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Customer Discussions > Movie forum

List Rankings and Their Merits


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Initial post: Dec 28, 2012 11:02:56 PM PST
Last edited by the author on Dec 28, 2012 11:05:07 PM PST
Thanks to William A. Smith for suggesting this topic.

Essentially, everyone loves lists. And because of this, film institutes take the initiative to make rankings maybe once every ten years to decide on the greatest films. The two in question for this discussion to be taken seriously are Sight and Sound's Top 50 (conduced earlier this year) and AFI's Greatest American Films (in 1998 and 2007).

A paraphrased quote from Roger Ebert: lists like these cry out to be disagreed upon. There will never be any general agreement upon the greatest film. Proof clearly came about this past August, when Alfred Hitchcock's Vertigo displaced Orson Welles' Citizen Kane as the greatest film ever made in the most recent Sight and Sound poll, after the latter had held the top spot since 1962.

If anyone has any other lists in mind that they would like to discuss, feel free to bring them up. However, I would strongly suggest against discussing the IMDB Top 250 and Empire's 500 Greatest Movies of All Time because they take the votes of readers and users into account in addition to historians, filmmakers, and critics.

Might I kick things off by posting three lists. First, the most recent Sight and Sound Poll:

Vertigo (1958)
Citizen Kane (1941)
Tokyo Story (1953)
The Rules of the Game (1939)
Sunrise: A Song of Two Humans (1927)
2001: A Space Odyssey (1968)
The Searchers (1956)
Man with a Movie Camera (1929)
The Passion of Joan of Arc (1928)
8½ (1963)
Battleship Potemkin (1925)
L'Atalante (1934)
Breathless (1960)
Apocalypse Now (1979)
Late Spring (1949)
Au Hasard Balthazar (1966)
Seven Samurai (1954)
Persona (1966)
Mirror (1975)
Singin' in the Rain (1952)
L'Avventura (1960)
Contempt (1963)
The Godfather (1972)
Ordet (1955)
In the Mood for Love (2000)
Rashomon (1950)
Andrei Rublev (1966)
Mulholland Dr. (2001)
Stalker (1979)
Shoah (1985)
The Godfather Part II (1974)
Taxi Driver (1976)
Bicycle Thieves (1948)
The General (1926)
Metropolis (1927)
Psycho (1960)
Jeanne Dielman, 23 quai du Commerce, 1080 Bruxelles (1975)
Sátántangó (1994)
The 400 Blows (1959)
La Dolce Vita (1960)
Journey to Italy (1954)
Pather Panchali (1955)
Some Like It Hot (1959)
Gertrud (1964)
Pierrot le Fou (1965)
Playtime (1967)
Close-Up (1990)
The Battle of Algiers (1966)
Histoire(s) du cinéma (1988-1998)
City Lights (1931)
Ugetsu monogatari (1953)
La Jetée (1962)

Now, the AFI's Top 100 when polled in 2007:

Citizen Kane
The Godfather
Casablanca
Raging Bull
Singin' in the Rian
Gone With the Wind
Lawrence of Arabia
Schindler's List
Vertigo
The Wizard of Oz
City Lights
The Searchers
Star Wars
Psycho
2001: A Space Odyssey
Sunset Blvd.
The Graduate
The General - NEW
On the Waterfront
It's a Wonderful Life
Chinatown
Some Like It Hot
The Grapes of Wrath
E.T. The Extra Terrestrial
To Kill a Mockingbird
Mr. Smith Goes to Washington
High Noon
All About Eve
Double Indemnity
Apocalypse Now
The Maltese Falcon
The Godfather Part II
One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest
Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs
Annie Hall
The Bridge on the River Kwai
The Best Years of Our Lives
The Treasure of the Sierra Madre
Dr. Strangelove
The Sound of Music
King Kong
Bonnie and Clyde
Midnight Cowboy
The Philadelphia Story
Shane
It Happened One Night
A Streetcar Named Desire
Rear Window
Intolerance - NEW
The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring - NEW
West Side Story
Taxi Driver
The Deer Hunter
MASH
North by Northwest
Jaws
Rocky
The Gold Rush
Nashville - NEW
Duck Soup
Sullivan's Travels - NEW
American Graffiti
Cabaret - NEW
Network
The African Queen
Raiders of the Lost Ark
Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf? - NEW
Unforgiven
Tootsie
A Clockwork Orange
Saving Private Ryan - NEW
The Shawshank Redemption - NEW
Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid
The Silence of the Lambs
In the Heat of the Night - NEW
Forrest Gump
All the President's Men - NEW
Modern Times
The Wild Bunch
The Apartment
Spartacus - NEW
Sunrise - NEW
Titanic - NEW
Easy Rider
A Night at the Opera - NEW
Platoon
12 Angry Men - NEW
Bringing Up Baby
The Sixth Sense - NEW
Swing Time - NEW
Sophie's Choice - NEW
Goodfellas
The French Connection
Pulp Fiction
The Last Picture Show - NEW
Do the Right Thing - NEW
Blade Runner - NEW
Yankee Doodle Dandy
Toy Story - NEW
Ben Hur

These were removed to make room for the NEW films:

Doctor Zhivago
The Birth of a Nation
From Here to Eternity
Amadeus
All Quiet on the Western Front
The Third Man
Fantasia
Rebel Without a Cause
Stagecoach
Close Encounters of the Third Kind
The Manchurian Candidate
An American in Paris
Wuthering Heights
Dances With Wolves
Giant
Fargo
Mutiny on the Bounty
Frankenstein
Patton
The Jazz Singer
My Fair Lady
A Place in the Sun
Guess Who's Coming to Dinner

Now, discuss and debate, my droogies!

Posted on Dec 29, 2012 2:58:38 AM PST
Greg says:
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Posted on Dec 29, 2012 8:27:12 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Dec 29, 2012 8:30:55 AM PST
Cavaradossi says:
Whoa, whoa, whoa, just a gol-dash darn minute here! (BTW, thanks for the lists, Pastor.)

It strikes me as odd that Citizen Kane now loses it first place to Vertigo. Now, as unlikely as it seems, I suppose there is a possibility that a new film would come along that is so good it goes straight to the head of the pack, but a great movie like Vertigo is hardly an unknown quantity. For decades, the critics polled by Sight and Sound have listed CK as the greatest film ever made. Now, how can it be that Vertigo has suddenly displayed all sorts of new wonderfulnesses never before seen in it that it now displaces the previous champion?! It's not as if either film is even vaguely recent. One would think their rankings in a great films list wouldn't change. It must be something has changed in critics' perception and has set me wondering, for there can be nothing different in the films themselves. Something is off kilter here.

Now, as to the AFI listings, how can any of the wonderful movies in the third list above have been discarded in favor of The Sixth Sense?! Except for Swing Time, which I've never even heard of, the new movies added are often very good to great, but they've been out there and known quantities for years, sometimes decades. I agree that The Last Picture Show is a wonderful movie, but a better one than Doctor Zhivago or Amadeus? If it's that great, why wasn't it on the list years ago? Something smells here and it isn't rotting meat.

P.S. Of course, I'm very glad to see Blade Runner, one of my very favorite films, added, but were films like Fantasia, An American in Paris, Mutiny on the Bounty, etc., discarded so that it could be added? Again, we're not talking about new films here. Whatever merits Cabaret has over, say, My Fair Lady, they are not new and were not enough to get the movie on the list for years. Why now, and why throw out MFL? We could as well, for that matter, ask why the discarded films are now regarded as less than the newly added ones.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 29, 2012 8:45:03 AM PST
I'm first of all appalled that Fargo was removed to make room for Titanic. Cameron over the Coens? Seriously?

Much as I love Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs, I honestly think it's too high, but that's mostly for historical significance. I'd have easily had Fantasia stay on the list but put somewhere in the top 40.

With Kane and Vertigo, I've stated in the past that I think it has to do with the fact that more critics were polled this year as opposed to decades past. Or maybe people are so sick of Kane at the top that some removed it from their top ten. But that's just an assumption.

I'm pleased to see Nashville squeak its way onto the list. I'd have top 20'd it easily though.

Posted on Dec 29, 2012 11:10:35 AM PST
"when Alfred Hitchcock's Vertigo displaced Orson Welles' Citizen Kane..."

Well, at least it wasn't "Shadow of a Doubt."

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 29, 2012 4:44:38 PM PST
Cav,
One guess at the changing list would be that the list of those polled also changes. New directors, critics, etc being polled would see minor changes occur. Each decade, as new folk are polled to replace those who are no longer able to contribute, the minor changes will start to add up to a slow moving yet major changing of the guard. Imagine the list in 50 years time when most of the major players of today's poll are no longer alive....Vertigo and Kane may one day end up way down the list, and films like Pulp Fiction, or Shawshank Redemption may skyrocket up to the top.

I find interest in reading the lists, and even more interest in finding out who voted for what (it's always good to see the influences of favorite directors), but I still don't think any list can be seen as a definitive statement on which film is the best, second best, so on.

Posted on Dec 30, 2012 1:22:59 PM PST
Last edited by the author on Dec 30, 2012 1:23:14 PM PST
An interesting topic, and I will certainly have more to say. One thing that has been noted about the Sight and Sound poll is that, in its earlier incarnations (1952, 1962) films only a year or two old made it onto the list. I believe that the newest film on the current poll in the top ten was 2001--1968--and in the top 25 In the Mood for Love--2001.

Interesting, to say the least.

Following PoM's suggestion, I will be adding a BFI list of films one should see before the age of 14--a list which I find radically defective. Most likely tomorrow.

Posted on Dec 31, 2012 6:04:41 AM PST
stevign says:
Blood Simple - The Cohen brothers' first film starring Dan Hedaya (Cheers), (Frances McDormand (Fargo), John Getz and M. Emmet Walsh. Unfortunately most people think the Coen's first film was Fargo and haven't heard of Blood Simple, let alone seen it. I personally think it's one of their best.

"Blood Simple. is a 1984 neo-noir crime film. It was the directorial debut of Joel Coen and the first major film of cinematographer Barry Sonnenfeld, who later became a noted director. The film's title derives from the Dashiell Hammett novel Red Harvest, in which "blood simple" is a term to describe the addled, fearful mindset of people after a prolonged immersion in violent situations" - Wiki

A Simple Plan - starring Bill Paxton, Bridget Fonda, Billy Bob Thornton and Brent Briscoe (Mulholland Dr., The Dark Knight Rises). Another very underrated movie in that I don't think much of the public saw it.

"A Simple Plan is a 1999 American drama film directed by Sam Raimi, based on the novel of the same name by Scott Smith, who also wrote the screenplay of the film. It was shot in Delano, Minnesota and Ashland and Saxon, Wisconsin. Billy Bob Thornton was nominated for the Academy Award for Best Supporting Actor. Scott Smith was nominated for the Academy Award for Writing Adapted Screenplay. Several prominent critics praised the film for its complexity and taut suspense (four stars from Roger Ebert and Critic's Choice from The New York Times)." - Wiki

I would especially like to give kudos to two excellent character actors who are always a plus when seen on screen. One being M. Emmet Walsh (Blood Simple) and Brent Briscoe (A Simple Plan).

http://www.hollywoodactorprep.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/walsh-1.jpg

http://www.wearysloth.com/Gallery/ActorsB/34611-24647.gif

Posted on Dec 31, 2012 6:36:27 AM PST
Cavaradossi says:
stevign

I agree, Blood Simple is an absolute must for Coen Brothers fans. I can't remember if I saw A Simple Plan, but that cast combination has a familiar ring to it.

Posted on Dec 31, 2012 8:00:07 AM PST
Sloan: You are, I think, quite right in saying that arguing whether Citizen Kane is a better film than Vertigo, or vice versa, is a self-defeating activity. In my view, both are fair candidates for best film ever made--along with a short list of others.

I think that it's perhaps more interesting to group films in broader categories, perhaps starting at the top with Beyond Criticism, and moving down from there. Far more interesting than the AFI overall best 100, which is a deeply flawed list, is the AFI ten best films in ten genres. Still flawed--but a more reasonable comparison.

I'm still working on a breakdown of the BFI list. The more I think about it, the more appalled I am.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 31, 2012 8:28:25 AM PST
Mike Gordan says:
WAS: Just copied and pasted the BFI list. Hopefully, this will be a helpful analysis for those who are curious:

The British Film Institute provides only an alphabetical listing of the top ten recommended movies:

Bicycle Thieves (1948)
E.T. the Extra-Terrestrial (1982)
Kes (1969)
The Night of the Hunter (1955)
The 400 Blows (1959)
Show Me Love (1998)
Spirited Away (2001)
Toy Story (1995)
Where is the Friend's Home? (1987)
The Wizard of Oz (1939)

The following 40 in alphabetical order:

A Day at the Races (1937)
The Adventures of Robin Hood (1938)
Au revoir les enfants (1987)
Back to the Future (1985)
Beauty and the Beast (1946)
Beauty and the Beast (1991)
Billy Elliot (2000)
Edward Scissorhands (1990)
Finding Nemo (2003)
It's a Wonderful Life (1946)
Jason and the Argonauts (1963)
The Kid (1921)
King Kong (1933)
Kirikou and the Sorceress (1998)
Monsieur Hulot's Holiday (1953)
My Life as a Dog (1985)
My Neighbor Totoro (1988)
Oliver Twist (1948)
The Outsiders (1983)
Pather Panchali (1955)
Play Time (1967)
The Princess Bride (1987)
Rabbit-Proof Fence (2002)
Raiders of the Lost Ark (1981)
The Railway Children (1970)
The Red Balloon (1956)
Romeo + Juliet (1996)
The Secret Garden (1993)
Singin' in the Rain (1952)
Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs (1937)
Some Like It Hot (1959)
The Spirit of the Beehive (1973)
Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope (1977)
To Be and to Have (2002)
To Kill a Mockingbird (1962)
A Trip to the Moon (1902)
Walkabout (1971)
Whale Rider (2002)
Whistle Down the Wind (1961)
The White Balloon (1995)

And based on the above list for children, a quick glance shows that at least 20 of these films are absolutely atrocious.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 31, 2012 8:39:19 AM PST
Gordo: Would you be so kind as to enlighten us on those twenty?

Posted on Dec 31, 2012 9:22:45 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Dec 31, 2012 9:29:35 AM PST
Gordo: Let's break down the list a bit. First of all--let's ask, what is the underlying purpose of this list? Is it to educate the young on the range, vocabulary, and styles of cinema? Or is it more like a Victorian list of Improving Books--with a modern twist? I fear that it is far more the latter, than the former. Let me be completely upfront about one bias as well--it is critical to introduce the young to the best, even if it is about their grade level. One does not develop a mature palate feeding on pablum. There is furthermore the question of age--there is a great deal of difference between what is appropriate for a 6 year old, an 8 year old, a 10 year old, and a 12 to 14 year old.

I spent a bit of time and organized it into groups. The first consists of what I would call classics and near classics--in general, not inappropriate for beginning the cinematic education of the young. That is not to say that all of the choices are good.

* The Wizard of Oz (1939)
* The Adventures of Robin Hood (1938)
* Beauty and the Beast (1946)
* King Kong (1933)
* Oliver Twist (1948) (crossref: miseries of childhood)
* Singin' in the Rain (1952)
* Some Like It Hot (1959)
* Jason and the Argonauts (1963)
* Raiders of the Lost Ark (1981)
* A Day at the Races (1937)
* Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope (1977)
* A Trip to the Moon (1902)
* Edward Scissorhands (1990)
* Back to the Future (1985)

14 out of 50. A few comments--first, it's not inappropriate to select a Marx brothers film, but A Night At the Opera is a far better choice. The Melies Trip To The Moon is charming, but would certainly not be my choice for an introduction to silent film along with the dreadful The Kid. Add in, perhaps, Harold Lloyd in The Freshman, and either Fritz Lang's Spionen or Metropolis. This category needs to be bulked out with some genuine classics as well--Citizen Kane, some Hitchcock (North by Northwest is a good choice), some screwball comedy, perhaps the lovely Pride and Prejudice with Olivier and Greer. Not a bad thing to have a Dickens by David Lean--but change it to the far more substancial Great Expectations. I honestly can't say that I consider King Kong an essential. It's not my task here to develop an alternate list--but this category should be more like 40 or more out of 50.

Animation--not my favorite category by any means. 7 out of 50, and mostly dispensable as must-sees.

* Spirited Away (2001)
* Toy Story (1995)
* Finding Nemo (2003)
* Kirikou and the Sorceress (1998) (crossref: PC)
* Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs (1937)
* Beauty and the Beast (1991)
* My Neighbor Totoro (1988)

The only film in this category I like at all is Toy Story. If you are putting in Disney, where is the best--Sleeping Beauty and Fantasia? Where is Chuck Jones? A must-add is The Adventures of Price Achmed. It is a given that kids will be inundated with junk in this category, and so one needs to counterbalance it with better material if one is making a must-see list.

The largest category (17 of 50, and larger with cross references)--what I am calling The Miseries of Childhood (with apologies to Edward Gorey). Full of second-rate films with allegedly improving themes. Because a film is about childhood, it does not follow that it is essential viewing for children--particularly films like Bicycle Thief, The Spirit of the Beehive, and The 400 Blows. I admire the last two, but any of them require a more mature judgment than you will get in someone under 14 years of age. Too much improvement; too depressing, by and large.

* Bicycle Thieves (1948)
* Kes (1969)
* Au revoir les enfants (1987)
* Billy Elliot (2000)
* The Kid (1921)
* My Life as a Dog (1985)
* Rabbit-Proof Fence (2002)
* The Railway Children (1970)
* The Spirit of the Beehive (1973)
* To Be and to Have (2002)
* Walkabout (1971)
* The White Balloon (1995)
* Whistle Down the Wind (1961) )crossref: PC brigate)
* The Secret Garden (1993)
* The Outsiders (1983)
* Pather Panchali (1955) (croffref: PC brigade)
* The 400 Blows (1959)

I might add, peculiarly English choices, some of them--Kes, Railway Children, Whistle Down The Wind. Frankly, there are not more than one or two that I would retain in this depressing lineup--not that there are not a few good films here.

We now move into several categories that are simply bizarre. There is a strong strain of political correctness here--two Iranian films? African folk tales? The only Japanese films the dreadful animations of Miyazaki? There are four that seem to be included primarily on PC grounds:

* Show Me Love (1998)
* Where is the Friend's Home? (1987) (crossref: miseries of childhood)
* Whale Rider (2002)
* To Kill a Mockingbird (1962) (crossref: miseries of childhood)

The only contemporary love story on the list is a teen lesbian romance--Show Me Love? (The original title cannot be displayed in the chaste confines of Amazon.) I think, too, that To Kill A Mockingbird is a hugely overrated film, but can countenance it as optional.

Four films are just plain overrated. I am no fan of Tati--if one must introduce that sort of material, find one of Chaplin's better films, or better yet, Keaton or Lloyd. The other two go without saying.

* E.T. the Extra-Terrestrial (1982)
* Play Time (1967)
* It's a Wonderful Life (1946)
* Monsieur Hulot's Holiday (1953)

Two more just fall into the category of what were they thinking????????

* Romeo + Juliet (1996)
* The Night of the Hunter (1955) (crossref: PC brigade)

Bastardized Shakespeare? Worse yet, bastardized Shakespeare on a play that is misinterpreted as the model of True Love--not a myth into which one want the young to fall? Far better either the Polanski or Welles Macbeth (coupled with Throne of Blood to get some Kurosawa in), the Diana Rigg Midsummer Night's Dream, or the Branagh Much Ado. Night of the Hunter is a good film--but essential childhood viewing? The only rationale I can see is hostility to organized religion--effectively, a subtext in Whistle Down the Wind as well. It would be good to include a film or two with a positive view of religion--at least The Ten Commandments.

Finally, two that are simply meh. I don't like them, but I can't object too strenuously. They certainly wound not be on a list I would prepare.

* The Princess Bride (1987)
* The Red Balloon (1956)

Overall reaction--what on earth are these people thinking? What a dreary lot they must be. To answer PoM's question, more than half of these films are not good choices for the intended audience--and, without detailed enumeration, at least 20 of them are pretty dire.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 31, 2012 9:48:46 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Dec 31, 2012 9:50:49 AM PST
WAS: I will not quibble about Beauty and the Beast, but Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs is perhaps a must, if for mostly historical and influential reasons. Toy Story is a given. As for Chuck Jones, again, like with the AFI, I think they had absurd rules about length requirements.

For Shakespeare, I'd nominate the Kevin Kline Midsummer (the Branagh Much Ado is certainly a worthy choice). I've hated Luhrmann's R&J for many years.

We agree on North by Northwest of course, but I must question Citizen Kane in this respect: is it one for those under 14? I am one of the last people to question its significance and greatness, but I watched it again and reviewed it just a few months ago, and I have a small hunch that children under 14 would be fidgeting quite often.

For Keaton, without having seen The General yet, I'd nominate Seven Chances (maybe Sherlock Jr.).

I know that the list was made long before 2011, but if any changes were to be made, I'd suggest Hugo by Martin Scorsese.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 31, 2012 9:50:43 AM PST
Mike Gordan says:
PoM: Here's my complete list of preferences (starting with your requested list of atrocities):

1. E.T.
2. Show Me Love
3. Where is the Friend's Home?
4. The Wizard of Oz
5. Billy Elliot
6. Finding Nemo
7. The Kid
8. Kirikou the Sorceress
9. My Life as a Dog
10.My Neighbor Totoro (very weird and very childish; seems to be the defining traits of Miyazaki)
11.Rabbit-Proof Fence
12.The Railway Children
13.Romeo + Juliet (why is this in a modern setting?)
14.The Secret Garden
15.Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs
16.To Be and to Have
17.Walkabout
18.Whale Rider
19.Whistle Down the Wind
20.The White Balloon

Borderline:

1. It's a Wonderful Life (okay, but Capra should never be a child's introduction to Black and White Films; I'd first select the likes of Beauty and the Beast, Great Expectations, Casablanca, and a few of Hitchcock's easier-to-watch movies and then go from there)

2. To Kill a Mockingbird (the first time I saw this film was in High School, and frankly, if a child's to watch it, they should wait to watch it until after they turned 15 or 16 when their tastes in films have become refined)

And in both cases, they hang by a thread on my respective top 10 of their respective years (both at number 10), and wouldn't have a place on my list if I were to catch up on films in 1946 and 1962.

The rest of the list ranges from pretty good (The Princess Bride; The Outsiders) to excellent (Back to the Future; Singin' in the Rain; The Adventures of Robin Hood; both versions of Beauty and the Beast). However, I'd probably--once again--hold off on Robin Hood until they are given a better understanding of political and economical corruption.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 31, 2012 9:53:41 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Dec 31, 2012 9:55:16 AM PST
Gordo: Well I'm certainly glad that three of my five favorite films (Star Wars, Singin' in the Rain, and Raiders of the Lost Ark) made the list.

Wait a minute, The Outsiders made the list? Wow. I remember when I loved that movie years ago. I still like it, but really? Should people be introduced to Coppola through that film?

I'd say hold off from him until teenage years, and then start with Apocalypse Now.

See above about Snow White.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 31, 2012 9:57:27 AM PST
Mike Gordan says:
PoM: Young kids are not going to be watching Snow White and gain a better understanding of film or morality just by analyzing it's historical and influential significance. I might, however, show it to my kids when they're older just to help calibrate their tastes (every now and then, when the time is right, one must be exposed to bad cinema just to gain a better understanding of it).

If kids fidget over Citizen Kane, it's probably because they're brains have already melted after being exposed to all the Madagascars, Finding Nemos and Smurf movies that plagued our culture. I would, however, show them Rashomon first just to introduce them to that sort of narrative.

Definitely introduce your kids to Hugo--and immediately after that, the work of Melies. Heck, I gave my nieces Hugo for Christmas this year, and I hope to watch it with them sometime this week.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 31, 2012 10:00:27 AM PST
Mike Gordan says:
PoM: The Outsiders is spared as a pretty good film. Not Coppola's best, and I wouldn't necessarily call it essential viewing. Singin' in the Rain and the Star Wars and Indiana Jones films are most definitely essential viewing. The scene with the Ark of the Covenant may very well be the greatest interactive fourth-wall breaking effect ever invented in a feature film (I remember keeping my eyes shut as a kid after Indy told Marian--and by extention, the audience--to do so).

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 31, 2012 10:01:28 AM PST
Gordo: Hugo is a rare and uncharacteristic gem from a great director. I'd call it his third best, only behind Raging Bull and Goodfellas, which are not suited for children of this age.

Replace a few of those repulsive animations with the follies of Chris Farley and Adam Sandler. Finding Nemo, however much I dislike it, has an extraordinarily beautiful design, almost on the level of The Lion King.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 31, 2012 10:03:42 AM PST
Gordo: I'm not denying that The Outsiders is good. It used to be one of my favorite fiction books. But starting on Coppola with that film is just, well, weird.

Of course Spielberg is going to get a few mentions, but I'd replace E.T. with Jaws. Kids need to be scared at some point, after all. Raiders is a perfect choice.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 31, 2012 10:10:20 AM PST
Mike Gordan says:
PoM: The only animateds that I'd consider adding are Fantasia, Pinocchio, Adventures of Prince Achmed, The Lion King, the first two Shrek films, Sleeping Beauty, The Incredibles, How to Train Your Dragon, and Secret of NIMH. If eligible, I'd also include the works of Chuck Jones and The Dark Crystal (it's probably eligible, but it's arguably not an animated movie). And I'm also quite fond of The Adventures of Mark Twain.

And at some point in their lives, every child should be exposed in some way, shape or form, to Pokemon. If not in the games (certainly a must in my book), then in the highlights of the anime...but nowhere past the overlong Johto saga. But that's offtopic...my little bias got the best of me here.... :)

The best of Chris Farley and Adam Sandler? For Farley, I'd go to his work on Saturday Night Live. For Sandler, one has to go to the memorizing Punch-Drunk Love. And I'd hold off on showing these to my kids at least until they're in High School.

In reply to an earlier post on Dec 31, 2012 10:15:10 AM PST
Last edited by the author on Dec 31, 2012 10:25:11 AM PST
Gordo: Pokemon? Come now. The only appealing thing about that franchise was the Game Boy when I used to play it years ago.

I'd limit myself to no more than 10 animations. If there are to be no Chuck Jones, then here goes:

Fantasia
Pinocchio
Beauty and the Beast
Toy Story
The Lion King
Snow White
Sleeping Beauty
The Incredibles
Spirited Away

I'm having trouble coming up with a tenth that isn't Chuck Jones.

You know how I dislike Shrek. I still haven't seen Prince Achmed (so angry at myself for that), How To Train Your Dragon, or Secret of NIMH. I think the latter is available for streaming Netflix, so I might watch it sometime soon.

I'm of course extremely surprised that Mary Poppins isn't on the list.

Posted on Dec 31, 2012 10:21:26 AM PST
I'd suggest spending only a little more time on this particular list, and then moving over to AFI Top 100.

Posted on Dec 31, 2012 10:22:04 AM PST
Cavaradossi says:
Personally, I'd withhold Some Like It Hot from children under 16. However, with kids today, who knows?

Posted on Dec 31, 2012 10:32:41 AM PST
Now another question: what Bond picture, if any, would be on the list?

I'd suggest my personal favorite: Goldfinger.
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