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The Collapse of Complex Societies (New Studies in Archaeology) Reprint Edition
Purchase options and add-ons
- ISBN-10052138673X
- ISBN-13978-0521386739
- EditionReprint
- PublisherCambridge University Press
- Publication dateMarch 30, 1990
- LanguageEnglish
- Dimensions6.69 x 0.6 x 9.61 inches
- Print length264 pages
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Customers find the book provides good information and a detailed treatment of the subject. They find it engaging and challenging, with an attention-grabbing narrative. However, some readers feel the book lacks depth in its discussion of complex societies.
AI-generated from the text of customer reviews
Customers find the book provides good information on the subject. They say it's well-researched, detailed, and a seminal work on the subject. Readers appreciate the logical analysis of why and how complex societies collapse. The theory is believable and is an absolute must-read for social science and economics students. The ideas are important to those outside the profession, and their significance is only increasing as we reflect more on the topic.
"...his points generally in short, declarative sentences that are easy to follow...." Read more
"I loved the scope and detail of the vast number of civilizations studied in this thought provoking analysis of societal collapse...." Read more
"...Economics helps explain complexity. Screw drivers exist because hammers weren't enough. Power drills were eventually developed and so on...." Read more
"...Tainter builds a case that complexity has benefits, but that there is a marginal rate of return that diminishes with ever increasing complexity to..." Read more
Customers find the book engaging and challenging. They describe it as a good read that grabs their attention. The author is described as an unusually good writer who casts his points generally in short sentences. Readers praise the book as excellent, engaging, and well worth the effort.
"...might one day lead to the demise of our own world, this book really grabs your attention once you begin to suspect he may know what he's talking..." Read more
"...As others have noted it is not an easy read in spots but well worth the effort...." Read more
"...I found the book to be scholarly, engaging, and still quite readable. (It's only 200 pages!)..." Read more
"...Heartily recommended. One of the most important books you will read." Read more
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Top reviews from the United States
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- Reviewed in the United States on January 16, 2014This is an interesting book. First published in the late 80's, it warrants renewed attention nowadays in light of all the end-of-the world hysterias currently emanating from concerns over economic turmoil, religious strife, nuclear terrorism, viral epidemics, and climate change. Even if most of us don't believe the worst is yet upon us, it's hard not to worry with so many books and movies out there depicting post-industrial societies where humans are left with their animal needs and violent proclivities, but none of the protections afforded by modern civilization.
Joseph Tainter, though, is no hysteric. He's a buttoned-down scholar without any apparent pre-conceived agenda and certainly no intent to sensationalize. He's actually a little boring, and casual readers expecting lurid thrills from this book are likely to put it down after the first few pages. Like other students of history over the years, he seems haunted by the fact that so many of the world's once-vibrant civilizations have vanished for no obvious reason. The tasks he's taken on to himself here are to (a) catalogue the major lost civilizations (b)summarize known facts surrounding their rise and fall (c) distill the academic literature regarding the causes of societal collapse down to a handful common theories, and (d) establish the framework for his own general theory. Since it's obvious from the start of the book that he's ultimately looking forward into dynamics that might one day lead to the demise of our own world, this book really grabs your attention once you begin to suspect he may know what he's talking about.
Tainter starts with a brief survey of eighteen vanished civilizations around the world which provide the substance for his study. His professional discipline is archeology, and several of his societies are ones, like the Minoans and the Chacoans, about which archeology tells us everything we know, since they left no written records. For others, like the ancient Romans and China's Western Chou Empire, he intrudes onto historians' turf because the written record provides a key part of the story. In fact, his most comprehensive and interesting discussion is of the Romans. I got the impression that he may have developed his animating insights for this book through his study of Rome, since he manner in which he imposes them on the sketchier cases sounds a bit vague to me in places.
Tainter is obviously not the first researcher to become fascinated by societal collapse. The phenomenon has spawned a whole genre of literature and a host of causal theories. He summarizes them all for us and groups them into eleven broad categories, including resource depletion, natural catastrophe, invasion, social dysfunction, random concatenation of events, and so forth. He points out that none of these are mutually exclusive and that all have something to offer. In the end, however, he pronounces the existing literature inadequate to the task of explaining how and why thriving civilizations eventually disappear. Hence the motivation for his study.
He does point to economic theories, one of the eleven groups, as the one probably richest in explanatory possibilities. And with that observation he lays the groundwork for his own theory, which is based in economics but is capable of subsuming elements associated with the other frameworks. In getting to his subject, Tainter generally avoids the term 'civilization'. He prefers instead the more precise phrase 'complex society', by which he means a social system entailing elaborate division of labor and supporting management hierarchies, government and a robust military. He refers to resources devoted to these functions as the society's "investment in complexity". He then explains the "rise" of a society as the period during which investment in complexity is growing and people are enjoying returns on it in the form of growing wealth, culture and security. Or at least enough people are enjoying these things that social and political stability prevail. Golden ages then can be seen as sweet spots in history during which the benefits from complexity are growing and incentivising more investment in it, triggering virtuous circles. However, such a dynamic is inherently self-limiting and eventually self-destructive.
Two phrases which Tainter borrows from economics are "marginal cost" and "marginal return". Eventually, the marginal returns from investment in complexity - meaning the returns currently available - inevitably level off and then decline, while the marginal costs stay the same or even increase. The only way central authorities can so on supporting such costs is through taxation or currency debasement, unsustainable measures in a system where benefits are perceived as declining. A system so weakened becomes vulnerable to popular revolt or invasion, or lacks the will and resources to overcome other disasters. Tainter describes, for example, how the "barbarians" who eventually overran the Roman Empire were in many cases welcomed and even assisted by the Empire's population, who increasingly saw themselves as benefitting little from Rome's "complexity", even as Rome's tax collectors became more predatory than ever.
Like the good scholar he is, Tainter is cautious in his approach to his subject and modest in the claims he makes for his conclusions. His theory is rather fatalistic and seems to regard a society's collapse as pre-determined by its rise. He is an unusually good writer and casts his points generally in short, declarative sentences that are easy to follow. His ideas, however, are not so simple, and require careful study to absorb fully. The book is short - only 216 pages - but it took me a long time to finish. I found it well worth the effort, and recommend it to others interested in this subject matter.
- Reviewed in the United States on March 20, 2020I loved the scope and detail of the vast number of civilizations studied in this thought provoking analysis of societal collapse. As others have noted it is not an easy read in spots but well worth the effort.
In searching for a universal cause for collapse the author logically builds his case that the "Law Of Diminishing Returns" is the root cause of collapse since this law grows more and more impactful as societies increase in complexity to support growing populations. Eventually this cost burden becomes so great and the returns so small that the society collapses. I totally agree with the case he makes that as civilizations are driven toward ever more complexity to support an ever growing population the law of diminishing returns rears its ugly head ever more higher. Even maintenance of existing infrastructure eventually succumbs to this law.
However, where I feel the author is mistaken is when he casually applies this law to science which dooms a society from developing efficient solutions to serious problems. The reality is that science has always uncovered the secrets of nature slowly. Unfortunately science is knowledge based and has always been built gradually upon previous knowledge developed by many others over long periods of time. A wise society realizes that scientific research can put to practical use fundamental scientific knowledge but development of this knowledge has always relied upon long periods of scientific development to provide the basis of new technology. This is why basic science is generally not profitable for a business. It generally resides in universities/governments and the minds of those fascinated with nature. Understanding of the atomic/subatomic world came slowly over the ages but once the knowledge developed the applications came swiftly. So it is with biology. The steam engine could not have been developed without the knowledge developed by physics over many generation. When the basic knowledge is not developed throwing more money at a problem is a waste. Don't confuse technological development with science. Without the science the technology cannot happen.
Top reviews from other countries
BobachoReviewed in Germany on December 10, 20235.0 out of 5 stars Amazing book
This book is a life changer. The low of diminishing returns is explained by lot of examples. The gloomy end is striking.
Seshu kumarReviewed in India on July 30, 20204.0 out of 5 stars A decent study
I do not think it answers all questions, especially why don’t complex societies just decrease their complexities? But it does show that constantly searching for big govt programs will lead to disaster
MatthewReviewed in Australia on June 18, 20205.0 out of 5 stars Important book
I really like this book. It gives a good causal explanation of how a society could colaps. He defines his terms well
M & M GiacominiReviewed in Italy on May 31, 20145.0 out of 5 stars Essential!
According to the second principle of thermodynamics, the level of energy of a system tends to equilibrium.
Should you wish to maintain a higher level of energy (or complexity) you'd need to use more energy; the higher the complexity of the system, the more energy you'll need to use.
Now, substitute system with society, energy with resources (both human and natural) and complexity with technical progress, laws and regulation, and you'll see why our too-complex society is doomed to failure.
The author analyzes many historical examples of complex societies of the past, foremost of all the Roman Empire, and the reasons why they collapsed under the weight of their own complexity and reverted to a simpler, slenderer society.
Are we doomed for a new Middle Ages? Read on and find out.
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Pierre BECKReviewed in France on March 13, 20135.0 out of 5 stars Ce n'est pas de la science-fiction !
On peut entrevoir l'avenir en examinant comment les sociétés du passé se sont complexifiées au point d'arriver à des situations ingérables à leur échelle. La nôtre est beaucoup plus exigeante en énergie, elle est dopée par les énergies fossiles...pour quelques décennies encore. A suivre sur "Les limites de la croissance dans un mon de fini"...


