quotes from interviews thatclearly show he looks down on the fantasy genre in general. I never said he didn't have a right to (or that he does have a right to either). Merely said he has an elitist view of his own work with respect to the fantasy genre. If you don't believe that, then you're definitely missing something. Regardless, no smack talk here.

As for my comment on Jason, I'm arguing AGAINST Jason's logic here as opposed to arguing FOR Goodkind being jealous.

But in general, please stop looking for fights against random strangers on the internet... It's not healthy. And if you really want to argue, please at least make sure the person you're arguing against is someone who actually has the opposite viewpoint. Read the post next time and you won't embarrass yourself :/

Posted on Oct 25, 2011 6:09:05 PM PDT
Nah. This whole thread is garbage IMO.

First the original poster comes over here and starts an "I wonder --Goodkind" thread in a section about a book by Sanderson.

Then when someone responds to his pathetic pandering, he posts a long list of "transgressions" that reveal him to be an obsessed, probably neck-bearded and shut-in Goodkind fanboy.

I didn't come here for this. I wanted information about Sanderson's new book.

I'm not interested in Goodkind. This product has nothing to do with him. Go away.

Posted on Oct 26, 2011 5:31:30 AM PDT
I find it funny that people are complaining about the things Brandon said in the blog about a Suvudu cage match. It isn't real. His comments were in jest, people. I would think you would have pointed out the fact that Sanderson tweeted that TG is in so much words a mysoginist. Tweeting that he treats his female characters horribly. I don't tend to believe that but he is entitled to his opinion. This seems to be a fight between fanboys, who really need to get a life and both men are laughing all the way to the bank.

In reply to an earlier post on Nov 9, 2011 2:31:30 PM PST
Joshua, the first good post I read and I wish I could get the 3 minutes back of my life from reading this ridiculous topic. Goodkind and Sanderson enjoy them both they are great writers. Who said what doesn't matter, like any of us should judge them, since I know everyone in the world has said something about someone before. It's human nature and we are full of emotion, that's what is so great about being alive and reading books in the first place.

Posted on Nov 10, 2011 5:02:55 PM PST
Met Sanderson at a signing yesterday. He's a really nice guy. He read some of his unfinished work, had a Q&A session, and signed all of our books for us. He wasn't bureaucratic about it all. He took his time, answering questions from fans and taking pictures with them. He even gave me some specific advice on how to deal with some problems I've been having writing my own book.

Posted on Nov 11, 2011 9:25:37 PM PST
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In reply to an earlier post on Nov 12, 2011 3:53:29 AM PST
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Posted on Nov 12, 2011 8:01:14 AM PST
Mike says:
"Curiously, I find myself on the opposite side of Goodkind again. He returns to his characters as I'm leaving mine."

What is wrong with that statement? He's saying that Goodkind is returning to writing his original characters after leaving them, and he is leaving his original characters.

Dude, seriously, hop off. I'm sorry that you're so insulted by the fact that Brandon Sanderson made a few comments about Goodkind. But get over it. You're being a huge hypocrite right now by being an enormous troll and flaming him on amazon just because he doesn't like your favorite author.

Posted on Nov 13, 2011 5:10:15 PM PST
lol he even made a facebook page with the same exact wording. It's been deleted though, but you can still find it on google search.
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Initial post:  Oct 12, 2011
Latest post:  Feb 6, 2013

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The Alloy of Law: A Mistborn Novel
The Alloy of Law: A Mistborn Novel by Brandon Sanderson (Hardcover - November 8, 2011)
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