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Customer Discussions > History forum

Boycott Amazon if it doens't bar Cleo

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Showing 1-25 of 48 posts in this discussion
Initial post: Apr 28, 2012, 5:43:06 PM PDT
General Orc says:
All right I've finally had it. I spend thousands of dollars a year at Amazon.com and my money is being used to finance hate propaganda against Germans and Japanese. We all know by whom.

I was about to announce my intention to boycott Amazon last September when she "fired" herself from the history forum anyway.

She is back with a vengeance, and I am very concerned about the effect of her rantings on other unbalanced or young minds.

I find Amazon shockingly irresponsible for allowing and indeed supporting Cleo's hate speech. They have deleted posts from other posters which are in no way offensive and allow her self-described hate propaganda to fester. Please see her third post in the "Il Volo when the rightful owner finally steps forward" thread.

Don't suggest that I ignore her. I will not ignore hate propaganda.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 28, 2012, 5:56:36 PM PDT
Tammy says:
You're right, that was pretty bad. I'm German and would probably get really angry if I hadn't been so busy wondering what kind of a nut job would be ranting about Hitler and Justin Bieber in the same post.

I agree with your feelings, but I must admit that it may be more fun just watching this wacko make a complete fool of herself.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 28, 2012, 6:08:24 PM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on May 7, 2012, 11:13:34 AM PDT]

Posted on Apr 28, 2012, 6:40:41 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 28, 2012, 6:43:46 PM PDT
patrick says:
aww, c'mon, you guys, lighten up..so far as the content goes.

what I would endorse and this goes for any poster, that Clio is simply posting way too many threads and more than half of the threads should just be deleted as spam.

so I dont think there is any compelling need to delete the rantings of crazy people, but they need a cap on how many threads which are almos tall on the same tack anyway.
You should stop posting fresh threads spam, Clio..

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 28, 2012, 6:44:56 PM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on May 7, 2012, 11:13:35 AM PDT]

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 29, 2012, 3:37:16 AM PDT
Tammy says:
Oh, sweetie, don't worry. They'd still let you buy whatever you want. Money talks and can't be silenced!

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 29, 2012, 10:45:42 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 29, 2012, 11:28:48 AM PDT
Diva says:
Hello Calm Down,

Welcome to the receiving end of malicious propaganda.

This is something for you to ponder. I believe that Theo is only one of four other profiles owned by the same person.
These profiles are: Jezzie, anne, Bookish and Cleo.
The first three spread Jew hatred and Arab propaganda, while smearing and demeaning Jews and Israel. I at least have been
on the receiving end for at least four years now. These type of threads are the most active on Amazon.
I totally understand your point. At this time I think that Amazon will do nothing because there is no violation of their guidelines.

However, now I am more convinced then ever, that the owner of these four profiles I know of, is a schizo psychopath. Who needs that many profile?? And for what purpose?? The answers are self explanatory.

Posted on Apr 29, 2012, 10:56:03 AM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on May 7, 2012, 11:13:41 AM PDT]

Posted on Apr 29, 2012, 11:19:52 AM PDT
patrick says:
Clio is Bookish?????

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 29, 2012, 11:43:41 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 30, 2012, 5:19:14 AM PDT
Calm Down:

As I open the History Forum these days, I see that the topic of about of a third of the forums (or fora, as my old Latin teacher would prefer) is "You are ignoring the customer who started this discussion" I think every single one of these is from Cleo.

I also ignore her (his?) posts when they appear in legitimate, intelligent discussions, as I know the average intelligence level of even the best discussion drops noticeably when Cleo drops in.

As much as I share your exasperation with what Cleo posts, I am against banning people, even fools. I simply put them on Ignore. I now have a stable of these people. So I won't join your boycott or the call to ban Cleo, but I will advise you to do what I've done with her and all the other folks whose posts I find repulsive.

I also want to stress that I fully support the presence of people with him I often (or always) ardently disagree. In recent weeks, I've frequently given these people my Yes support votes because I feel their contrarian position contributes to the give-and-take of a round discussion round.

And who knows? Maybe Cleo will come up with a number of good, thoughtful posts. Let her rant, but ignore her when you wish.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 30, 2012, 12:08:41 AM PDT
Lientje says:
Cleo: The question, Cleo, is that you hone in on Germans and Japanese as if they are the only
ones who rape in War. War is a horrible thing, and no one should ever have to face it. To make it
worse, it often brings out the worst in people. This is NOT relegated to the Germans and Japanese
alone. And stop acting as if it were.

Posted on Apr 30, 2012, 3:23:52 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on Apr 30, 2012, 3:27:15 AM PDT
Yog-Sothoth says:
What is very telling is that there are certain posts here, and on other fora, that have been started by Cleo, and the FIRST, original post (OP) is deleted, with the note "[Customers don't think this post adds to the discussion.]"

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 30, 2012, 5:22:26 AM PDT
[Deleted by Amazon on May 4, 2012, 7:08:55 PM PDT]

Posted on Apr 30, 2012, 10:47:53 AM PDT
S. Kessler says:
What is that expression: Pissing in a windstorm? That is what you are doing if you respond to Cleo and expect a rational reply. She is unhinged, frankly. Amazon should have banned her for being disruptive long ago. Though I doubt any of your money is being used to support her incoherent ramblings.

I doubt she is any of those other posters. The style is too dissimilar and the others at least tend to post coherently, if largely reprehensibly. "Ignore" really is the best solution.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 30, 2012, 11:28:19 AM PDT
General Orc says:
Richard Lord and S. Kessler:

No, I will not ignore hate propaganda against the German people. I'm for responsible free speech but I draw the line at advocating violence, which the person we're discussing has done.

When I buy something from Amazon, I'm supporting that company. It takes money to maintain a website. That's why I say patronizing this company is supporting this forum, which gives you-know-who a soapbox from which to advocate violence against my ethnic group (people of German descent). That's why I advocate a boycott.
BTW, I agree with you, SK, that she probably isn't any of the other posters Diva mentions. I'm not aware of Bookish et al advocating violence. Correct me if I'm wrong, anyone.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 30, 2012, 11:53:36 AM PDT
Lientje says:
Cleo: "No, I am specifically reminding everyone about German and Japanese baby rapes in the MILLIONS because the Germans and Japanese are moving towards world war again"

Oh gosh, I didn't know that. Why didn't you tell me before?

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 30, 2012, 12:55:43 PM PDT
John M. Lane says:
I agree, Richard A. Lord. If nothing else, Cleo's posts remind us that people like Cleo really exist.

Who knew???? !!!!!!!

Posted on Apr 30, 2012, 2:48:55 PM PDT
On at least two occasions I caught evidence that Cleo was putting on a show.

This is just very weird performance art by someone very committed to their craft with too much time on their hands and a one-track mind. I think people should lighten up.

But, c'mon, Cleo, try to come up with a thread topic that will take in your numerous subjects so you don't piss everyone off. Maybe post one thread/day. I don't WANT you to be banned. I LIKE some crazy around here.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 30, 2012, 7:04:38 PM PDT
S. Kessler says:
I'm not saying you shouldn't be upset by Cleo's demonization of Germans (just as I get upset by the unreconstructed anti-Semites that populate these threads and Amazon doesn't ban). You have every right to want to see her gone. I am also amazed that Amazon hasn't banned her. I mean, she's not only offensive, she's an obvious lunatic. You need to complain to Amazon about her as much as you can (report abuse). That's your prerogative. I've actually tried it with some of the Jew haters here, and it's amazed me how they're just allowed to continue posting. Yet several atheists on the religion forum have been banned because there were concerted efforts by a few very vocal Christians to get them banned. I really don't know what the solution is, other than to counter hate speech with positive speech or completely ignoring the lunatic. I wish I could be more helpful.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 30, 2012, 8:08:25 PM PDT
General Orc says:
cobalt:you don't want the retard to be banned. I understand. I found her amusing for a couple of weeks last summer. Then she was so tedious she wasn't even funny any more. I ignored her for awhile. Now my fear is that she may inspire other loonies to commit acts of violence. Or something.

Posted on Apr 30, 2012, 8:10:45 PM PDT
General Orc says:
S. Kessler:

Thank you for your reply. I think you've made my point. If "a few very vocal Christians" could get some atheists banned, then those of us who think hate speech is wrong can get Cleo banned. You actually give me hope. I don't visit the religion forums, and didn't know that.

In reply to an earlier post on Apr 30, 2012, 11:47:31 PM PDT
Last edited by the author on May 4, 2012, 8:24:26 AM PDT
Calm Down:

You may have noticed on other threads that I am a keen defender of many Germans who abhor the criminal past of their country, and most of the Germans I knew during my many years there were precisely that sort. (These were folks who were either very young when the Nazis seized power or - as with most of my friends, paramours and associates - born after that war.) Also, my father's family is Alsatian, but the ethnic German Alsatians. So I do not countenance attacks upon Germans as a people or accept that there's some kind of fatal flaw in the German genetic makeup. In fact, I recently corrected a well-meaning American woman who said that she thought the majority of Germans were ignorant of the Holocaust or deniers of the attempted genocide. I even added that most Holocaust deniers I've known or read about were Americans, Britons or Eastern Europeans.

As to Cleo's advocating violence against Germans: that, I concede, is serious and should be dealt with in the most effective way - which might mean keeping a close eye on her and having any such posts immediately deleted by Amazon..

I myself have never read anything she's posted in which she has advocated any physical violence or damage to property, but - as I said earlier - I put her on Ignore a long time ago and have not read any of her posts past the first two sentences in quite a while. Most of her posts in the last year I am not even aware of.

Posted on May 1, 2012, 2:07:09 AM PDT
R. Miller says:
Calm down or go home - I agree with you. I'd really intended to stay away from this. I guess it was last summer I took on that thing that calls itself a woman's name that begins with C (I refuse to use that phony moniker), I countered its anti-Japanese garbage by writing everything positive I could think of about the Japanese. I was hoping that thing wouldn't return, but unfortunately, it did. I don't view this thing as a performance artist. One guy who commented on what I had written last year said he thought "it" might be a computer program possibly from North Korea (he did this under the title "I smell a rat." But I have no energy or time to engage this ridiculous thing whatever it is, and I agree with you, it's past high time for Amazon to block "it" from its ridiculous postings and it's absolutely ugly, smelly, disgusting, racist comments. I agree with Kessler too - report abuse. Do it frequently.

In reply to an earlier post on May 1, 2012, 2:09:28 AM PDT
Last edited by the author on May 1, 2012, 3:28:25 AM PDT
Oh, poo... don't get so hysterical. The real threat is from what the Muslims say around here, since other Muslims are raised to be sympathetic and responsive to that kind of junk. NOBODY was EVER sympathetic or responsive to the stuff Cleo says-- not even P.O.W.'s returning from horrifying treatment in Japanese camps.

My great uncle survived the Bataan Death March, and HE would never succumb to that looniness if you locked him alone in a cell for a year with nothing but a speaker, and Cleo on the mic in another room.

Not even Cleo, him/herself is actually dangerous. Take a diazepam and mellow out. I promise you that everything is fine.

P.S. I don't know why diva would advance this "single gunman theory," but, I totally disagree.

Cleo has to be fairly bright to pull off such a convincing act (although the longevity of her commitment aids her greatly in that regard). Meanwhile, anne is stupid. While it is possible to step down your intelligence, I doubt that someone intelligent could fake being stupid in the way that she's stupid, and fake interest in the Middle East as she does. Also, it runs counter to Occam's Razor.

Bookish is also borderline stupid, but in a different way than anne. He's much more knowledgeable about some things in the Middle East and the Koran, and uses Wikipedia much more effectively then she does. His interpretation of language, however, is off. His logic is better than anne's, but he still introduces flaws which, combined with the language faults, sometimes cause him to seem totally incoherent. Other times, when he understands the language correctly, and his mind moves through logical operations without introducing gross errors, I've occasionally seen him say something coherent enough to warrant a "yes" vote, something absolutely beyond anne's reach.

He's also socially stunted. Before I had taken a personally hostile attitude toward him, he chose to be offensive to me. Recently, right after I compliment something that he says or I defend him, he attacks me.

jezzie, on the other hand, is nothing like that. Of these identities, jezzie is the only one I imagine as an human being talking. All of the rest, I imagine only as letters spelling their name (I'm an extremely visual person). She doesn't appear nearly as devoted to offending Jews as anne and Bookish (which diva might attribute to her deviousness).

Cleo is just harmlessly out of his/her mind. Bookish and Jezzie are intelligent enough to research actual news stories that could legitimately tarnish the public perception of Israel. Cleo only posts utterly crazy nonsense for laughs that isn't going to alter anyone's opinions of the Germans or Japanese in the direction of support of a lunatic unless they're already so obviously insane that they are under constant observation.

I miss Joe Ching. I suspect that he was being paid by North Korea to post on here or something... but, you get what you pay for, and North Korea is not a wealthy country. They are also pretty naive as to propaganda, so their propaganda is hilarious. When Robert Miller refers to "I smell a rat," I strongly suspect that he's referring to Joe Ching. He's an hateful, racist, revisionist propaganda organ of North Korea... but, I never laughed so hard at anything on Amazon as at him. My favorite television program of all-time is MST3K-- I just think unintentionally bad stuff is the funniest-- the more atrocious, the better. I wish that Cleo were real; but, as I said, I respect his/her dedication and commitment, anyway.

It's too bad that Cleo's madness is claiming YOUR sanity. Some of us are trying to talk you down.

Amazon already deals with legitimate threats (and some pretty absurd non-threats that their filters must read as threats). Really, everything's under control. Just close your eyes, imagine a quiet beach with no sound but the rhythm of the waves slowly washing up the sand. Breathe in deep, then slowly exhale on a three count...

Posted on May 1, 2012, 8:33:35 AM PDT
I agree with cobaltspectre that anne and cleo are not the same person. Anne has asked a number of questions that I think are honest probes at acquiring some knowledge, some useful information, some grasp of history. Cleo seems to be a bilious propagandist. (Though, as I say, I put "her" on Ignore and have read very little of what she has posted for some time.)

By the way, the people at Amazon must know who all these people are. To post here, you must be an Amazon customer. If you've never bought anything on Amazon, you can't post. And to buy something from Amazon, you must have a valid credit card, and a card that is valid in certain geographical regions. (For instance, my wife relies on my using my home credit card issued by an American bank to make her Amazon purchases. Friends of mine in Asia are unable to purchase on Amazon because they have credit cards issued in their native lands.)

And as much as I would like to know who certain posters with interesting aliases are, I admire Amazon's policy of not revealing this information. Mystery is the price we all must pay for desired privacy. But the final takeaway here is that there must be a real human being with a legitimate American, Canadian or British credit card behind Cleo (and all the other mystery irritants mentioned above).
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Discussion in:  History forum
Participants:  21
Total posts:  48
Initial post:  Apr 28, 2012
Latest post:  May 7, 2012

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